Honey the ASB update and progress thread!

The new rider is night and day compared with the other. Look at her posture standing in front of Honey. Cool and calm, relaxed, no stress. Look at Honey’s posture, alert but relaxed. That’s what you want to see.

Compare this riding video to the earlier one upthread. Much to see and like here in such a short clip. She has a solid position, asks and immediately rewards and Honey looks a he*l of alot happier then she does in that earlier video. Just watch each session several times, you should see the big difference.

As Honey continues to improve, she’s probably going to get full of herself and its good you can start regular exercise. All the “park horse” types are busy bees and pickup on any nervousness and/or frustration in the handler/rider, wonder if they need to be nervous too.

There is an old cowboy term, “Sit Chilly” remember it and learn to do it. Less educated riders tend to get on busy brained horses and “light them up”, also called having an “ electric leg”. They don’t really understand either the horse or how to ride it…no matter how many ribbons they brag about.

I think you got a winner in this rider who has been taught a great trainer. Would be very comfortable with whoever trained this young lady or anybody they recommended to get you introduced to not only SS but the whole concept of effective riding.

You might even learn to handle the 4 reins of a double bridle down the road. That will enlighten you on the proper use of snaffles and curbs and allow you to make educated bit choices.

Sounds like fun. I’m excited for you.

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Hooray! Thank you! I feel very validated in having asked this friend for her help, I don’t know why she wasn’t my first call, especially as she was my transporter and moved her horse to our barn days after I moved in. OPE.

Anywho- I love that idea of a chilly seat. I need to remind myself of that and work on having one.

Oh yikes, the thought of a double bridle is a little scary, not gonna lie! But I guess never say never! I’m thrilled that we seem to be going in the right direction now.

Checks out? Or is busy. Every saddlebred I’ve known is a very busy animal. Sort of a “yep yep, that’s great, ok what’s that over there, can I touch it? who made that sound? is this your clothes? what’s that horse doing over there?” kind of running stream of consciousness (obviously I’m anthropromorphizing a bit, but that’s really honestly the behavior).

No need to be embarrassed! :smiley: I didn’t think about it either when I was going through all the struggles trying to figure out my young saddlebred. I’d had 35+ years of riding other breeds and he just stumped me, and he stumped the sport horse trainers I tried to put him with.

The rider is soft and compassionate! So glad you had her work her. Super happy to see the softness and quick reward for the right answer. Especially with the softness in the hand. It’s just not the time to have more contact, which many riders interpret as pulling.

This is so true. I like to think of it as a breathing seat. Whenever a horse is amped up in a negative way, I think about my seat breathing into his back and my hands breathing forward to his mouth. The natural tendency for most people is to grip, and while that’s handy during an actual acrobatic move, the opposite needs to occur.

I’m SO glad you’ve made this move!

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Thank you so much! I’m glad we are on a clear path forward, and I’m loving that this friend is teaching us both simultaneously. I have good, applicable homework to do between now and our next lesson with her, and I’m really looking forward to putting these pieces together.

It could just be that she’s busy, and busy might describe it better when she’s on the ground. But even this friend made the same realization that I did that suddenly she just stops under saddle. There’s no gradual slowing down or any way to really anticipate it–she just stops. My friend thinks that it’s just a mental block, like she stops to process what she’s doing, then carries on. It’s just interesting. But I’m glad to know that this breed is so busy. She’s not spooky or anything, but she just needs to be involved and investigate absolutely everything, lol

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Suspect the stopping is learned behavior, she got unintentionally trained to do it by a series of ineffective riders that miscommunicated what they wanted her to do (like frame up perhaps or something was bothering her) and she thought she was being rewarded when she got to stop and stand with frustrated rider who couldn’t find the go switch. Kind of a mess but very typical.

Crap like this usually schools out with consistent riding and repetition. Took a long time to learn. Takes twice as long and much patience to unlearn and relearn.

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If you don’t want to ride Saddleseat, you really don’t have to. I never rode Holly Saddleseat.

As others have said, these horses are very versatile. It’s not their fault that the breed registry has for so long only promoted SS to the point that people start thinking that’s all they can do.

There was an ASB named Brave who finished the Tevis Cup “okay to continue” and in a respectable, middle of-the-pack position. That was a mother-daughter pair. You may have heard of the daughter’s mount - a hackney pony named Flash who was the smallest equid ever to finish the Tevis.

ASBs are also showing up more in eventing and doing well there.

Nana Equestrian Training (and others) on FB trains and shows Dressage with ASBs.

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Saddlebred horses have made it up to Prix St. Georges.

Although I’m a member of the breed association, I’m not a fan of some of their actions in the past. They have only recently started actually rewarding the “horses who do it ALL” and joined with the USEF. Now a horse can get a CH-SH designation whereas before, that designation didn’t exist, they only promoted SS with the “Peacock of the Show Ring” line and they still haven’t BANNED the messed-up tails.

Getting the breed registry straightened out is a work in progress and I’m sure I’m not the only person who has answered their questionnaires with some of these types of comments.

How do you want to ride Honey? She will help you figure that out.

Do you know what her breeding is? What information do you have about her usage history?

If she has shown, she will have the same gaps in her training that Holly did. Holly’s seller had taken her through the futurities where she did ok, then in the ridden divisions.

I’ve since learned that the way they handle the ASB show horses is different. I had to teach Holly to stand tied. She didn’t know how. Nobody had ever asked her to. She was a show horse. They took her from her stall, someone held her while she was tacked up, the rider mounted, they went out and did their thing, and came back in. Someone held her while she was untacked and then groomed and put back in her stall.

So nobody had ever expected her to stand tied. At the first barn I had her at, there were some real cowboys who were a real help with this. She also didn’t like being tied in the wash rack. I could, with finesse, get her into the wash rack, but she didn’t like it once in. Eventually, one day, she decided to really push it. I wish I had taken a picture of her playing tug-o-war with the wash rack. People were asking me if I was going to intervene, and I was “No.” If that situation was going to go south, it would be all on her. I wasn’t going to put myself in the middle so she could blame me/connect me to the “south” part. She tried to pull herself apart for about 15 or 20 minutes. She wasn’t panicking. She was trying to pit her physical strength against the bull-snap on the wash rack and her halter. Thanks be that the halter won. (a Parelli rope halter someone had given me).

Now, she will stand tied just fine. I never did succeed with cross-ties.

AND, My gal was skinny when I got her too (the great recession had hit, and her seller had hit hard financial times). Here’s a before and after in the wash rack i was telling you about. In these photos, she’s 5. When I had the vet come out to look at her, his first words were, “Easy to lose weight, hard to bring it back!” We brought her back by just giving her all the Alfalfa pellets she could eat, all the time.

In the second photo there, you see how she’s fidgeting in the rack. She’ll do it, but not happy.

Now, about saddles and skinny horses. I read where you were trying to fill in that gap with shims. If it were me, I’d stay away from shims in this case. Imagine what happens to the horse/saddle combo when you put your foot in the stirrup - The saddle pulls down with your weight. The outside shims push up against the side of her spine because she has no topline. I’d bet that part hurts. Not because she has any intrinsic physical issues, but just because of how the whole thing is working on HER, NOW.

If she were mine, I’d get away from shims and go to lots of cushy padding. Thick wool Toklat pads and a Merino wool half pad. She doesn’t have any cushion of her own, so I’d give her some extra that is nice and soft.

Just my 2¢.

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Much better rider for Honey. She has feel. She picks up on the little things. Honey looks so much better, too.

For calming oneself, I suggest using whatever mental imagery works – sitting chilly, breathing seat, whatever. I think of myself as part of the horse, my legs are draped around the horse, I’m one with the horse. We are primates, and our in-born responses IMO are to grip with our legs and grab with our hands, but those actions are counter-productive when riding. But one can’t necessarily relax just because someone else says to do so.

Someone who has been previously scared while riding might tense up, squeeze, and grab – the step on the gas while simultaneously hitting the brakes. Kinda like stunt drivers getting the Tokyo Drift – which is not a move I personally want to experience on horseback.

One piece of quieting self-talk I’ll share is that there have been times I’ve reminded myself that I won’t get hurt (not that I’ve ever been injured riding) as long as the horse is between me and the ground. Therefore, it’s unnecessary to clamp legs on, or hang onto the reins for dear life, or panic in any way. All I have to do is stay in the middle of the horse (and not hold my breath). That’s it. This allows me to relax, which in turn calms the horse.

Everything is feel, balance and feel.

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While I agree to not death-grip with your legs, many horses (especially sensitive ones) get more amped up when you do this. The sudden change, maybe feeling a bit abandoned sets them off worse. Then they’re lit and you’re trying to put an absent leg back on and then they get MORE lit.

Not to mention a little leg is needed to stay on that spook. :slight_smile:

Those are just my experiences with my late, very sensitive/hot, mare. Keep your leg ON. You can’t ride well if you can’t use your aids.

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Not suggesting you have to ride her SS forever or even at all. Just that mastering some of those techniques with a good, effective trainer on a finished horse is going to help you understand Honey and her to understand you. And its FUN.

Anytime you have access to quality trainers and horses, its a plus to work with them regardless of discipline. We have all remarked in how soft and effective this rider is, soft ask, quick to reward and how well the horse goes for her. That will transfer to any other discipline. Maybe you sit differently, stirrups are in a different place and you hold your hand(s) higher but the other 90% of being an effective rider is the same regardless. Take the opportunity.

Echo the poster above, do you know anything about Honey’s background and/or breeding? Often clues can be found there that help with the process of getting to know new horses. Somebody must know something about her given her uncommon color and markings.

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I guess I should have described it better. Of course, one would be reining back during a spook, but keeping the legs off the sides prevents the double-message of clamping on the sides, like a scared primate, saying “Let’s go!!”, while simultaneously reining back. And you can keep stirrups while off the sides. I’ve done it. Think of the bottom of a triangle. This position gives the rider a wider stirrup base against whatever way the horse wants to jump.

The horse won’t feel abandoned because you are on the reins. Rider is just saying one thing instead of two opposite things.

That’s certainly possible, thank you!

Speaking to versatility, years ago someone gave us what was supposed to be a NSH but considering his mysterious past, who knows, he could have been straight Saddlebred, he definitely had Up Telescope. My husband rode him many miles in the wilderness at a pretty fast clip with lots of animation ha ha Something in his past had really messed him up b/c he would sometimes do the check out thing and have a high speed miles long panic attack that we never did figure out and was beyond our capabilities. He wasn’t an easy horse but on his good days he was one of my DH’s favorite mountain horses.

Tom and Battleship

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That’s why I personally like to think of my legs draped around the horse – I’m in contact, but I’m not squeezing the breath out of my horse.

It’s a nice, friendly arm across the shoulders kind of thing, not a bear hug.

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Thank you for this super thoughtful response. Your girl Holly is beautiful! I’m doing similar to you and making sure Honey gets Alfalfa pellets.

I’m excited to take SS lessons to learn more about how I can help Honey and what she is bred to do. But who knows-- I was pretty close minded to Dressage for a long time, and now I love it. I’m open to trying new things!

I’d like to do Dressage and some low level jumping with her. And then just have some fun. If we wanna go on a trail-cool. If there’s a hunter pace- I’m in! I just want to be able to try new things and have fun with her. No major show goals. Just some local things.

I don’t know much about what she had done previously. She had a foal 3 years ago and since then has done the occasional beginner lesson supposedly, and before that may have been a trail horse. I still don’t have her papers (UGH. Working on it!) If anyone knows how to get breeding info, or has an ASHA membership that can help look this up, her Reg. Number with ASHA is 147483M.

Solid points on the shims. Interested to see how the saddle fitting appointment goes tomorrow.

Your mare’s registered name is:

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No registered offspring.

Registry:

Contact Us

American Saddlebred Horse Association
4083 Iron Works Parkway
Lexington, KY 40511

Registry: (859) 259-2742

Transfers: (859) 259-3883

General : (859) 259-2742

Fax : (859) 259-1628

Office Hours : Monday through Friday, 8:00 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. (Eastern Time)

Let them know what’s going on and they can guide you.

:slight_smile:

Thank you!

I called them a few weeks ago and explained, and they said it would be retroactive. I’ll call again and see if there’s anything they can say/do to help this process.

Update: I have a saddle seat lesson on an ASB Thursday at 6pm!

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Private Dancer is a lovely stage/show name (with or without the Eldorado). Will look sophisticated on a stall or halter nameplate and easy for any announcer. Good that she knows who she is now.

And you know we want a full recap of your SS lesson on Thursday.

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Yeah, Private Dancer is a nice name and a good song!

I’ll definitely keep you posted on the lesson. I’m excited to give it a try!

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