I was hoping that someone might know how many hands Vice Regent was.
Do his lines tend to be on the small side?
TIA
We’re running at Woodbine tomorrow. If I remember, and have time, I’ll pop into the Racing Hall of Fame and see if they have that info posted.
No clue where this info comes from, but Sport Horse Database has him at 16.2:
I believe he was fairly big, especially for being by Northern Dancer. I vaguely remember reading that when he was at stud. Wasnt much of a runner, but went to stud simply because his older full brother was a champion (Viceregal). Viceregal was a bust, but Vice Regent became a top sire.
I know as a broodmare sire, Vice Regal’s offspring were typically tall. I did a check and nothing I came across mentioned size. The pictures I came up made him to appear tall and sturdy, but pictures can be confusing. With 60 stakes winners to Vice Regal’s credit including Deputy Minister, it appears that even if he was a runt he threw competitive offspring on both sides of the pedigree.
Interestingly enough, off the top of my head, proficient sires by Northern Dancer were for the most part much larger than ND, but ND could be accurately characterized as a runt. I recall reading a couple of books about Vincent O’Brien, a great Irish trainer enamored with ND, who specifically traveled to the USA to purchase ND offspring. He liked large sturdy racehorses.
Why do you ask about Vice Regal’s size?
We had foals by Deputy Minister and Deputy Commander. Both were disappointingly small (15.2h range). So it may be that Vice Regent was the anachronism? Both dams were 16+ hands, so they would not have been responsible for the lack of height.
I’ve had quite the number of Deputy Minister horses and I recall them all being smallish.
I never believe any published heights on thoroughbred stallions anyway-- racing people are just as susceptible to exaggerating height as anyone else in the horse world! :lol: If Vice Reagent was advertised at 16.2h like his Sporthorse Data page indicates, he was probably more like 16h in actuality.
I was fortunate enough to see both sires in person when I worked for Windfields in Canada and Maryland! Vice Regent I believe was around 16.2 and with a huge shoulder and neck, although this was when he was breeding. Deputy Minister was probably not quite as tall, maybe shorter through the leg, but very stout with a equally impressive hip and shoulder! Two of the most beautiful stallions I have seen in person, both with beautiful intelligent heads and those gorgeous big liquid eyes, just oozing class 
[QUOTE=Shammy Davis;7825082]
I know as a broodmare sire, Vice Regal’s offspring were typically tall. I did a check and nothing I came across mentioned size. The pictures I came up made him to appear tall and sturdy, but pictures can be confusing. With 60 stakes winners to Vice Regal’s credit including Deputy Minister, it appears that even if he was a runt he threw competitive offspring on both sides of the pedigree.
Interestingly enough, off the top of my head, proficient sires by Northern Dancer were for the most part much larger than ND, but ND could be accurately characterized as a runt. I recall reading a couple of books about Vincent O’Brien, a great Irish trainer enamored with ND, who specifically traveled to the USA to purchase ND offspring. He liked large sturdy racehorses.
Why do you ask about Vice Regal’s size?[/QUOTE]
Actually, many of Northern Dancer’s best sons were small and built like him, with the most glaring exception being Nijinsky II. Nureyev, Danzig, Lyphard, were all smallish horses.
[QUOTE=halo;7825403]
Actually, many of Northern Dancer’s best sons were small and built like him, with the most glaring exception being Nijinsky II. Nureyev, Danzig, Lyphard, were all smallish horses.[/QUOTE]
Also Sadlers Wells, Dixieland Band, and The Minstrel.
[QUOTE=Shammy Davis;7825082]
Why do you ask about Vice Regal’s size?[/QUOTE]
We have a Cape Town broodmare out of a Vice Regent mare who we are considering breeding to a sporthorse stallion (which is why I ask about size). The mare is about 15.3-16hh. All of her foals have been beautiful and correct and sound (though no stakes winners yet ;)) but looking back now I see that the smallish ones have all been from ND lines (even when the sires were in the 16.1hh range). Her most successful runner was by Victory Gallop, though she is on the small side at about 15.2hh. The mare has a Freud 2-year-old filly who’s probably more like 15.1.
I am looking at both warmblood and TB stallions though would love to breed for a full TB. One stallion I am looking at is a beautiful Vice Regent grandson. Though he is purported to be 16.1hh himself, I am a little concerned about inbreeding to Vice Regent as we would prefer to get something 16hh+.
I’ve got to say though that this mare has a really wonderful temperament, which from what I have heard might be at least partially attributable to Vice Regent.
[QUOTE=EAY;7825723]
We have a Cape Town broodmare out of a Vice Regent mare who we are considering breeding to a sporthorse stallion (which is why I ask about size). The mare is about 15.3-16hh. All of her foals have been beautiful and correct and sound (though no stakes winners yet ;)) but looking back now I see that the smallish ones have all been from ND lines (even when the sires were in the 16.1hh range). Her most successful runner was by Victory Gallop, though she is on the small side at about 15.2hh. The mare has a Freud 2-year-old filly who’s probably more like 15.1.
I am looking at both warmblood and TB stallions though would love to breed for a full TB. One stallion I am looking at is a beautiful Vice Regent grandson. Though he is purported to be 16.1hh himself, I am a little concerned about inbreeding to Vice Regent as we would prefer to get something 16hh+.
I’ve got to say though that this mare has a really wonderful temperament, which from what I have heard might be at least partially attributable to Vice Regent.[/QUOTE]
Interesting about temperament because I’ve heard that Regent’s full brother Vice Regal was somewhat ornery.
As a thought, look at Eventing stallions. Many of them are TB close up since the Eventing people want > 60% “blood”. You might find a good stallion who can crossover and fulfill both your requirements.
Event horses also tend to be big, so a stallion who sires good sporthorses AND is big would be a triple bonus.
Just thinking how you might do this research – Perhaps go to the Rolex site and look at entrants. I think you will find each horse’s breeding listed.
Also, a Caro line horse would be a real find. His offspring are great sporthorses.
If you want height, find a stallion from His Majesty/Pleasant Colony. They all tend to be about 17h. They make excellent sport horses.
My personal experience with Deputy Minister grandget is that they tend to max out at about 16.1.
[QUOTE=summerly;7825326]
I was fortunate enough to see both sires in person when I worked for Windfields in Canada and Maryland! Vice Regent I believe was around 16.2 and with a huge shoulder and neck, although this was when he was breeding. Deputy Minister was probably not quite as tall, maybe shorter through the leg, but very stout with a equally impressive hip and shoulder! Two of the most beautiful stallions I have seen in person, both with beautiful intelligent heads and those gorgeous big liquid eyes, just oozing class :)[/QUOTE]
How cool that you worked with both of them. What were their dispositions like?
I have a grandson of Vice Regent out of Moire Dawn. He’s about 16.1 I’m fine with that size. He does have a good temperament. He’ll try like crazy for you.
[QUOTE=EAY;7825723]
We have a Cape Town broodmare out of a Vice Regent mare who we are considering breeding to a sporthorse stallion (which is why I ask about size). The mare is about 15.3-16hh. All of her foals have been beautiful and correct and sound (though no stakes winners yet ;)) but looking back now I see that the smallish ones have all been from ND lines (even when the sires were in the 16.1hh range). Her most successful runner was by Victory Gallop, though she is on the small side at about 15.2hh. The mare has a Freud 2-year-old filly who’s probably more like 15.1.
I am looking at both warmblood and TB stallions though would love to breed for a full TB. One stallion I am looking at is a beautiful Vice Regent grandson. Though he is purported to be 16.1hh himself, I am a little concerned about inbreeding to Vice Regent as we would prefer to get something 16hh+.
I’ve got to say though that this mare has a really wonderful temperament, which from what I have heard might be at least partially attributable to Vice Regent.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=ravenclaw;7828060]
How cool that you worked with both of them. What were their dispositions like?[/QUOTE]
I only got to visit them, although both seemed very well behaved! N. Dancer and The Minstrel not so much. I galloped yearlings and the older horses at the track and at the farm in Maryland! Lots of pedigree to this day still amazes me!
