Hiring a Teenager to Help with Barn Chores??

[jenbrin]

Because of my work schedule I’m considering hiring a seventeen year old with horse experience to help around the barn 2 to 3 days a week. It duties would mainly be cleaning stalls, tack, some grooming and possibly holding for the vet or farrier, no riding at this point.

My farm is small between 4 to 5 horses with only one horse that is rideable right now, the others are broodmares & a weanling. Everyone is pretty well behaved but they are horses.

What should I know beforehand (insurance, releases, etc….)? Is this a good or bad idea?

Thanks!!

[IronwoodFarm]

Workers comp! Minors can’t sign contracts, so releases must be signed by BOTH parents. Some liability policies will not cover the risk of a minor working. If you are not going to be around to supervise, I think you may be taking a big risk.

[findeight]

It’s a good idea if done properly. Call your insurance agent.

Paying by the hour works better the swapping labor for board or lessons in most cases, less room for misunderstanding and the worker is more likely to take it seriously, like showing up. For some reason if it’s just a labor for expennses swap they seem to think they get the board, lessons or whatever even when they don’t make the shifts…and they don’t offer to pay you for the difference between shifts missed and your lesson rate it or, worse, food their horse ate they ended up not working off. It’s often a mess.

You might try contacting a local high school or college with agricultural courses about students wanting to apprentice for class credit. My show barn has done that for years and they get absolutely wonderful workers eager to learn. Plus the school insures them. That’s been a win win, barn gets eager help, kids get a few bucks, a reference from the barn for their resume and class credit.

[clanter]

might want to view this from an opposite direction… if it were an “Internship programs for students” you could charge them for the right to learn about horses, horse care… and they would not be employees

The companies that arrange summer internships I see charge the student about $1,000 week

My oldest daughter was interested in penguins … I think it cost me about $2K for her to do an internship with the little beasts and they worked her about fifteen hours a day caring for them… she had fun.

[starhorse]

[QUOTE=clanter;7829979]
might want to view this from an opposite direction… if it were an “Internship programs for students” you could charge them for the right to learn about horses, horse care… and they would not be employees

The companies that arrange summer internships I see charge the student about $1,000 week

My oldest daughter was interested in penguins … I think it cost me about $2K for her to do an internship with the little beasts and they worked her about fifteen hours a day caring for them… she had fun.[/QUOTE]

Yikes (to the charging $1000 a week).

As a rider who would not have been able to ride without working at barns for cash/catch riding, this makes me sad. If it weren’t for wonderful barn owners who saw a hard-working kid without an endless money supply, I probably wouldn’t have a horse today.

If you need the employee, pay them fairly.

[NurseHorsey]

For the majority of high school, I worked at various barns - never got paid, just worked there because I was horse-crazy, my parents refused to buy me a horse, and I wanted more time at the barn. I’m not that old (24) so this was back in the mid-2000s, but I never signed anything or had any formal agreements - it was just a part of the riding world to me that nothing was ever really ‘nailed down’ and my parents were fine with that as long as what I was doing was reasonable.

However, with how things are now… I would look into any legal protection you might be able to get just in case.

I do see clanter’s point with the internship program idea but that never would have flown with my parents and I was so desperate for any horse contact, I was willing to just muck stalls all day and do any type of labor to be around horses. So while the internship idea is smart, you may cut out some great students who are hard-workers but can’t afford to “pay to play” and are willing to work to play.

But I can’t tell you how much I appreciated being given any opportunity to work, in any capacity, in a barn - I gained so much practical horse management and horse care knowledge, along with training knowledge, I really don’t know where else or how else I would have learned everything. Definitely protect yourself but seriously, I applaud you and those barns who gave me opportunities for opening up to hard-working kids who want to learn.

[IPEsq]

You’ll see that most paid jobs in the horse world are advertised to the 18+ group. In Colorado, minors can’t sign contracts-- you need a parent/guardian. I want to point out that this isn’t the case necessarily in all states (NY and Cali have some specific rules, for example, that relate to a minor’s ability to sign contracts such as talent contracts–so, for others reading, check your state’s laws).

Also check with your insurance that a minor worker would be covered. All the usual employment laws would apply, and while it would be good for a release to be signed, releases aren’t necessarily going to save you in case of a mishap–need to have insurance coverage.

[PeteyPie]

For what it’s worth, the last blurb I posted about workman’s comp (it happened to be from the state of New York) said that all employees, even family members and volunteers, must be covered. I don’t know if that holds true in all states, but you might want to check it out. I was trying to figure out what the workman’s comp insurance would be on a part-time barn worker who worked 10 hours a week at $10/hour, or $100 a week, a figure I selected for easy math. I calculated about $9 per week, but I don’t know if I was doing it right.

Any employers out there? Does that sound right?

[Happyhooves]

When I was a kid (yes, back when the earth was cooling), someone gave me the chance to work around the barn because I couldn’t afford lessons, and I got “paid” by riding and learning and just being around the horses. To me, it was just the best. Seems risky to do this these days–aside from the liability–because so many opinions abound. Everyone sees things so differently. One BO I knew had a kid working for her and it seemed like a great exchange to me and others, but there were yet others who thought the kid was doing too much work for what she was getting. It opened up the BO to what I thought was unfair criticism, and she eventually just stopped having kids work for her, just shrank her operation instead.

[jenbrin]

I’m not worried about finding anyone, in fact I have had a couple girls approach me about helping out but never considered it but with my new work schedule it would be nice.

I would definitely have the parents sign a release if they were under 18yrs. I will also check with my insurance agent to see if they would be covered. These are my own personal horses so I have no clue about business insurance and what that would cost me? I don’t want occur a bunch of expenses just to have someone help out a couple hours a week. Could they be considered contract labor?

I don’t know about the internship thing since we are going into the winter, nothing is happening (no breeding, weaning is done, very little riding and no shows). So I was thinking of paying them a weekly salary for about 12hrs and then make adjustments as thing start picking up.

Lastly, I’m concerned about leaving them unsupervised for a part of the time, more in the case of an emergency. I do have barn cameras in every stall/run but someone isn’t always watching them so that wouldn’t necessarily help.

[IPEsq]

Don’t think they’d be considered an IC, even if part time/hourly.

http://www.coworkforce.com/dwc/whatis/employerwhatis.asp

[CHT]

Make sure it is legal in your area for someone under 18 to work unsupervised. I believe here in Alberta barn work would be considered dangerous, and so someone under 18 needs to be under direct supervision.

[Plumcreek]

I have had high school kids work in my barn. I always give them the choice of a fair rate per hour, or half of that and I will teach them things like an intern, often including riding help. They have always opted for the 50/50 deal, as they were motivated horse girls. Since you spend a lot of time explaining and teaching them anyway, this works out well. I would definitely make provisions for a phone check-in hourly or so when they are there alone, and make sure their parents have good medical insurance. I also have a “Country Homeowner’s” insurance policy with an elevated liability amount.

[arlosmine]

A tip:
Don’t pay (or barter/compensate, whatever) by the hour.
Compensate by the task: Make a list, know how long it takes to do each thing. Make a time window appropriate to the list.
Compensate for the list being completed.
If the kid completes the list in the allotted time, great! If they drag their feet it’s their problem.

Young people often don’t work quickly or efficiently, this will encourage them to be fast…and if they aren’t, you don’t pay them for dawdling.

[S1969]

I find it so weird that we can hire these teenagers to watch our children but not work in our barn. Kids can take the Red Cross Babysitting course at 11 years of age!

Lots of people hire teenagers to work around their farms - uninsured, under the table, by the hour…just like we pay babysitters and lawn mowers. If you are not running a business, I’m not sure how you can provide a kid with workers compensation.

I have hired a variety of teenagers to do a variety of jobs for me (weekend horse sitting, basic farm work, etc.). I am sure there was an inherent risk. For the most part, I did try to find kids that were 18, particularly if there was contact with horses, but I’m sure I probably had some that weren’t. My own kids are 12 and 16 and are responsible for a lot of horse-related chores when I am not home…although I don’t let anyone ride alone.

On a small, private farm, I’m not really sure there is a way to have anyone work for you that is not a risk – whether they are over 18 or not. I carry a big umbrella policy on top of my homeowners policy. I’m sure if I asked my insurance company, they would tell me not to hire anyone, ever.

[Abbie.S]

You know, I’m not ancient…about 15 years ago I was a minor (barely teenager, actually) working for my BO. I was mucking stalls with horses in them when the weather meant no turn out. I was leading horses in an out of the barn in pairs. I didn’t have worker’s comp. I didn’t sign a waiver. I didn’t do jack. I also didn’t die or ever get injured.

That’s not to say it can’t or won’t happen. But I was also supervised. I always worked alongside an adult, usually the BO or my mom, who came on Sundays to do chores with me. I was never alone.

It sounds like your worker would be alone, OP. And for that reason, I would highly recommend you be looking for someone who is 18+. It takes out all the possible issues tied in with minors. Perhaps a college student with a love of horses looking for some easy cash. But they need to be an adult.

Since you aren’t operating a business, you can go about this just as you would paying someone to walk your dog or babysit your kids. You should check your state law to see if there is an Inherent Risk clause: it’s usually something posted in every major barn stating that anyone who sets foot in a barn acknowledges there is an inherent risk associated with horses and releases liability from any horse owner or business owner. If your state has such a law (most of them do), and you have a sign on your property posting said law, you don’t have to do any further paperwork. Never a bad idea, but not required.

[jenbrin]

Seeing how I already have a mother who is asking me to hire her daughter for a couple of hours a week but the daughter is only 17yrs old. Mother/Daughter do not care if she gets paid with cash or riding time but my riding horse is still in training and at this point won’t work for her.

I absolutely agree that she may be alone a little too much and that’s was why I was asking. I wish I could say they were our neighbors and parents would most likely be around but they aren’t. I also don’t get home at the same time every day and can’t arrange a schedule according to that. Unfortunately, I will probably have to let her know it’s too big of a risk.

As far as a college student most of them want way too much for what I’m asking them to do or they want free board for their horse(s). And I absolutely can’t board where I’m at.

[NurseHorsey]

@jenbrin;7832022

Seeing how I already have a mother who is asking me to hire her daughter for a couple of hours a week but the daughter is only 17yrs old. Mother/Daughter do not care if she gets paid with cash or riding time but my riding horse is still in training and at this point won’t work for her.

I absolutely agree that she may be alone a little too much and that’s was why I was asking. I wish I could say they were our neighbors and parents would most likely be around but they aren’t. I also don’t get home at the same time every day and can’t arrange a schedule according to that. Unfortunately, I will probably have to let her know it’s too big of a risk.

I have no idea what driving age in Colorado is but assuming she has her license, is her schedule flexible enough that she could drive over to you if you sent her a text when you got home or let her know what time you plan on being back that night? Might work out if you and her figured out something like, Monday and Thursday are days I’d like you to work and I’ll text you an estimated arrival time/when I’m home on those days. Kind of like being ‘on call’ but more planned because she’ll know “Oh, x day and x day, I work with jenbrin so I’ll keep my schedule clear to head over when she’s back.” I’m sure they’d be willing to work out something that kept you legally safe and the daughter physically safe.

[theblondejumper]

Whew, reading this thread makes me feel a little grateful that when I worked 15 hour days ALONE at the barn (one person lived on the property but could not be there all of the time) at ages 15 and 16 that nothing terrible happened to me. No contract.

[IPEsq]

I mean, really, it’s probably going to be fine. I don’t see how having this as a part time job is any different than those of us who took care of our own horses a lot of the time. I had plenty of time at the barn with mostly just kids running around doing whatever, though we weren’t “working”. We still did dumb things, but no one got sued. But, all it takes is one bad accident and one person wanting to sue you. I’m not saying the parents of this girl necessarily would, but you never really know, right?