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High water table, or leaking Bar Bar A waterer?

Yesterday I discovered that the Bar Bar A waterer behind my barn was overflowing and leaking water all over the place. It’s not the drinking bowl overflowing. Rather, water is filling up the large tube in which the waterer sits, which goes down to the buried drain field. I pulled the waterer out to inspect it and everything is functioning normally with no leaks. I pumped water out of the tube as far as my pump could reach (about 3.5 feet down) and could not see any damage to the water supply hose, but the hose continues out of reach/sight and I was not able to pump all the way to the bottom of the well so I can’t really be sure. As soon as I stopped pumping the water level rose again, 3" per minute or so.

A milder version of this problem has been happening for the past 1-1.5 years. No dribbling water, but I would notice that the area around the waterer was sporadically damp and puddly even when it hadn’t rained. Last spring I spoke to Bar Bar A and the person who installed it, and the tentative conclusion was that the water table is high around there. There is a wet swampy area behind the waterer so that seemed reasonable-ish to me. Plus, if it were a leaking pipe I expect the area to be consistently wet. The Bar Bar A was installed in 2015 or 2016 and for the first few years I did not notice this issue. I am not sure if there is much correlation with rainfall or weather…I need to pay closer attention to that I guess. We did get about 1" of rain 3-4 days before I noticed this, some of which was very heavy.

This overflowing thing is a problem and I’m worried that if it’s not the water table, there is a damaged pipe or something that is out of reach and would require excavation to fix. Of course the way our property is set up you cannot turn water off to the barn only so the house would also be without plumbing during repairs. Sigh.

Has anybody had an issue where their Bar Bar A tube fills up with water and/or the ground surrounding the waterer gets damp or puddly? Any speculation on whether this is a leak vs. ground water?

Look at your water meter. Is it moving when you do not have the water turned on elsewhere? That would be the place to start to see if you have a leak.

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Good idea, thank you, but we are on a well and do not have a meter.

Does the water supply to this waterer go thru the house?

I know when water is running the barn because I can hear the water running in the pipes in the house. In my case, most obvious in the basement.

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Do you have a way to monitor when the pump is on? Most people don’t have an easy way, but we have a shallow well and can hear ours - so could hear if it came on when we weren’t running water (if we were got close & were paying attention).

You could also turn off the circuit to your well pump, don’t run any water (and you’d have to block horses from any automatic waterer), and see if the pressure in the system goes down.

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Where is the well pump? Ours is a deep well with a submerged pump, and I can tell if water is running by opening the well house and listening for the pressure tank to turn on.

We also have a setup where there’s only one shutoff for everything. One day we’ll put in a manifold. Yet another project!

I don’t think we can hear the well pump running, but I’ve also never tried. I guess it must be submerged? As far as the pressure tank, we have a weird system in which the water to the barn splits off from the pipe to the house, but the pressure tank in the house also pressurizes the water in the barn through the same “in” pipe.

The fact that the puddling has always been intermittent made me think it wasn’t a leaky pipe, but now that it’s gotten worse I guess it’s time to investigate it more. I was curious to hear if anyone else had ever had a similar issue that did not turn out to be a leak.

I do have an underground shut-off for the line to the field, but not for the line to the barn, which is stupid!

Ha! We have the exact same set-up! The barn was put in right alongside the existing line, so we just tapped in to it.

Turn off the water and see if it fills? If you’re getting 3" per minute, it should be pretty clear with no inconvenience. 30 minutes should be pretty apparent?

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if it is ground water rip that waterer out an just use the spring (but I really, really do not believe its ground water since the area remains dry most of the time, one inch of rain is really nothing that would affect the overall status of the ground water table)

as mentioned by others… shut off valves are a must to isolate defective equipment may it be a waterer or an electrical circuit

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The fact that it’s intermittent doesn’t rule out to me a leaky pipe. It might just say that sometimes the soil around the leak absorbs the water so you don’t notice it. Other times the surrounding soil isn’t able to absorb it all and so now you notice it.

Doesn’t rule out water table changes, but you would likely be seeing the impact of this in other places, not just at this one unit. As the old saying goes, if you hear hoofbeats behind you, it’s probably not a zebra. When you have pooling water that’s isolated to an area that contains a waterline with joints, valves, etc, it’s probably that waterline. I sense a rented backhoe is in your future. :laughing:

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It’s a leak. :cry: I turned the well pump off last night and the flow stopped, then returned some time after I turned the pump back on. I still think the very very sporadic dampness mayyyyy have actually had something to do with the water table because it’s been going on so long and the grassy area across the driveway from where the waterer is has always been prone to extreme swampiness, even before there was a water line in the area. But the new problem is definitely with the plumbing. I guess if the intermittent dampness stops after the leak is fixed, I will know for sure.

I finally got through to someone at Bar Bar A and they have heard of this happening a few times when the connector between the underground hose and the water pipes fail. That seems as good a place to start digging as any, I guess. I’m going to have to tear up my nice stonedust run and maybe move some fence posts. Ugh.

This also seems like a good time to put in some shut-off valves, so I need to figure out the best way to do that.

My husband will probably say this is a good excuse to finally buy the backhoe attachment for our tractor that he’s always wanted! Neither of us would be terribly competent with it though.

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Get the attachment! When we got ours, it felt like an indulgence, but it has very quickly earned its keep. Very useful tool to have around! Don’t be intimidated, it’s a pretty short learning curve. Practice in an open area where the stakes for a screwup are low, and you’ll get the hang of it quickly. I just parked myself in front of the big mulch pile and moved the pile, one scoop at at time.

OMG don’t encourage me! It would have been soooooo much more useful 7 years ago when we first built all the horse facilities…I haven’t had to do any major projects in a while so I think it would be overkill now? Hmmmm

go back to the T off of the water line to the barn and add a shut off, also since the house and all the farm is on a common water system it might be advisable to install a backflow prevention valve where the lines branch to the out buildings

yeah one project leads to another… next your neighbor sees how proficient you have become asks could you dig this out for me please

I second Clanter’s idea about a backflow preventer.

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I need to look into this more. Do you guys know if you can put a backflow preventer between the pressure tank (in the house) and the other lines that use the pressure tank (barn and pasture)?

I am Not a plumber nor ever want to be… it my understanding a backflow valve is designed to only let water flow in One Direction regardless of how the system is pressurized.

A common use is on lawn irrigation systems to keep any potential contaminated water from entering the household system, We have a anti backflow valve on the supply line to the barns/water lines to four field hydrants

We also have a screw on Hose Bib Anti-Siphon Valve on each hydrant since the hoses leak out whatever chemicals are in the standard garden hoses I just want to make sure there is not any backwards cross contamination from one hydrant to the next

(just over kill, a carry over from me having to use mud puddle water as drinking water in Asia)

So first things first, this leak… I looked at photos that I took during installation and am pretty sure I know where the likely-culprit connector is, just at the base of the waterer. Since it’s so close to the waterer I’m not sure a backhoe could be used, even with a competent operator? Is hand digging going to be the only option? Neither my husband nor I can do that due to injuries, so how much should I expect to pay some poor sap to dig a ~4’ deep hole in awful clay soil in July? I guess the only good news is that the leak should keep the ground from being rock-hard…

There are some little wee excavators that are GREAT at digging in tight spaces. In your shoes, I’d call up my well guy and have him take a look see. Those guys know all about digging holes to look at water things.

Good luck!

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