My husband’s paint horse, that we are getting in shape for hilltopping, is tripping a lot. He is mainly tripping with his front feet. He is a 7 year old paint, is in good shape overall, with not a lot of cross-country experience. Basically, he is a WP horse.
Today he fell down while going down a dry, gravel, rocky, wash. Luckily, nobody was seriously hurt or shaken up too badly. The ground was pretty rough.
I will contact the Shoer and see if he can do anything different. He was shod 4 weeks ago, wide webs and front pads due to the severe rocky conditions that we are riding. (pretty common to use pads around here if you want to break out of a walk)
I’ve had two horses with EPM when I lived in OK. This guy did live in OK for 4 years but usually sxs seem more hind end than front end, I thought?
Can he learn to pick his way through the rocks and be more careful or is he just a klutz?
I’ve got a stumble-prone Paint too. While I don’t hunt him (I capped a few times on him), I do trail ride over some pretty trappy ground sometimes.
What worked wonders for him this summer was getting a new farrier to really bring the break-over point back on his front feet and shorten his toes. (This is usually done via rolled toe or rocker toe shoes.)
I will ask my farrier about some rolled or rocker toes. He cut his heel by interfering a couple of times which also makes me think he needs to get that break over point back a little, too.
His heel, toe length seems good and so does his angle. I’m really happy with the farrier so I’ll see if he can change his shoeing to fix the problem.
I wonder if I should take him out and do some specific exercises during the week to help too? Either in the arena or on the trail. I have access to an awesome trail system so the trails are best, though I do have to haul a few miles.
My OTTB has always been really sure footed, except when he had EPM. Then it was a hind end problem where he would wobble and slide downhill. This seems much more like a shoeing or even a laziness problem. Like he’s really not aware of his feet and where to place them. Which makes me think he could learn to be more sure-footed.
So much difference between him and his mother, who has lived on rough pasture her whole life. I guess living in a stall and working in an arena, that body awareness probably never was developed like it would in a pasture or trail horse.
I know how I will be raising and training any future fox hunter!
Also, if the horse has a history of WP in an arena, he may just need time and miles going cross country to learn how to place his feet more carefully. Even at home, schooling should be done out in the pasture vs a groomed arena. I like to school in rolling hay fields where you can practice trotting and galloping up and down hills but if you come off it is a fairly soft landing! While schooling this way it helps to keep the hip angle a bit more open so you don’t topple over their front end when they bobble. Good luck!
I wish I had a choice of rolling hay fields. I have the choice of rough, rocky desert or flat paddock. I’m thinking desert would do the most good but probably not the best for me or the hubby when we take a spill.
Oh well, certainly won’t be the first or even tenth for me although I don’t bounce like I used to any more. And my hubby lost his virginity when he fell Saturday so I guess he knows what it’s like now, too.
[QUOTE=Doctracy;5248989]
Basically, he is a WP horse.
This may be your problem. WP horses are bred to be “daisy cutters”…have very little knee action when moving. They also sometimes tend to be heavy on the front end…they are bred and trained to go with a low headset (thankfully not the peanut rollers of a couple decades back but still pretty low). You might try working on training for some front end lightness and also use some poles on the ground to encourage him to step over things rather than just drag his feet around. If he’s never been out on pastures or trail riding he truly doesn’t know about uneven ground and it will likely take awhile to make him aware…start riding relatively flat trails if possible and gradually make them more rough as he learns to watch where he’s putting his feet.
Hmmm. I had a successful WP horse that I hunted from age 6 to 26 (the horse, not me :)) and he never had ‘the stumbles.’ I might expect an occasional trip in a horse unaccustomed to having to pay attention to where he puts his feet but- tripping to the point of falling down would be a concern to me. Could be shoeing would help but I guess if it were mine I’d be officially concerned.
Certainly there are exercises that can help. In the arena, lots of backing and lots of random walking and trotting over just plain poles on the ground. If the horse is paying attention, even poking along at the walk, he’ll stretch or shorten stride to step over a ground pole. If he just klutzes on through, well, I’d be wondering. Also setting up 12 to 18 inch obstacles and just stepping over these can help with strength and coordination.
While I’ve outgrown my need to show western pleasure, I do the above in the arena with young horses and on the trail, will intentionally pick a trail that is nice and wide yet has enough rocks that a horse learns to pay attention where each foot is going- you don’t look for rocks, it’s going to hurt a little. This I have found to be very helpful in getting a horse to understand the consequences of not paying attention (without the rider having to suffer such consequences!).
Another factor could be lack of fitness. I had one qh that would forge a bit when first getting conditioned for hunting, but once he had a couple of weeks of conditioning on him, that forging ceased to happen.
Beverly, I think you’re on the same page as me. Concerned. Looking for things I can do to fix the problem but also concerned that despite this horse’s wonderful attributes as a beginner’s horse that he may just not be safe. Yes, he is officially lazy but in my experience, lazy horse don’t just fall all over themselves for no good reason.
He does keep his head low but going down a wash, isn’t it normal to have head low? However, he may not have the awareness he needs to rock back and slide yet. He isn’t terribly front-end heavy, engages his rear, at least when I ride him for arena work.
I will set up some rails, cavellettis and small jumps at home, see if I can figure out how to get him to use his body more appropriately.
One interesting feature about his personality which could contribute. This horse seems incapable of getting mad or irritated. For instance, my TB gelding tripped a little twice in a row while walking the other day. It made him mad and the third rock he went over he made a great big step. This is what I would sort of expect and what you kind of count on, say when teaching a jumper. You want them to get a little mad about knocking those rails so that they decide it’s better to pick up the feet. I’m not kidding about this horse, you just can’t make him mad. He just sits there and takes whatever you dish out. My trainer that showed him in pleasure used to complain that he just couldn’t light a fire under him. Anybody who’s been around WP knows that if a WP trainer is complaint that a WP horse is too laid back that it is a really severe case of the lazies!!
When my big warmblood got a bit “trippy” it was one of these things:
- breakover point on his hooves wasn’t far enough back, or his feet were long
- he was on his forehand
- or, and this was related to the above, his hocks hurt and he was traveling too heavy in front.
I found that keeping his feet trimmed and working with him to shift his weight back helped a lot. Eventually, though, I had to have his hocks injected. That made a huge difference for him.
Your horse seems young for that so maybe it can fixed by teaching him to rock back and helping him build up his strength so he can sustain it.
There’s little worse than trying to hunt a horse that trips! I had a few heart in my mouth moments before I had my horse’s hocks injected.
Check his shoes, check his hocks, check him for EPM.
Couple of things maybe?
I gotta bring this up because I’ve had personal experience with this problem. I got just too heavy for a horse weight wise once and he started tripping and falling. I had another horse that always tripped badly when I used a certain saddle. He was getting pinched somehow and it caused tripping. And a draft cross I had tripped a lot when he was younger and unfit. He grew outa it but would trip when left on the buckle too much. My farrier “dubbed” his toes and voila! Worked wonders!
Saddle seems to fit and horse/rider appropriate size and weight. Fitness could be an issue. I’ll get his hocks checked as that’s why I retired him from WP, he had a very, very mild hock issue keeping him from winning in the really big shows so that could be it.
As for EPM- any newer, better way to test than spinal tap? My experience with blood work is most horses from Ok/ TX seemed to come up positive and spinal is so invasive I’d almost just prefer to treat. I agree he needs a neuro and eye exam, though.
I like the suggestions of looking at the feet, but I did not see where anyone suggested trying balance shoes. I’ve found that they help a LOT with horses that have a tendency to be a bit “trippy.” We also had a QH/Perch/Appy come to the farm in the spring, he had a tendency to trip when he wasn’t engaging his hind end and was just “plodding” along instead of actually working. When I actually made him work and not just go along, he was fine (and with a good bit of fitness in him).
I have another who had issues in his hocks that caused him to trip. He’s an older steeplechaser turned foxhunter.
In my experience stumbling is often caused by knee problems. As long as he’s not in need of shoeing.
If it turns out to just be not knowing that he needs to watch his feet and deal with uneven ground, you can try ponying him out on trail. That way he gets to figure it out without any help and without endangering anyone. Of course this only works if you have another horse that is cool with being ponied off of. Lots of random poles at irregular intervals in the arena also works, as long as you don’t end up telling him where to put his feet, let him figure it out.
EPM can hit the front feet as well as the back. Depends on where on the spinal column the protozoan habitats. Have an EPM test done. It doesn’t matter where the horse lived – studies are now showing that the protozoan has a far wider range of habitat than the lowly opossum.
Regarding your horses shoes - in my experience, many horses that trip constantly do so because of the shoeing. Is the wide web a flat shoe, or does it have a break-over at the front? If it is a flat plate, then the horse is probably catching the edge. Have both front and hind shoes changed to something like a St. Croix Eventer shoe which has a complete breakover on the entire rim. A proper equine sporting shoe – like the Eventer – might be the difference between night and day for your horse…and completely end the tripping. 
[QUOTE=Flypony;5257396]
In my experience stumbling is often caused by knee problems. As long as he’s not in need of shoeing.[/QUOTE]
Not in need of shoeing. Knee problems, I would have never considered.
BTW, any tips on how to teach novice rider to get lazy horse to ride with engagement on trail? I haven’t even taught him what leads and diagonals are yet. He just now is getting used to cantering and posting. He learned a three point position last week. (sort of, lol)
I thought tripping may be a sign of navicular disease…
[QUOTE=gothedistance;5257541]
EPM can hit the front feet as well as the back. Depends on where on the spinal column the protozoan habitats. Have an EPM test done. It doesn’t matter where the horse lived – studies are now showing that the protozoan has a far wider range of habitat than the lowly opossum.
Regarding your horses shoes - in my experience, many horses that trip constantly do so because of the shoeing. Is the wide web a flat shoe, or does it have a break-over at the front? If it is a flat plate, then the horse is probably catching the edge. Have both front and hind shoes changed to something like a St. Croix Eventer shoe which has a complete breakover on the entire rim. A proper equine sporting shoe – like the Eventer – might be the difference between night and day for your
horse…and completely end the tripping. :)[/QUOTE]
Very good information. Thank you so much! I’ll be talking to the Shoer about changes. If no improvement, will be getting him checked for EPM. I have had my fair share of misery with EPM, one lost, one with some rear end weakness so I sure hope this doesn’t go that direction. Fingers crossed.
[QUOTE=Doctracy;5257606]
Not in need of shoeing. Knee problems, I would have never considered.
BTW, any tips on how to teach novice rider to get lazy horse to ride with engagement on trail? I haven’t even taught him what leads and diagonals are yet. He just now is getting used to cantering and posting. He learned a three point position last week. (sort of, lol)[/QUOTE]I can’t help you much with the riding issues so much, I am a racehorse trainer, had a bigggg barn, and most horses that stumble will have or do have issues in their knees. I hate it when I see them start stumbling, an aside that is not related but you may find interesting, when a good gate horse starts breaking slowly, again look to the knees about 95% of the time.
