To those treating ulcers, I was wondering how you folks administer Gastrogard, do you fast before & after?
My vet explained to me that there are absorption problem especially in hay fed horses. He suggested a 3 hour fast before and 2 hour fast afterward. But can be administered with his grain meal.
This time a year, hot/bugs etc and being on very early morning turnout, I’m trying to figure out where to fit in this 5 hours roughage fast and myself still having some sleep, lol.
I"d also like to know if you feel there are certain supplements that should NOT be fed whilst on GG.
I take it any type of antacids, is countereffective, risks raising the stomach ph too much and causing reduced digestion?
Horse is presently on Outlast, should such be stopped?
Succeed & Equishure can be continued I would have thought?
All you can do is the best you can do. Vets sometimes have unrealistic expectations of how to manage horses.
5 hours of fasting is unrealistic and imo will cause more problems than it will cure.
We administer gastro before am grain (and assume they haven’t consumed much beforehand in their stalls even though they are on free choice hay). We wait half an hour then give grain and turn out.
There’s not an absorption “problem,” per say. Studies show that Omeprazole and Ranitidine are utilized better in an empty stomach, but it has not been proven in any way that they don’t work with food already in the stomach. I agree with dotneko that 5 hours of fasting at each meal, so 10 hours per day, will not help at all. That’s a lot of empty stomach time for a grazing animal. I’ve heard of recommendations of 30-60 minutes fasting before and after, but your vet’s recommendation seems quite excessive to me.
I do not know of any reason to discontinue the Outlast or an antacid. I frequently take a Tums for immediate relief and a Prilosec for long-term relief when having an ulcer flare up.
Thank you, this was also my thinking, that seems a lot of fasting and I keep thinking this really doing more harm than good, not just an empty stomach but also the added stress this is going to give him.
I guess I’ll weigh out his nighttime hay so he runs empty in the early morning hours, so I can give him his GG at breakfast and maybe keep him in for 1 hour after that and then out to grass. This is going to be the best I can do without adding stress & making it more complicated for me.
Okay, good I will continue the Outlast in that case. I was just thinking out loud, thanks
Right, and AFAIK the dosage for UG/GG is as it is base on testing non-fasted horses. Absorption might be increased enough on an empty stomach, allowing you to reduce the dose, but as we can see, that’s just not realistic for most situations, and 5 hours of no food for a horse who already has ulcers is just…cruel.
I agree with dotneko that 5 hours of fasting at each meal, so 10 hours per day, will not help at all.
GG/UG are only given once a day
But for sure if you were using ranitidine at even the 4.5mg/lb twice a day dose, that’s just not such a good idea for these guys
I do not know of any reason to discontinue the Outlast or an antacid. I frequently take a Tums for immediate relief and a Prilosec for long-term relief when having an ulcer flare up.
Me neither, given their relatively short-term effect. I don’t know how long Tums alters pH, Outlast can keep it raised for about 4 hours at the full amount, so unless you’re feeding a full serving at the recommended 3-4 times a day, I wouldn’t worry about it.
That sounds totally reasonable though I don’t even know that you need to do even that
Have you considered trying Nexium? Just a thought, it sure would help expenses.
Thanks JB, yes, I read about the Nexium and was thinking this could get around the problem. But he’s insured and they cover 2 months of GG, so just going to go ahead with that, if follow-up scope shows no improvement or healing, then I certainly will consider Nexium.
We give Gastroguard first thing in the am, about 30 minutes before am grain. Outlast is fine to keep feeding. The only thing you have to be careful with is Sucralfate, as it affects digestion of anything you feed with it.
My horse ended up on ulcer treatment for 2 months instead of 1 because I didn’t follow fasting protocol.
After scoping still showed ulcers after 15 and 30 days of daily full tube treatment I bucked up and did it right.
I gave the Ulcergard 1st thing in the morning and waited 1 hour to feed.
We also feed omeprazole 30 mins before morning grain. All of our ulcer prone horses are on hay nets, so the vets are happy with this way of getting it into them!
