Help me choose a bit!

[YellowPonyEventer]

Alright without getting into all the various bits I’ve tried already, for those of you with experience with a horse with big tongue/low palate, who likes to nervously CHOMP on the bit, what have you found makes the horse happiest? (Must be USEA dressage legal bit)

And to give some quick background, I’ve already ruled out pain, saddle fits, teeth are floated regularly etc. Personally I think the chomping is just a stress/hard work response since she does it only when asked to do more difficult work like lateral, lifting her back and engaging her hind quarters etc. but while we work to strengthen her and make those easier for her to do, I also want to find the bit she’s happiest in too.

[HereComesZach]

For me, the key was two things: It needed to be very thin, and it needed to not move around a lot in his mouth. I actually tend to switch his bit around based on how he’s going and what we’ll be working on, but but it’s almost always between a D-ring lozenge, a baucher lozenge, or a d ring mullen mouth. I also like a leather bit, but I don’t believe those are dressage legal (someone please correct me if I’m wrong…)

The D ring and baucher help because it holds the bit nice and steady in their mouth. The thin (under 14mm or less) mouthpiece helps, because then they can close their mouth around it. The double-jointed lozenge or a flexible mullen mouth helps because it conforms to the shape of their pallet easily.

Brand-wise, I’ve had good luck with neue schule. Not sure if it’s the shape/metal/weight, or what, but all the busy-mouthed horses I’ve tried them with have shown at least a little improvement (and some a lot.)

[Foxtail]

I second the Baucher, but I also love Baucher bits in general. Maybe you could try a full cheek with keepers if you can’t find a suitable Baucher. Definitely go with a double jointed bit for a low palate. Although, you may get results with a mullen mouth, honestly. However, I’ve said this on several other threads, the curve of your standard mullen mouth may not be ergonomic enough for your horse, and may need some work with a hammer and anvil to get it into a proper shape for his mouth.

[ake987]

[QUOTE=HereComesZach;8949402]
For me, the key was two things: It needed to be very thin, and it needed to not move around a lot in his mouth. I actually tend to switch his bit around based on how he’s going and what we’ll be working on, but but it’s almost always between a D-ring lozenge, a baucher lozenge, or a d ring mullen mouth. I also like a leather bit, but I don’t believe those are dressage legal (someone please correct me if I’m wrong…)

The D ring and baucher help because it holds the bit nice and steady in their mouth. The thin (under 14mm or less) mouthpiece helps, because then they can close their mouth around it. The double-jointed lozenge or a flexible mullen mouth helps because it conforms to the shape of their pallet easily.

Brand-wise, I’ve had good luck with neue schule. Not sure if it’s the shape/metal/weight, or what, but all the busy-mouthed horses I’ve tried them with have shown at least a little improvement (and some a lot.)[/QUOTE]

Yep. I’ve been loving this Neue Schule bit for my horse with a small mouth and low palate (it’s 16mm but I find it to be plenty thin).

[YellowPonyEventer]

Thanks everyone! Had the dentist out today to do her teeth and she confirmed what I had figured…the mare has a huge tongue and a very low palate with lots of pronounced ridges. No wonder it’s so hard to find a bit she loves LOL also explains why she prefers the thinner bits and the double jointed. I just ordered a Myler, one of the level 2 dressage legal bits, their comfort snaffle with a low port for tongue relief. I’ll have to let you know how that one goes!

Her current bit is a baucher with French link and it works better than my other bits but still doesn’t eliminate the chomping. I also have a loose ring with lozenge that she likes ok but again doesn’t stop the chomping. Interested to see how the Myler does!

One of my friends loves the Nathe bits…anyone have experience with those?

[ake987]

I actually like the Herm Sprenger Duo a little better than the Nathe (I have both) as the HS is thinner than the Nathe. My horse loves that bit as well.

[HereComesZach]

[QUOTE=ake987;8949641]
I actually like the Herm Sprenger Duo a little better than the Nathe (I have both) as the HS is thinner than the Nathe. My horse loves that bit as well.[/QUOTE]

Yes, my fussy horse strongly prefers the Duo as well, I think for that reason, too.

[Equisis]

I have had good experiences with the nathe, but it depends on what kind of “busy” your horse is. I find it to work best on the types that want to try to spit the bit out, and are reluctant to take contact.

I have a horse with a busy mouth- not a chomper but very mouthy. He really appreciates stability and goes in a Micklem with a Myler level 1 baucher for dressage. The Micklem adds quite a bit of stability, and the bit offers relief for his tongue and bars. I think the flexibility of the Myler- with both sides of the bit moving quite independently- keeps him from feeling the need to rearrange the bit himself.

[leheath]

[QUOTE=HereComesZach;8949402]
… I also like a leather bit, but I don’t believe those are dressage legal (someone please correct me if I’m wrong…) [/QUOTE]

Actually, leather bits are legal for USEA dressage, either jointed or unjointed.

[leheath]

[QUOTE=YellowPonyEventer;8949593]
Thanks everyone! Had the dentist out today to do her teeth and she confirmed what I had figured…the mare has a huge tongue and a very low palate with lots of pronounced ridges. No wonder it’s so hard to find a bit she loves LOL also explains why she prefers the thinner bits and the double jointed. I just ordered a Myler, one of the level 2 dressage legal bits, their comfort snaffle with a low port for tongue relief. I’ll have to let you know how that one goes!

Her current bit is a baucher with French link and it works better than my other bits but still doesn’t eliminate the chomping. I also have a loose ring with lozenge that she likes ok but again doesn’t stop the chomping. Interested to see how the Myler does!

One of my friends loves the Nathe bits…anyone have experience with those?[/QUOTE]

You might want to check that the bit your ordered is legal. The “dressage legal” bits are usually USDF legal, not necessarily USEA Dressage legal. I had a similar issue with my mare. The low port for tongue relief I believe makes it illegal for USEA Dressage (but fine for USDF dressage) - there are no low port bits pictured in Appendix 4 (Permitted Snaffles for Dressage) of the rules. The level 1 Myler comfort snaffle are USEA Dressage legal and that is what I use for my mare with similar mouth confirmation. I also use the Micklem bridle, which she definitely prefers too.

[YellowPonyEventer]

[QUOTE=leheath;8949869]
You might want to check that the bit your ordered is legal. The “dressage legal” bits are usually USDF legal, not necessarily USEA Dressage legal. I had a similar issue with my mare. The low port for tongue relief I believe makes it illegal for USEA Dressage (but fine for USDF dressage) - there are no low port bits pictured in Appendix 4 (Permitted Snaffles for Dressage) of the rules. The level 1 Myler comfort snaffle are USEA Dressage legal and that is what I use for my mare with similar mouth confirmation. I also use the Micklem bridle, which she definitely prefers too.[/QUOTE]

I actually sent the link to the bit I was buying to my trainer and her partner to check first. They’re both Eventers and dressage judges and one has been a judge and TD at horse trials so I’m pretty confident that the level 2 comfort snaffle I ordered will be USEA legal thankfully. But yes I had to ask them because I didn’t see it pictured in the USEA rule book like it is in USDF.

And I use a Micklem bridle too. Never really noticed a difference in her with Micklem vs a figure 8 though so not sure how much it does for my mare in particular.

[leheath]

Well that is interesting! I really wanted to try the level 2 with the low port but since the rules clearly didn’t show that as an option, I went with the level 1 (no port). I thought it was weird that USDF allowed a bit that wasn’t allowed in USEA dressage, but there have been some weird rule changes recently, so figured that was one of them. There was even an entire thread on this subject earlier this year where everyone made it clear that the low port comfort snaffles were not OK for USEA dressage (http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?487493-Is-there-ANY-eventing-dressage-legal-bit-with-substantial-tongue-relief)

What is also interesting is that the FEI eventing dressage rules are very clear on this topic. They actually just approved several level 2 low port snaffles this year along with a variety of new bridles (including the PS of Sweden High Jump bridle I want!). However, it is unclear if/when the USEA rules mirror the FEI rules - in some respects they definitely don’t as the FEI eventing rules clearly state you cannot use leather bits, while the USEA eventing dressage rules clearly state you can. I wish this issue was much clearer and less confusing with different, but related organizations having different, but similar, rules!

[YellowPonyEventer]

I thought the same, that it was allowed in USDF but wasn’t allowed in USEA, but since she’s been a judge a long time and a TD I figured she would know if anyone would! I think it’s worth a message to the USEA though just in case! They definitely aren’t very clear about it in the rules if it is permitted, that’s for sure!

[asterix]

I have a chomper. He has really gone better in his HS Duo.
I also had a big tongue/low palate horse. He very much preferred a thin bit. I used a HS loose ring bridoon from a friend’s double bridle. It was very thin.

[Bogie]

I had a horse with the same issue. He went best in a mullen mouth or a baucher.

[JoannaHCR]

Another vote for the Neue Schule Verdibend mouthpiece. My mare has been a chomper her whole life, the sort that makes you questions just cranking the flash (I never did, but I have never been so tempted either!), just got her a Neue Schule Universal verdibend on a whim, saw it on eBay… the chomping just stopped. Full halt. I’ve only ridden her in it a few times as she’s pretty pregnant at this point, but I won’t be riding her in anything else. The difference is insane.

[fordtraktor]

I have a chomper. I usually try them in a mullen mouth because that is often very successful with mouthy horses. I like the HS Duo. But this horse doesn’t go well in one of those…he likes a single-joint eggbutt HS Novocontact. the eggbutt makes it less mobile as does the single joint, and it conforms well to his mouth.

I have ridden him in that Myler mouthpiece in a combo bit (with the nosepiece too) – it is what I use when he’s really up and fresh. He actually loves that but I didn’t think it was legal so I haven’t tried that on the flat. I might have to try that eventually if it is dressage legal.

Mine actually does best in a quite loose noseband and no flash, he gets worse if you close his mouth. You can also try a Micklem (I did) but borrow one first. This horse also doesn’t like it but I have another fairly mouthy horse who thinks the Micklem is the bees knees.

[Willesdon]

Not a bit suggestion but very interesting research on bit pressure

http://nsbits.com/ppguide/

[YellowPonyEventer]

I saw this before! It’s pretty neat! And it was interesting that they found the baucher to elicit no poll pressure at all - in fact, it offered poll relief according to their testing!

[fordtraktor]

Yes, a lot of people insist bauchers do poll pressure but they don’t at all. The geometry simply isn’t there. What they do is stabilize the bit in the mouth very well, and some horses really like that and do a LOT better in it. My old jumper went in a happy mouth baucher most of the time and was MUCH happier in it. it felt “stronger” because he was comfortable and it provided more effective communication.