Holding onto grab strap on saddle - legal or not?

[Dixon]

[QUOTE=Roan;3502675]
I recently put one on mine and I’m really glad I did.

I’d rather instinctively pull leather than unintentionally hurt my horse’s mouth[/QUOTE]

Wow – no wonder peoples’ horses are so spooky that they actually need a grab strap at SHOWS, as opposed to at home during the breaking and greenbean stages. If you are afraid of pulling on your horse’s mouth when it spooks, then you are ENABLING your horse’s spooks, if not outright encouraging them. I’ll bet every time these peoples’ horses spook, the rider stops asking for whatever obedience they were in the middle of (if any), stops the horse and says “whoa, good horse good horse, it’s okay,” and pats its neck.

Spooking should be corrected, and yes that means with the reins as appropriate. Your first reaction should not be to protect your horse’s mouth, but to control the horse. If you are afraid of hitting your horse in the mouth when it scoots all of a sudden, then you are probably too afraid to be out showing, where your horse’s spooks can injure others around you.

[merrygoround]

[QUOTE=merrygoround;3502544]
Whether legal or not, I would consider the use of a grab strap, unless in an extreme circumstance, such as a bucking fit, or an extreme spook, to be a little tacky. To require one in order to sit the trot indicates that the rider is riding a test above their competence.
Ditto for steadying their hands.

However, for the special olympics, I wouldn’t raise an eyebrow. :)[/QUOTE]

I was speaking of the original discussion,ie: expecting to be using one while showing, under ordinary circumstances. Not about using one in under unexpected circumstances, or while teaching a rider to sit the trot, or steady their hands, in a schooling situation.

[SGray]

during scribing I’ve had more than one judge state that they prefer to see a hand on pommel or on strap than to see a rider pounding on the horses’ back during the lengthenings

[SillyHorse]

@Dixon;3502710

If you are afraid of hitting your horse in the mouth when it scoots all of a sudden, then you are probably too afraid to be out showing, where your horse’s spooks can injure others around you.

That’s quite a pronouncement. Bless your heart, too.

[Dixon]

Thanks, I do feel blessed.

[merrygoround]

[QUOTE=SGray;3502733]
during scribing I’ve had more than one judge state that they prefer to see a hand on pommel or on strap than to see a rider pounding on the horses’ back during the lengthenings[/QUOTE]

Again, showing above their level of competence.

[CatOnLap]

Again, showing above their level of competence.

not necessarily. :no:

A well known local GP rider, trained in Germany and shown GP for many years with steel rods in her spine, used a grab strap for extended trot for many years, without penalty. Finally she was graded for the paraolympics, where she is showing at this moment. But she still competes at home against “able bodied riders”. Most of us never knew she had the spinal rods and none of us considered her disabled before she was graded. Nor did any judge consider that she was riding above her level of competence, what with consistent scores above the 60’s. Many of us are riding with old spinal and pelvic injuries, are competent and judicious in our use of such aides.
What a judgemental lot. :no: Leave it to the real judges! :yes:

Catonlap has grabstraps on all her english saddles and uses them whenever necessary. They did NOT come off for shows and no comment on their use has ever been made by a judge

[flshgordon]

@merrygoround;3502544

However, for the special olympics, I wouldn’t raise an eyebrow.

Wow :rolleyes:

I would love to see you throw this insult at some very good ULRs that have these on their saddles!

Talk about an @sshat comment!

[Equibrit]

Wasn’t this a RULES question?

@DownYonder;3502149

I don’t have my rule book handy. Does anyone know if it is specifically against the rules to hold onto your grab strap in a USDF competition?

DR117 “It is obligatory to ride with both hands”…
[COLOR=#231f20]The upper part of the body easy, free and erect with the hands low and close together
without, however, touching either each other or the horse and with the thumb as the highest
point;"

[/COLOR]Is hanging on the strap riding?
Does “ride” mean only using the reins?
Can you hang on to it without touching your hands together, or the horse, and keep your thumbs up?

There is no answer - given the way the rules are written!

[black_dog]

Some people

Some people must not pay attention when watching the higher level shows then. Many GP people have a grab strap on their saddles. When I first started to ride the ext trot and was struggling with it, my instructor listed all of the GP who have the same problem and still use them in the show ring.
If a rider feels comfortable with one on, then good for them. I don’t bother to take mine off when I show and have never heard a thing about it: 4th level at rec. shows.
Yes, we all strive for the 100% perfect harmony. But, then again, I live in reality would where we’re not all blessed riders and you might need the strap. If you only need the strap just in case or for a few steps, I say go for it and show with it. Just keep working on it at home and soon you’ll forget it’s even on there

[CatOnLap]

the “Special Olympics” are different from the “ParaOlympics”, now going on in Beijing.

It is entirely possible to grab the strap with one hand, not touching the horse, keeping one rein in the same hand, thumb relatively upright, other hand at the same level and satisfy the rule requirements. There is room in the rules for the judge to mark down in the rider’s collectives, but if the strap was only used for a short time in one movement, it is unlikely to make much difference. However, it will make the difference between a “5” and a “7” in the extended trot, and the rider mark is likely to come down if the rider is bouncing, inhibiting the horse, as well. Lesser of the two evils would be using the grabstrap.

[Roan]

[QUOTE=Dixon;3502747]
Thanks, I do feel blessed.[/QUOTE]

Consider yourself double-blessed, then.

Eileen

[SillyHorse]

@Equibrit;3502917

Wasn’t this a RULES question?

DR117 “It is obligatory to ride with both hands”…
[COLOR=#231f20]The upper part of the body easy, free and erect with the hands low and close together
without, however, touching either each other or the horse and with the thumb as the highest
point;"

[/COLOR]Is hanging on the strap riding?
Does “ride” mean only using the reins?
Can you hang on to it without touching your hands together, or the horse, and keep your thumbs up?

There is no answer - given the way the rules are written!

One could, I think, easily hook a pinkie (or two ) under a grab strap while maintaining the hand position described in the rules.

[LD1129]

[QUOTE=SillyHorse;3503105]
One could, I think, easily hook a pinkie (or two ) under a grab strap while maintaining the hand position described in the rules.[/QUOTE]
:yes::yes::yes:

[DownYonder]

Yes, I recently watched someone who had hooked the index finger of both hands around her grab strap. I didn’t notice it until someone else said something, and even then, I couldn’t really tell that she had BOTH index fingers hooked on the grab strap. It was really rather hard to see - she certainly wasn’t hanging on for dear life with her entire fist! Her hands looked great - quiet and soft, with thumbs correctly on top - and her horse looked great, too. It was quite interesting to watch.

[Dixon]

[QUOTE=black dog;3502949]
I live in reality would where we’re not all blessed riders and you might need the strap. [/QUOTE]

You too can be a blessed rider! Just disagree with Eileen [edit] or Sillyhorse. No sneeze necessary.

[Pony_Fixer]

[QUOTE=Dixon;3502710]
Wow – no wonder peoples’ horses are so spooky that they actually need a grab strap at SHOWS, as opposed to at home during the breaking and greenbean stages. If you are afraid of pulling on your horse’s mouth when it spooks, then you are ENABLING your horse’s spooks, if not outright encouraging them. I’ll bet every time these peoples’ horses spook, the rider stops asking for whatever obedience they were in the middle of (if any), stops the horse and says “whoa, good horse good horse, it’s okay,” and pats its neck.

Spooking should be corrected, and yes that means with the reins as appropriate. Your first reaction should not be to protect your horse’s mouth, but to control the horse. If you are afraid of hitting your horse in the mouth when it scoots all of a sudden, then you are probably too afraid to be out showing, where your horse’s spooks can injure others around you.[/QUOTE]

I’m pretty sure my horse was “corrected” for spooking at shows. It left him tense and MORE spooky. Every time something would scare him, he would almost cringe waiting for the reprimand. This made a vicious circle of spooking. When I began working with another trainer SPECIFICALLY for this reason, she had me let go of his mouth, (long explanation of her techniques left out), and retrain him it was okay to be scared, but his actions needed to be more appropriate. I do grab the strap when I feel him tense or in a situation that may provoke a spook, so I can “pull leather” rather than his mouth as is the instinct. Fast forward 6 months, very little spooking of any kind.

I think some horses can be bullied out of a spook (especially if is is part of an evasion, rather than true fear), but other horses are truly fearful and they need help in dealing with it, not punishment. YMMV.

[SillyHorse]

@Dixon;3503271

You too can be a blessed rider! Just disagree with Eileen [edit] or Sillyhorse. No sneeze necessary.

Where did we have a disagrement? I hadn’t even offered an opinion. It has nothing to do with disagreeing. But telling people you don’t know that they’re too afraid to be out showing is sanctimonious and snarky.

[merrygoround]

[QUOTE=flshgordon;3502886]
Wow :rolleyes:

I would love to see you throw this insult at some very good ULRs that have these on their saddles!

Talk about an @sshat comment![/QUOTE]

Sorry to spoil your rudity,:rolleyes: but I do have a grab strap on my saddle. However, I would NOT expect to enter a dressage arena, expecting to require it’s use as an aid to my riding. However I do realize, that accidents happen but I would expect that would result in appropriate scoring. This, I believe, was the the point of the OP’s query.

[mp]

[QUOTE=Dixon;3502710]
Wow – no wonder peoples’ horses are so spooky that they actually need a grab strap at SHOWS, as opposed to at home during the breaking and greenbean stages. If you are afraid of pulling on your horse’s mouth when it spooks, then you are ENABLING your horse’s spooks, if not outright encouraging them. I’ll bet every time these peoples’ horses spook, the rider stops asking for whatever obedience they were in the middle of (if any), stops the horse and says “whoa, good horse good horse, it’s okay,” and pats its neck.

Spooking should be corrected, and yes that means with the reins as appropriate. Your first reaction should not be to protect your horse’s mouth, but to control the horse. If you are afraid of hitting your horse in the mouth when it scoots all of a sudden, then you are probably too afraid to be out showing, where your horse’s spooks can injure others around you.[/QUOTE]

You certainly make a lot of assumptions from a limited amount of information.

For some horses (like mine), getting banged in the mouth just makes them worse, so it really is a good idea to avoid it. Sitting DOWN and using one rein to ask for a bend is the best way to get his mind back. Then we proceed as though nothing happened. No cooing or coddling. Just business as usual.