Hind End lameness

I have a 8 yr old Tb who has had issues with hind end lameness he goes sound but does this thing in both hind legs where you feel his hip go out when riding but looking at the video in slow motion it looks like something stops him from bringing his leg fully under and he stabs his toes. Hes been hooked up to a lameness locator and nothing, hes had x-rays from the fetlock up to the stifle on both hind legs and NOTHING not even arthritis! I have injected his stifles with steriod, did nothing! I worked him slowly up to 2 20 min trot sessions thinking it was delayed patellar release and didnt seem to change anything…ANY advice would be appreciated The farrier is coming out today to put wedges on his hind. I worked with a vet from rood and riddle before moving back home to ny and all that seems to be happening is me spending money on vets to guess…

Video link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0EbabnxTADs

Did you see this thread? http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?t=316211

The other option may be to blister the quad muscles to strengthen them, which would help stabilize the joint. It’s good news that nothing has showed up on x-rays, etc. He may just need a little something to help that patella stop catching.

Good luck. He’s lovely!

Yes I saw that thread and its been one of the ideas but Im just not sure if its actual Delayed Patellar release…

Try blistering to tighten things up…
Ever do a bone scan?

EPM?

Its not EPM he saw Dr. Reed at Rood and riddle for wobblers and EPM all tests negative…

I was also told blistering doesnt really help, do you have any experience with it?

Thanks for the responses!!

It could be neurological .

What do his hind feet look like? Why the wedges?

I ask because my gelding looked like that when I first got him - was a combo of long toes, underrun/slightly contracted heels, and thrush that wasn’t at all obvious. Basically his heels hurt. Treating the thrush made a 75% difference.

Unfortunately in our case my old farrier didn’t get the angles fixed fast enough and he strained the upper part of the medial branch of his DDFT on the LH and is currently recovering. My new farrier put him in wedged aluminum egg bars behind for this shoeing cycle since I’m not riding him anyway. Has made a world of difference.

Interesting to see this on video. My OTTB did this when I first got him off of the track, and for maybe 2-3 years (decreasing in intensity over that time) after. He was worse on one side than the other (he was a lot stabbier with his LH all of the time, and tended to do it more with that leg).

The key to my guy was body work (chiro, acupuncture, and shockwave therapy) in conjunction with conditioning, and my chiro ended up calling in her mentor who “specializes” in pelvis work. His issue was that his pelvis was pretty significantly sheared and tilted forward. It was a long process to get him moving evenly behind, but through their work we did. I’m grateful that I have them because I would imagine that the big vet clinics I’ve worked with over here would still be looking for a “reason.”

The “end” of my guy’s story worth is twofold:

  1. I now wear a helmet every ride, every horse. He never “stumbled” more than what you have on your video, but it made me nervous enough that he might go down that I started wearing a helmet all of the time on all of my horses (after many decades of never flatting in one). My husband is grateful to my boy for that :slight_smile:

  2. We just did our first 1.50m Grand Prix. So it certainly wasn’t something that limited his career down the road. Jumping, in fact, was one of the things that really seemed to strengthen his hind end, and I would notice a positive difference at the end of each and every horseshow (when all of my other horses would be feeling a bit stiff and tired he would feel stronger and more even).

I feel like I say this a lot on this board, but my advice would be to find a really phenomenal body worker, preferably someone who’s skilled with pelvis work, and see if you can approach it from that direction.

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Seeing as how I have a similar lameness at the moment, PNW can you PM me your bodyworker’s name? Would s/he come to Monroe? Thanks :frowning:

My guy did this for a while when out of shape after an injury. Chiropractic seemed to help, but it was a matter of therapy from lots of backing up (in hand) work up and down hills, and raised caveletti that “cured” it. It takes a few weeks of very consistent work to see improvement.

I may be way off…, but looking at the video it appears that his stumble does not come from not pulling all the way through, or higher up the leg, it looks, to me, and again I may be way off, that it is in his lower leg.

My first thought is some type of ligament interference, perhaps and old injury that did not affect the ligament itself but built up enough scar tissue to restrict the movement ligament periodically. I have seen horse get deep cuts close to the tendon sheath, missing the tendons all together, that upon healing cause them to temporarily lose control of the ligament resulting in almost the exact same scenario as your horse.

Second, which could be related to the first idea, is that he is getting a stinger from the same type of thing. As he goes through his motions he gets a sharp pain due to interference which causes him to retard his movement and consequently fail to follow all the way through his movement, and stumble.

Again, I do not know the horse history etc., and may be way off, but it may be another avenue you might want to explore.

Good Luck

I know it’s a stretch, but how about Lymes Disease?

[QUOTE=UrbanHennery;5780408]
What do his hind feet look like? Why the wedges?

I ask because my gelding looked like that when I first got him - was a combo of long toes, underrun/slightly contracted heels, and thrush that wasn’t at all obvious. Basically his heels hurt. Treating the thrush made a 75% difference.

Unfortunately in our case my old farrier didn’t get the angles fixed fast enough and he strained the upper part of the medial branch of his DDFT on the LH and is currently recovering. My new farrier put him in wedged aluminum egg bars behind for this shoeing cycle since I’m not riding him anyway. Has made a world of difference.[/QUOTE]

He has one of the best farriers in my area he feet are picture perfect. We put wedges on b/c if it is delayed patellar release wedges help.

[QUOTE=PNWjumper;5780447]
Interesting to see this on video. My OTTB did this when I first got him off of the track, and for maybe 2-3 years (decreasing in intensity over that time) after. He was worse on one side than the other (he was a lot stabbier with his LH all of the time, and tended to do it more with that leg).

The key to my guy was body work (chiro, acupuncture, and shockwave therapy) in conjunction with conditioning, and my chiro ended up calling in her mentor who “specializes” in pelvis work. His issue was that his pelvis was pretty significantly sheared and tilted forward. It was a long process to get him moving evenly behind, but through their work we did. I’m grateful that I have them because I would imagine that the big vet clinics I’ve worked with over here would still be looking for a “reason.”

The “end” of my guy’s story worth is twofold:

  1. I now wear a helmet every ride, every horse. He never “stumbled” more than what you have on your video, but it made me nervous enough that he might go down that I started wearing a helmet all of the time on all of my horses (after many decades of never flatting in one). My husband is grateful to my boy for that :slight_smile:

  2. We just did our first 1.50m Grand Prix. So it certainly wasn’t something that limited his career down the road. Jumping, in fact, was one of the things that really seemed to strengthen his hind end, and I would notice a positive difference at the end of each and every horseshow (when all of my other horses would be feeling a bit stiff and tired he would feel stronger and more even).

I feel like I say this a lot on this board, but my advice would be to find a really phenomenal body worker, preferably someone who’s skilled with pelvis work, and see if you can approach it from that direction.[/QUOTE]

Hes had chiro work done and she said his pelvis looks great but he had two ribs out, that was all she could find.

Makes me a little ill to see this video…

Because I have a five year old tb/old cross who does this. I have had epm treatment, hocks injected, hill work, bute therapy,Estrone injections and SI chiro and then SI injection. He still does it. constant cavaletti and hill work seem to make it less often. He is shod with his hind shoes set back, and the toe squared…when his foot grows out a little he gets much worse. I am going to get his stifles injected this time. If you fix it, I hope you will post it on this board!!!

Oh, I hope it is not this.
I had a grey horse that started doing this, and it turned out to be grey horse melanoma that had spread to his spinal cord. (Very rare, but it can happen.) He was much older, 15, but had almost no visible melanomas, nothing larger than a pencil eraser. He gradually became worse and worse, and I had to put him down.
Vet who did necroscopy was shocked to find tumors up and down his spinal cord.
This vet did a neurological workup, and we knew it was a neurological thing, just not what, until the necroscopy.

[QUOTE=Claudius;5781310]
Because I have a five year old tb/old cross who does this. I have had epm treatment, hocks injected, hill work, bute therapy,Estrone injections and SI chiro and then SI injection. He still does it. constant cavaletti and hill work seem to make it less often. He is shod with his hind shoes set back, and the toe squared…when his foot grows out a little he gets much worse. I am going to get his stifles injected this time. If you fix it, I hope you will post it on this board!!![/QUOTE]

no vet has any guess to what is causing it?

[QUOTE=Instant Karma;5781098]
I know it’s a stretch, but how about Lymes Disease?[/QUOTE]

Good thought, and not a stretch IMO. Lymes was very prevalent on the east coast two summers ago. My TB got it (luckily caught early and treated quickly). But there were a few horses at my barn that got it and I also heard of cases at nearby farms.

wilsonaj21

Vet @1 said it was not neurologic, it was his hocks and injected him( some improve ent), husband said epm possibly, and we had a box of marquis so we did that(no change$$$), I did hill work(not much improvement), went to Fla. vet #2 said SI…adjusted him twice, and the third time he injected him( not much change), vet # 3 said hocks and injected him again…that was about 8 months after the first injections. I tried a week of bute therapy. BNT said Estrone and I did that for a month. I will say, I got the most noticable improvement from the short, square toes and the second time I did rigorous hill work…trotting and cantering up the hills. Big hills. My horse is very laid back and lazy, so some of it I attribute to that…but my heart really drops when he does it. He is never lame, no heat anywhere…bute made no change.