How is this legal? 4 y/o showing 4th level

You couldn’t pay me enough money to touch a horse trained like this. I was just hoping the organization that is supposed to be in charge of horse welfare would actually do something when someone is flagrantly breaking the rules and flaunting it.


Thanks for that. It’s hard when the organization won’t respond, but you can’t be certain they didn’t contact her. I would think her scores from the 4th level tests would be nullified.

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If people are thinking a 62% in test 1 makes a horse “competent” at the level… I’m not sure I can blame the judges for that. No way this horse would be able to do the canter pirouettes in test 2.

I saw a relaxed, quiet and consistent test, and that’s not unnoticed by judges. In fact, when I was scribing once, a gal came in on a very very plain looking horse. Mediocre mover - underwhelming at best. But the gal came in, had very correct geometry, a very consistent ride, did every movement as best she could and the judge commented to me that, despite not having a particularly glamorous ride, she would likely score higher than people who came in on “nicer” and better horses who had some spectacular moments, but also had a few meltdowns.


I did, but they have not responded.


Good idea.


USDF’s website states " A percentage of 65% or higher is generally thought to mean the horse is ready to move up a level." so I don’t think it’s out of line to call a 62% “competent”. YMMV obviously.


I would have assumed if they contacted her she would stop advertising her rule-breaking, but I guess I’m looking at that through the lens of someone who, you know, follows the rules. Good point!


I wonder if you would get any further reporting the ad to the woman’s regional/local/whatever dressage association?

I can’t tell if he’s in Wisconsin or Florida from the website, but the pics say Florida. If you don’t get an acknowledgement from USDF or USEF, try Region 3 (why are they the only region without a website, I wonder).

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Wow. Legalities of the rule aside, what a promising young horse. I hope that he lands in competent hands and has a wonderful, long career. He looks like he will be very special. I don’t see confirmed 4th level movement here, no snark intended.

He goes through the paces in a lovely rhythm, the basics are down, and he clearly has a wonderful brain. Not a bad mover either. Wish I knew his pedigree. He is a great ambassador for the breed. Go TBs. :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:


Sire and dam are listed in either the USEF or USDF database, now I can’t remember which, if you wanted to look him up. I am not tech savvy enough to include the screenshot I took to send to USEF, sorry :frowning:

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I’m not sure they’d have any authority to do anything, but that’s a good idea. Will keep that in my back pocket if the NGOs continue to be unresponsive. Thank you!


I figured it out. It looks like he is by Will Take Charge out of Jumped The Harbor (Jump Start). Not a bad pedigree at all, and I bet his dam moves just as nice if not better than him.


Glad you figured it out! I hope someone picks him up and does age-appropriate training and showing with him. I have zero issues with the horse, just horrified by the ethics (or lack thereof) from the trainer/seller and lack of response from the governing organization.


Cute horse. I can’t speak to the issue of rules but I see nothing in the videos that isn’t what many young OTTB hunters are doing. It doesn’t strike me that this is truly “dressage training” but rather showing a good minded youngster with good gaits, changes, and the soundness/capability to go in straight lines and be obedient to the aids. Some get it quicker than others. Some are ready to do more than others. There’s nothing I see in the video that lots of 4 year old OTTBs are incapable of. We just don’t take them to dressage shows and show them 4th level. We pilot them around little sticks and in flat classes doing-- basically exactly what you see in the video. He does look like a particularly nice one, but nothing about that video shows something I found unexpected in terms of complexity or talent.


when people post ads “no TBS”, this is a good one to send their way :slight_smile:


She posted on 10/27 “ready for 3rd” :woman_shrugging:
So in less than a month: " potential for PSG"
And he jumps willingly.
$45K should get him sold pretty fast.
He does look like a pleasant ride - some tailwringing on the flying changes, but still nice.


Interesting that he’s been for sale for well over six months and was shown second level in September. I’d imagine it’s either a price issue or maybe a vetting issue? He does look like a sweetheart and I hope he gets a soft landing where he won’t be pushed and can develop.


The “non breed-prejudice inquiries only” makes it sound like she’s gotten a lot of people who backed out after they realized he wasn’t a WB.


It appears the seller has finally stripped the mention of “4th level” from at least some of her advertisements, wonder if someone sent her this thread :roll_eyes:

Oh well, screenshots are forever and there’s a paper trail from her show records that have already been sent to USEF.


I bet it’s because he’s TB. I’m sure people were interested up until they found out his breed. The dressage market is quite biased against TBs, even TBs showing successfully at higher levels.

I say this often but, if you took a non-raced (and non-race trained!) TB and put it in a dressage program, you really would never know it was a TB unless you either A. had decades of experience with the breed and raised a lot of young TBs to mature adults (which few people do) or B. you happened to notice a lip tattoo (now defunct).

I’ve said this before on COTH too but back in 2019 I tore my ACL and MCL in a hockey incident. I wanted to keep my TB going so I listed him on a local FB page with a few good videos, his age, his breed, and got crickets. I took down the ad because I decided I wasn’t going to lease him. Then a few weeks later changed my mind again after seeing my instructor ride him. This time I only provided videos of him doing W/T/C and a few conformation photos of him. I had to turn my phone notifications off within the hour, I got so many messages from people who wanted to see him that day/week. This is the same TB people come up to me and ask “what WB registry he’s from”. In my mind he’s a nice horse, but he’s not like Dalera BB or anything. But I think he’s pretty quintessential TB and shows their characteristic versatility and honesty.

Many people have this very narrow definition of TB. When you say TB they think something skinny, rangy, difficult to ride, tense, unsound because of past racing baggage, and usually not a good mover. So when you have a horse that is none of the above, or has good riding quality and characteristics, it can blow them away to learn the horse is TB.