Help with topline decline on 20 yr old gelding

[lotz03]

We have owned my daughters horse for 3 years in April. We were new to horses when we got him and are still learning. Her riding instructor helped find him for us. They ride around home, participate in fun shows and saddle clubs with youth barrel racing and poles. She is 16.

I have noticed in the last year that his back or topline area is much thinner. Winter 2024 was hard on him. He was losing weight. We were able to stop it and regain. He did not lose nearly as much this past winter. He has free access to dry alfalfa mix hay 24 hrs a day and a scoop of Nutrina Triumph Active in the morning and one in the evening.

What can we do to help this area? He is in good health otherwise and does not seem plagued by much for his age.

[lotz03]

[lotz03]

[lotz03]

[MorganSercu]

Is he due for his annual checkup by the vet? Maybe his teeth need attention? Plus aging adds a new wrinkle.

I’m not familiar with Nutrena but if they offer a senior feed line, he may benefit from it. Also, it may be time to weigh his feeds to ensure he’s getting enough for his needs. It doesn’t have to be a fancy scale, the digital battery operated one is sufficient when weighing grain or supplements.

[RhythmNCruise]

There is a lot that goes into the equation of developing and maintaining a good topline, especially in a senior horse, and one that appears to have a longish back.

The first thing to consider is whether or not he’s getting the recommended amount of his feed. You say a scoop AM and PM, but how much does that scoop of feed weigh? You might be falling short of the recommended amount, which should be listed on the bag.

The second thing to consider is that he might need a feed tailored to his age. A senior feed might help him maintain his body condition. The first place you’re going to notice a horse’s loss of condition is over their topline. So his lack of coverage there is an indicator that he’s not getting enough calories. Triple Crown Senior, ProElite Senior, Nutrena ProForce Senior (I think that’s what it’s called) can provide more calories (still need to be fed at recommended levels).

It sounds like you’ve got good hay if it’s an alfalfa mix. Alfalfa is great for adding protein and protein builds muscle, which helps the topline. The other way of adding protein could be a ration balancer like Nutrena’s Empower Topline Balance. For horses that are easy-keepers, this can be their only “feed” along with hay and pasture. For a senior horse like yours that needs more calories, it can be top-dressed on his feed to add protein.

There are also amino acid supplements like TriAmino that can be supplemented if you don’t want to go the ration balancer route. These provide essential amino acids that help with muscle development.

Finally, how he is ridden also has a lot to do with the musculature over his topline. If he’s ridden with his head high, back hollow…that can create the kind of musculature you’re seeing too. He needs to be encouraged to stretch over his back and lower his head and neck, stepping under from behind to propel himself along. Basic dressage lessons could help your daughter learn how to ride him in such a way that it actually improves his conformation.

Which actually brings up another point. As horses age, they get aches and pains just like we do. He may not look “lame” to the naked eye, but if he’s got any creakiness in his joints (hocks are common) it can definitely cause him to lose condition just because he’s in a chronic low-level of pain and is compensating for that. So, that’s something to be aware of too.

[SMF11]

I board retired horses, who often become hard(er) keepers. Sometimes it is easy to forget that the first line of defense is: more food! Can he get 2 scoops instead of one, or three meals instead of two? A high fat/calorie supplement like Empower Boost? Plus what others have said – check teeth etc.

[luvmyhackney]

I am battling the same issue, except my pony is 22 and has metabolic issues.

1. Add more calories
2. Check teeth
3. Check pain anywhere including ulcers
4. Check saddle fit - a saddle that is tight or sits on the withers will cause this.

I’ve added soaked beet pulp/alfalfa cubes, had teeth checked and started soaking food to help mitigate, had a basic lameness exam, and started exercises to help build top line - walking over poles, hill work, tummy tucks on the ground. It helps but don’t expect overnight results.

[Jackie_amp_Starlette]

My 25-year-old mare started to lose topline last fall. I switched her from Essential K (2lbsx2day) to Unbeetable Complete (3lbsx2day) and she put on the weight and looks great in a few months. I have found that older horses do not process their hay (and she eats it, no quidding although she does have expired teeth) as well and need the extra boost in easy to digest pelleted feed. They simply cannot be fed like when they were younger.

[SMF11]

Fyi I have never had any luck putting weight on a horse adding beet pulp, or by feeding triple crown senior, two frequently mentioned things to feed to put weight on. I do love Triple Crown Senior, and it is the default feed on my farm. But when a horse can’t keep a good weight on it I switch them to Ultium, which is higher calorie. (And if that isn’t enough, I add Empower Boost. And if that isn’t enough (only happened twice, both times with horses into their thirties) I top dress with Purina Well Gel, which worked like magic!)

[NaturallyHappy]

How old is your horse? I think you mean your daughter is 16. You have great suggestions above. The suggestion I would add is to ask your vet to check for Cushings/PPID.

[beowulf]

First line of defense, like another poster said, is always add more food. As soon as you weigh the food and get back to us, we can help you better.

As they get older their nutritional needs tend to increase, not get less.

Beyond lack of food, common reasons older horses lose weight can be cushings/metabolic disorders, growing poorer quality hoof (another age thing) that makes them bilaterally lame, dental disease or EOTRH, undiagnosed pain somewhere interfering with their ability to cope day to day (pain burns calories), and just general senescence. As they get older they tend to absorb less efficiently and need a little more help. Soaked feed, additional calories, and supplementing a fat generally help.

We manage several seniors - actually all are seniors now on the farm besides my mare (!). An additional grain feeding a day for the really advanced and toothless one made all the difference. He is fed Triple Crown Senior and eats about 12lb a day dry (his feed is soaked), on top of all he can eat soaked timothy pellets (usually about 15lb).

[JB]

Test for PPID (Cushing’s) asap. If nothing else, you’ll have a baseline.

TRH Stim test this time of year if at all possible, but ACTH may work if not. The trouble with ACTH this time of year is it can produce a false negative, since it’s the seasonal low in North America. You won’t be able to feed your way out of that until he’s medicated

“A scoop” - 3qt scoop? So in the 6-6.5lb/day range most likely. I’d probably switch to a lower NSC or at least lower starch if using the Active pelleted (which is 15% starch, that’s high), or lower NSC in total if using the textured which is 27% starch and 33% NSC, much too high for a horse in this stage of life.

When were his teeth thoroughly (sedated, speculum, all the things) checked, and floated?

There are higher calorie feeds some are more $$, some aren’t that much more. Triple Crown Sr (or Gold if you can get it), Nutrena ProForce Senior or Safechoice Senior, Purina Senior Active (regular Sr is low cal), are options

[Pico_Banana]

Agree that more food may be necessary. Can you tell how much hay he’s getting? He may be getting less than you think.

Then make sure you’re helping with the right exercises. Walking up hills, ground poles, backing up, belly lifts, etc.

[beau159]

@lotz03

We have owned my daughters horse for 3 years in April. We were new to horses when we got him and are still learning. Her riding instructor helped find him for us. They ride around home, participate in fun shows and saddle clubs with youth barrel racing and poles. She is 16.

I have noticed in the last year that his back or topline area is much thinner. Winter 2024 was hard on him. He was losing weight. We were able to stop it and regain. He did not lose nearly as much this past winter. He has free access to dry alfalfa mix hay 24 hrs a day and a scoop of Nutrina Triumph Active in the morning and one in the evening.

What can we do to help this area? He is in good health otherwise and does not seem plagued by much for his age.

As others have said, more information would be helpful.

How old is the horse?
(You said “She is 16” above but I am not sure if you are talking about your daughter, or the horse, since the horse is a “he”.)

When is the last time his teeth have been examined?

How much does one scoop of the Nutrena Triumph Active weigh? (weight is the most important)
Is there a cleaner feed/grain that you can switch him to? (lots of random additives in that one)

Bottom line is trying to get as many calories into them as you can, so constant access to good quality forage.

[lotz03]

Thank you for all of the suggestions. To answer a question or two, he is around 20 we believe. Grade gelding, so no papers for an exact age.

I will buy a scale to weight his food. We are using the regular size scoop from Rural King and Tractor supply. He gets a full one. I really don’t know its size, someone had asked if it was a 3qt scoop.

He is due to have a full dental. We tried to have them floated late in the fall and it was a disaster. They want to fully sedate him. They used 2 doses of the typical sedation, a shoot, a twitch, and some sort of medival looking mouth piece and still couldn’t get them the last time. He has had a hard time with someone and his mouth or teeth in the past. They were afraid of creating more bad experiences and recommended putting him out to the level of a castration procedure. We have an appointment to have that done soon.

They are working on riding where he engages his back legs more. I will talk to my daughter about making sure his head is midlevel. He is getting better with the legs. She said she can feel it.

Unfortunately, we do not have anywhere in our rural IL area that would have dressage lessons.

We have 1 small hill in our back yard that they can work on, but our area is very flat.

Someone mentioned ground poles. Please explain if you can.

I originally tried to post 3 pictures of the horse from different angles but I see that only 1 actually came through.

Thank you for all of the ideas and comments so far. We are still learning, but love our big guy immensely! He has been the best horse for us to learn with. He is so patient and loveable. My husband and daughter also took in a colt at 8mo. He is now 2 yrs old. He’s another story. haha

[Lizrd]

Let me just sing your praises. You purchased a sane, older guy for your daughter. Home run. You are seeking help in keeping him fit and happy. Grand slam. You live in a rural area where horsekeeping and vet care may be a bit more rustic than many on this discussion board are comfortable with - that’s quite ok. It sounds like your trainer is a solid horse person, your vet team is providing some options that will keep your guy sane for treatments, and I would speculate that your 16 year old daughter is having the time of her life. You are checking all of the boxes. People here can be very helpful, and some can also go way over the top in their suggestions and recommendations for a content, aged, gelding living the good life. Take everything with a grain of salt. Continue to learn and ask questions. Rely on your vet and trainer team to keep making good suggestions. You are rocking this!

[lotz03]

Thank you for the kind words. My daughter took lessons for 5 years before we took the plunge on our own horse. We take care of him at our home. He is not boarded, so we are 100% in charge of all care and execution of his keeping. I believe we have a compassionate and knowledgeable vet. I am 100% positive we have a great teacher/trainer. She has not only worked across the country in the equine industry training and performing, but she has also never been a day in her life without very well kept horses of her own. Whenever we have a question or concern, she is one of the first we turn to for answers. Oddlly, however, I have not asked about the topline. I guess I should do that.

I just want to make sure we are taking the best possible care of our horses as possible. Sometimes I doubt myself since we did not grow up with large animals.

[beowulf]

One more thing I thought of OP - are you sure he’s staying warm enough? Cold horses lose calories fast from shivering. As horses get older they also tend to need more assertive blanketing.

@lotz03

They used 2 doses of the typical sedation, a shoot, a twitch, and some sort of medival looking mouth piece and still couldn’t get them the last time.

Sounds like a speculum. It looks gruesome but it’s imperative for a thorough examination of the mouth. Most horses don’t like them and I can’t say I blame them. One of my geldings needs quite a few “cocktails” to make him amenable to it, too.

I know it looks stressful but these things are important for the horse’s health. You’re on the right track.

[findeight]

All excellent suggestions but will add two more. There are things with aging horses you can help but not reverse. Some of what I see in that one picture is he has a long back that dips right behind the wither. When he lost weight it probably became more obvious and it may become even more obvious even with weight gain as he ages and gravity takes its toll.

Second thought is he may be older than 20. Teeth really can only tell you age until they have a “ full mouth”, after that its more guess and known history of that individual animal if the foaling dafe us unknown. Back in the day on rough forage teeth wore faster and with the poor health care of the time, most horses died younger so the traditional methods only applied to horses up to mid teens. IME and according to my vets, older horses typically read 3-5 years younger in their teeth then their actual, confirmed age,

The important thing here is that this horse is a perfect match for your DD and should continue to be one for several more years, at least. IF you take a few steps as mentioned above and stay up on current health and farrier needs.

Have had several older horses active until mid 20s ( verified age.) Found that, like aging humans, they have their share of stiffness, aches and pains and like humans can benefit from PROPERLY administered NSAIDs as directed by your vet. There are some excellent choices out there that can really improve their quality of life and avoid them getting depressed from chronic, low level pain. Remember as a prey animal, horses are stoic and hide any weakness a predator could sense.

Even just ( cheap) Bute CORRECTLY dosed can turn around a senior starting to show their mileage. As would a nice, warm blanket in cold weather, inner thermostats often do not function as well in senior horses( or humans), get him a jacket.