Help me understand saddle fitting/reflocking

[CHT]

I get how to tell if a saddle is likely fitting ok, and how to tell if a saddle doesn’t fit, but reflocking/adjusting for saddle fit confuses me.

Right now I am working with a saddle fitter to get Dani’s close contact saddle fitting better. It fit fine for a couple months, but she keeps getting wider at the top of her shoulders, and no sign of withers.

The tree angles seem correct, and the saddle doesn’t bridge, but when I am done riding there is obviously friction at the top of her shoulders, and the saddle still tends to slide forward a tad.

Saddle fitter started by replacing the flocking along the front with a softer wool, and not stuffing it as full. This resulted in the front of the saddle sitting lower than it should (although still a tonne of clearance). Saddle still slid a bit forward, and still could see friction on the top of her shoulders.

So then they tried putting more flocking at the back to level the saddle. This made sense to me, but it failed horribly. Saddle moved WAY more forward and horse was VERY pissy at the canter.

Now he is going to try taking out even more flocking from the front, returning the back to how it was, and having me ride in it for a while to allow everything to settle.

The tack store owner (who was also there and is a saddle fitter, but the person doing the actual work), thought part of the issue was how forward the flaps are. She wondered also if I need point billets, but I am thinking that would cause even more pressure on her shoulders?

Meanwhile horse is fine in her Arabian tree western saddle, but as the bars don’t go very far down at all, there isn’t much keeping the saddle centered…which is a pain sometimes on a green horse!

I just wish I understood the concepts of saddle reflocking/fitting better to better know how to help this saddle fit…and also what to look for when I eventually shop for a dressage saddle. This is just one oddly built horse.

[SnicklefritzG]

Re: point billets - they work really well on some horses and not so well on others.

My dressage saddle is a monoflap with point billets. It worked well for the first year, but not so much anymore. When it is reflocked correctly it works well enough, but the problem is that there is enough pressure in the front to make the flocking compress very quickly. That throws the balance of the saddle off to the point that it rocks side to side in the back.

My horse goes much better in saddles that don’t have a point billet. How old is your horse? If she young enough that you would anticipate major changes to take place? One thing you can try are some of the adjustable saddles or synthetic ones that offer different options for tree with a panel configuration. That might help you out if you are in a phase where you anticipate your horse to go through a lot of changes.

Sometimes a saddle can look ok on a horse and fit in theory, but for whatever reason the horse just doesn’t like it. So with some horses, you may just have to go by trial and error to find something that works.

[CHT]

She is only coming 5, so yes could change more. I am hoping withers and being less bum high is in her future.

She is too wide for the adjustable or synthetic saddles that I know of.

Unfortunately there just aren’t the options up here for me to go by trial and error. The Canadian saddle fitters I tried to have help me find something all gave up whtn they saw her back tracings. I had to go to Jay at Trumbull to get any sort of help, but shipping saddles back and forth to the use would be cost prohibitive. One day I will get her a custom dressage, but for now I either need to get this saddle working, or just ride her in the western saddle. It seems to me that this saddle SHOULD be able to work as the angles all seem right. horse doesn’t seem bothered by the saddles pre-adjustment fit, but I didn’t want it to get to the point she was bothered.

She is very oddly built. I don’t think the saddle fitter believed me when he saw her tracing “Are you sure your horse is really this wide?” but then he came out and saw her…part of the issue is that she is very wide up high, but not that wide overall, so the saddle kind of folds over her shoulders.

[jaybird660]

CHT, is this fitting experience with fitters in Canada? I’m not sure who you are and could look at your info again to offer more insight. If she is croup high and the saddle is U shaped enough, the issue could be that the front doesn’t have enough depth so it dives down and forward. Flocking it more won’t necessarily solve this as it still has to follow the shape of the shoulder and remain open enough. Is the length okay?Sometimes a hip might move the saddle forward or asymmetry as well.

Point billets can be helpful with saddles that slide forward for some but not all as some don’t like that feeling.

Photos would be most helpful.

[stryder]

Have you seen the Equimeaure?

It allows you to make a mold of your horse’s back. Then the mold and saddle can be shipped off, dramatically reducing trial and error. I bought one of these things and found it easy to do. It’s easiest if you have access to an oven on site, and a buddy to help hold the horse. It can be re-used a few times.

https://www.fine-used-saddles.com/saddles/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=446&idcategory=83

I think it would be awesome for saddle shopping.

[Hinderella]

Stryder, that looks like an awesome saddle fitting tool!

Have you tried a saddle with a more U- shaped (hoop) tree like a Duett?

And when all else fails, if the saddle seems to otherwise fit, have you tried riding with a crupper to see if it helps?

[CHT]

I have a Duett for her. A 38cm Presto.

Jay, thanks for the offer of additional help. I really wish I understood all this more. I don’t currently have the saddle (it is with the fitter). It DID fit her for a few months so you did a good job fitting her, but I think she developed more shoulder muscle or something.

The saddle sits about an inch and a half in front of where her thoracic ends, so it isn’t too long I don’t think, but that may be part of why it gets moved forward.

I kind of wonder if removing the knee blocks would help the saddle shape to her shoulders properly. The saddle fitter says no, but it makes some logical sense to me. Any thoughts on that?

[jaybird660]

I don’t think the blocks would help with how the saddle fits the horse. It could be a number of things.