Horse Shopping Advise

[VivaLaVida119]

Long time horse owner (thanks bank of mom and dad!) but first time horse buyer as an amateur. I’m working with a long time trainer who I trust, but given I was a teenager when my last horse was purchased I’d love some advice for how to go about this process.

We had a meeting where I told her my budget and what I was looking for, but haven’t heard anything since. I’m not sure how much I should be following up or driving the process. I don’t have anything to ride in the mean time so I’m worried about trying horses when I’m out of practice. I’m with a show barn that’s also super busy and I have a much smaller budget than her existing clientele so I know this isn’t a huge priority.

I feel pretty confident in being able to choose the right horse, understand the vetting, etc. but would love any advice you might have on the logistics/process and business side of horse buying.

Thanks!

[NancyM]

It sounds like you have already employed someone who knows you to do this job for you. Since your budget is much smaller than her existing clientele in his/her business, YOU are not a priority for this person. The less money you have to spend, the fewer suitable horses are available for you to consider, and the less your coach will gain in terms of commission. It becomes harder to find such a horse under these conditions, and making time to attempt to find one for less profit for the coach does not make too much financial incentive to spend much time on it. Therefor you may have eliminated yourself from the aid in the search for a suitable horse.
If you are “pretty confident” about being able to choose “the right horse” for yourself, why have you engaged the help of your mentor at all? If you go out on your own, looking at horses offered for sale, and find one that you really like, you can offer to pay your coach a fee to give their opinion on that horse once you have found it, if you feel you need to do that. Otherwise, go a find and buy a horse you like without your coach’s input. It’s not against the LAW to do that. Maybe you will find a diamond in the rough.
Good luck! Choose wisely!

[fivestrideline]

Maybe have a chat with your coach - since your budget is smaller, they aren’t as incentivized to push hard to find you something ASAP. Though I imagine they’d be making more money off of you if you had something to ride… Anyway, ask them if they’d be willing to look at video and help you weed out options that you’ve found yourself. Having someone look at video, go with you to sit on horses, and keep your head on straight so you don’t buy something entirely unsuitable is VERY valuable. They may not have the connections to find you something in your budget, but they can still help you with this.

I don’t love it when this happens - a fully involved client getting less help because they don’t have $200k to spend - because I think it’s unfair. Then the client goes out, frustrated, and buys something on their own and half the time the coach is unhappy with the choice . Whatever. A conversation is due here I think, to get on the same page and maybe discuss maybe a day-fee or hourly fee instead of a commission?

[findeight]

Just ask them, nicely, if they have seen anything lately that might suit you.

Most trainers have extensive networks of contacts and trainer could very well be letting them know what she is looking for but successful trainers are very busy people and it may take them awhile to get the word out. Plus you are looking for a scarce commodity. It will take time.

Touch base with trainer and try to be patient. I have bought what you are looking for through successful trainers but it took time for them to surface. You could suggest the video idea but if trainer has good contacts, they will already know the horses in most of those videos.

You see trainers clumping together talking all the time at shows, what do you think they are doing? Wheeling and dealing and pitching sale horses to each other is the biggest part of it and most good possibilities are going to be through word of mouth concerning known horses…but, again, that takes time.

[Bogie]

@fivestrideline

Anyway, ask them if they’d be willing to look at video and help you weed out options that you’ve found yourself. Having someone look at video, go with you to sit on horses, and keep your head on straight so you don’t buy something entirely unsuitable is VERY valuable. They may not have the connections to find you something in your budget, but they can still help you with this.

I have frequently engaged my coaches at this level. I paid their time, their expertise and their knowledge of what was a good match for me. I wasn’t spending big bucks and they might not have been enthusiastic about going on an extensive search but I very much valued their input and were happy to look at the horses that I found and was interested in.

I always take someone with me when I go try a horse, even if it’s just a horse-knowledgeable friend. Two reasons: I know many people who’ve been injured trying horses, so you need someone who can pick up the pieces and second, sometimes you need someone to say that just because the horse is pretty, the fact that it’s not sound should be more important!

Of course, when I bought a horse last spring, my friend told me seconds after I dismounted that I had to buy her. Luckily, when my coach saw her, she agreed.

[BellaFortuna]

Your horse buying experience sounds similar to one I had. Sending a private message.

[spurofthemoment]

@findeight

Most trainers have extensive networks of contacts and trainer could very well be letting them know what she is looking for

This was exactly my experience - I ended up buying from one of my trainer’s connections whom she had previously bought horses from. I did buy off the videos and existing PPE, but I was also leasing from my trainer at the time and am a fairly competent rider. I got exactly the horse that was described in the ad, and I love him to bits.

If you’re familiar with who your trainer has bought from or worked with in the past, snoop around on Facebook to see what they might be advertising! Then, send ad to your trainer saying “I like this one that so and so has available.” That’s exactly what I did to find my guy.

[Jo]

Before you strike out on your own, make sure you have an understanding about your trainer’s commission process. It very well may be that he/she expects a commission on a purchased horse entering the barn even if you do the purchase entirely on your own.

[greysfordays]

@VivaLaVida119

I don’t have anything to ride in the mean time so I’m worried about trying horses when I’m out of practice.

Small point, but try not to worry too much about this, though I absolutely understand the concern. While it can be embarrassing to be a bit out of practice riding new horses, you actually want to know, as an amateur, what happens when you make a mistake. You want to chip, you want to leave long and weak because chances are, you will when you own the horse.

[Farosh]

I disagree with this as a rule.
Definitely might be accurate for some people, but not everyone.

When you have a client with a big budget, it’s much easier to find what you want.
I work 10x harder for my clients with low budgets because I still want to have high client satisfaction and bring in high quality horses to my barn that jump well.
I actually charge higher commission for cheaper horses for this exact reason.

Finding a ch/ad jumper for 80k is easy peasy, people give you the red carpet treatment and are extremely flexible about payment plans. And clients who have 80k in cash tend to be more understanding that the horse may only last them 2-3 years if they are planning to consistently move up in height and will have significantly less resale value.

People who have scraped everything they have together for a 20k horse more often expect the horse to last them forever, and if it doesn’t sometimes even think the horse should have higher resale value if they do want to sell in the future. Therefore if you’re trying to find them something that will suit their usually equally ambitious goals as the person with 80k, you have to really know the rider and really filter through a LOT of horses with quirks or different issues to find the one with the right quirks for that person. And not to mention that they have vetting limitations.

For example my clients bought 3 horses doing the 1.0m jumpers, one was 75k, one 20k, and one 25.

The 75 k horse took me 1 day to put together a list of 9 horses to try that all have records up to the 1.35s, all horses were extremely fun and easy for the client to pick from and and just had to choose the one with the personality he liked the most. Horse was 10, placed top 3 in FEI 1.35s many times, top 3 in 1.0ms almost every class with a bad riding junior in US for a year. Perfect vetting. Is EXTREMELY easy to ride.

25k horse is 13, super green for her age, very hot for kid, jumped 1.0m at local shows but has no USEF to prove it, 3 of the horses we tried were WAY too strong, one we tried to buy had way too bad of x rays, like severe arthritis in both front feet and was extremely difficult to tack up and handle. Took me 3 weeks to create a list to go try. And when I start making a list it’s something I work at like every single free moment of the day I have. Had great PPE.

20k horse, took 3 months, owners did not want to do a PPE, has GREAT usef but is pretty sulky, SUPER spooky (not at jumps, but is super spooky and stuck when alone in the ring) but then also strong once it gets going. I also suspect horse does not have a good PPE as she gets very sore if you over prep her for kid which is difficult considering how spooky and strong she gets.

All of these horses are great warmbloods that are super honest and love to jump and capable of doing the 1.0m division.

But the cheaper ones were harder to find and are older and harder to ride.

[Annie10]

Don’t the lower budget purchase lines pay the same for training , board, lessons, showing etc?
Then I think that if the client is getting pushed to the back of the bus for purchase that trainer is being short sighted.
I agree with those who said you can look on your own then if/when you find a good prospect consult with the trainer. But there’s nothing wrong with you doing it on your own either and taking a knowledgable friend with you.
Just never get on anything if the owner won’t ride it or have someone ride it for you first. No one needs to get hurt.

[Ponyplusaninch]

I agree re: short sighted, but alas this is more typical than not IME. :-/ Trainers make a lot of money off of commissions, and the commission on a $100k+ animal is more than a $25k+ one.

When I was horse shopping with a sub $30k budget, I tried to make it worth my trainer’s while by being willing to pay higher commission, even if I negotiated the price down on a horse (which I did for my most recent purchase–there was no way I was paying what he was marketed at because there were too many question marks). So as an example, even if the pony cost me $15k, I’d still pay a full 10% commission on the $30k budget we’d talked about/the horse was marketed as.

OP I don’t know what terms you and your trainer talked about, but it might be worth having a conversation to be sure your trainer has enough incentive to help you find that right horse–even if it does take time. I know a number of trainers who have a tiered commission structure where it’s more for a lower budget and then goes down as the purchase price goes up.

[albytb]

Has anyone else been at barns that made you pay commission regardless if there was any assistance by the barn in the sales process? I had that once

[BAC]

That’s not so unusual in my area, barn owner or management gets a commission for any new horse purchase moving into the barn.

[VivaLaVida119]

Thanks everyone for your responses! Condensing my answers into one reply for the more frequently mentioned topics:

I’ve for sure decided to work with a trainer on my horse search mostly because I’d like to outsource the work - I definitely look around online quite a bit but I work a corporate job so don’t have a ton of time to dedicate to this.

I definitely appreciate the advice to have another conversation on expectations/incentive. I’m pretty sure the commission structure remains the same from when I was horse shopping as a kid and my budget is definitely reasonable for what I’m looking for (while most of our clients have big budgets she’s bought horses for herself/working students/pros similar to what I’m looking for). I really like the idea with suggesting a flat commission for the top of my budget regardless of if we find something under that.

Absolutely crazy (and possibly illegal?) trainers are expecting commissions for any horse that comes in the barn! I’ve never heard of that being a requirement in my area and would definitely give me a lot of pause to work with a barn with that kind of business practice.

[IPEsq]

A friend of mine was shopping in the past few years and had to pay a commission on any horse she bought (trainer assisted or not) to a trainer she meets at shows… she doesn’t even board with the trainer!

[Kirsten]

@IPEsq

A friend of mine was shopping in the past few years and had to pay a commission on any horse she bought (trainer assisted or not) to a trainer she meets at shows… she doesn’t even board with the trainer!

I don’t get it - why would someone agree to such an arrangement?

[Annie10]

I agree. I’m not in the habit of paying people for work they didn’t do.

[findeight]

I do not agree with it but it is not illegal as long as it is disclosed upfront. It is their business and, if boarding the horse, their property so your choice to join that barn or look elsewhere.

[NC001]

How would the trainer be able to enforce the payment though? Do they have their clients sign contracts before working with them? You could just end the relationship before buying the horse.