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How many times have you fallen off?

Hunter/Jumper
#41

@supershorty628
Horse being inappropriate is not a factor at all, all horses I ride are amazing horses with plenty of potential and many teach me amazing things, which is why my trainer lends them to me so they can teach me and I can then apply what I’ve learned to my horse. I’m not about to sell my horse just because he isn’t an automatic machine, I’d rather ride a horse that needs to be ridden than one that just takes me everywhere without me needing to apply my aids, sounds boring and for people who don’t actually want a challenge. Already have a friend that has a horse like that, she lent her to me once and though I was able to clear a whole 1.30 course no problem I wasn’t satisfied at all, felt like I did nothing and just sat there looking pretty.

Also foundations I do have, problem is I can get a bit distracted at times due to medical issues. Just today we tried jumping 1.20 course with my horse and he did amazing, not a single stop or even a hesitation even when I got one distance wrong, he helped me out but after that I didn’t get a bad distance to anything. My horse teaches me that i have to apply my aids correctly or at least get a good distance or else he can’t help me out because he isn’t a grand prix horse.

I agree its a huge difference when riding from 1.10 to 1.20, so mistakes are bound to happen. I’m not saying my horse doesn’t help me out once a while, he just won’t do the whole course by himself. He accepts one or two mistakes at most and then he stops or starts to run out which is normal for a horse that isn’t automatic

Verticals are no problem, neither are oxers, but the problem is when its more than one single obstacle but that’s because I’m learning. I have the foundation but I’m still learning new skills that are needed for that height which at 1.20 it switches everything.

As I’ve said before, I am an effective rider but my confidence gets hurt because I hear people always saying that I’m not a pretty rider. I win a lot, every show I enter, even if its with a new horse I borrowed, I end up winning at least 3rd place, but I feel like my riding is bad simply because I don’t look pretty riding. I don’t look dainty or pretty or elegant, but my leg is steady, my approach is usually exact and my horses always pass clean (no bars or refusals) during shows. Usually I only come off when its a very dirty stop or when He stops and I end up getting bumped by the jump, like what happened yesterday that he stopped and ran out, my leg bumped against the side of the jump which unseated me, and I couldn’t hold on.

The young horse is a 5 year old stallion that had been in pasture up until three months ago. He’s getting castrated soon because he rears up and bucks only whenever he sees a mare, but otherwise he moves beautifully and jumps with a lot of scope, only problem is that he can’t really keep it in his pants XD My trainer has a lot of green horses or young horses, besides being a trainer he breaks in horses and/or deals with problematic horses.

Its not that I want to hear but more like you guys are super extreme, immediately saying my trainer isn’t for me or that my horse sucks, so of course i get defensive because there is no truth to it. My trainer is one of the most sought out trainers in the country while my horse, though he isn’t automatic, is an amazing animal that gives his heart out each time in the ring whenever I apply myself, the amount of offers I have gotten for him are insane. I know what a bad horse is, what a horse not appropriate for you is and feels like, my horse isn’t inappropriate for me or else I wouldn’t be winning every time we show or I would be falling off each class or fighting with him each class, which I don’t. If he weren’t appropriate for me i wouldn’t be jumping 1.10 correctly and my trainer wouldn’t be raising the bar a bit and asking more of me. In america do people only have automatic horses? Do you guys give up on a horse so easily after only a few months with them?

#42

@atl_hunter
Thats exactly what I did today. We went back to jumping a few obstacles at 1m and once my trainer saw I had recovered from yesterday (the scare and the way I lost my concentration) we upped the jumps and had a full 1.20 course with no errors. It was simply correcting my hands a bit and making sure my leg was even more steady before the jump and after the jump. We talked and my trainer said that next week we’ll have to work on focusing and concentrating 100% because I keep getting distracted so wish me the best of luck.
You’re right that this sport is in your head, and at first today I was super tense and expecting the refusal so we worked on that and once I was relaxed we eded up doing well.

2 Likes
#43

@Herefordgirl
My horse isn’t automatic but he’s an amazing horse, why the hell would I sell him? I’m incredibly happy with them and proud of the progress he’s made, he’s way more flexible, responsive and jumps higher than before. It might be a me problem, I get insecure hearing other people commenting on my riding and the way I look while riding but usually I give him an amazing ride and we win at every show.

#44

I don’t think at your skill level you should be riding a green broke 5 year old stallion in his first 90 days under saddle that loses his mind when he sees a mare.

As far as your equitation you need to listen to your trainer. If he says you have a problem, fix it.

Who is this “everyone”? The only opinions that matter are those of your trainer and those of the judges. Other than that, it’s just white noise. Especially if it’s coming from frenemies your own age. Young women love to back bite and tear each other down. They will always find something.

But if you don’t like how you ride after watching videos of yourself then you need to fix how you ride. It’s that simple. You need to figure out how to do the work to improve. If you can’t do it jumping 1.2 m on a rank green stallion then you back down to a level where you can work on you.

In general my experience and observation is that when a developing rider is overhorsed their equitation gets defensive and pragmatic and they develop persistent position faults

Obviously a good pro with engrained skills can get on a problem horse and maintain equitation that is both correct and effective.

But developing riders either juniors or adult ammies will invariably develop bad habits to cope with difficult horses.

If you want to improve your overall position and equitation you need to ride at a level inside your comfort zone for quite a while to internalize good position.

I think you are reaching one of those markets where you can’t really go forward productively with position faults and you need to step back a fix them.

Where is your trainer in all thus? Is he happy to have you scrambling over jumps and falling off his young horses?

5 Likes
#45

So you are just on here wanting us to reassure you everything is good despite the fact that by your own admission your riding is neither correct nor effective? And that you are falling off way too often and losing confidence because you are on dirty stoppers?

We are all experienced horse people that have seen lots of juniors succeed and fail in different disciplines and scenarios. We are also folks who take a problem solving approach.

If something isn’t working then what do you change to make it work?

It’s pointless to say “I am losing confidence because I fall off, and my riding is neither correct nor effective, and I’m riding horses that are probably s bit above my current skill set” and then when we give advice that could help you improve in the long term, to.clme back basically saying “there’s no problem, please just pat me on the head and tell me it’s all perfect.”

You know it isn’t. You aren’t a “bad rider” for being overhorsed.

But you are a “bad horse person” if you stick your head in the sand and refuse to realize you are in a dangerous and possibly counter productive situation that only you can make a decision to change.

”‹”‹”‹”‹”‹

13 Likes
#46

@Scribbler
Never fallen off of the young stallion and I’ve even helped his position, but I understand where you’re coming from.

Thats one big problem I have, I get really affected by what people say. When people say I had a horrible round, even when I end up winning first place or i got off the horse feeling super and confident I end up deflating completely and feeling bad about my round. I think I ride really well, at times i can lean a bit forward but usually I have a straight back, my legs are still, and I’m not fighting with my horse but people saying I can’t ride or that I ride ugly just gets me down. Makes me feel like maybe I do ride bad, even when I’ve accomplished a lot.

Thats true, I was over horsed with my last horse and i got a lot of bad habits from it, I would get left behind on jumps or get ahead of the horse because i was bracing for the early take off, I would pull horribly on the horses face/mouth, I would just kick kick kick instead of squeeze, and stopping was me pulling on the horses mouth instead of sitting and using my legs. That was a year ago and now, with my new horse, I’ve been able to get ride of those bad habits, now all i need is to learn to apply my aids when jumping higher, I can’t just stay at 1m.

Never fallen off of one of his horses in the 1.5 years I’ve been with him until yesterday, and yesterday was just me sliding off and landing on my feet because of a rider error, not the horse spooking or having a dirty stop. Once I got corrected I got on and finished my course. Also, he doesn’t give me the real young ones, just ones he believes I can ride properly.

Also, I never said I don;t think I ride correctly or effectively, I ride effectively just not ‘pretty’. I’ve lost confidence because people say that falling off is bad, and part of me believes that every good horse person falls while the other says the opposite. I asked a simple question about whether falling off meant you were a bad rider, I wasn’t saying I fall every day, or every month, and i never said I feel endangered with my horse or that i feel like I can’t with my horse.

#47

It sounds like you are on the right track then!

And if I were you…don’t worry about “looking pretty”! A lot of the riders that look “pretty” aren’t as effective anyways. Much better to be an effective, sympathetic rider than a “pretty” rider! So don’t let that make you think you are a bad rider, at all!

And for the record, I can’t jump that high at all, so you are a better rider than me in that regard :smiley:

ETA: it sounds like you have a big self-esteem/confidence problem more than anything. It’s actually a good thing to look at your rounds later and say, “Yes we won, but I could be working on X and Y”. It doesn’t make you a bad rider if your round isn’t perfect. What DOES make you a bad rider is not trying to fix anything, ever. Like, “Oh my leg swings back too much and I jump ahead but I win anyways so I don’t need to worry about that”. To me, that’s a bad rider. Or one way to be a bad rider, anyways.

Bottom line is, you sound like you do have skill. But it also sounds like either you or your horse have some holes in your training. That doesn’t make either of you bad, and it doesn’t mean you should go sell your horse or fire your trainer. Just means you need to educate yourself on what is going on, and work on fixing it.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting things to change. If you fall off when your horse does a sudden stop and run out, and you don’t do anything to change your horse from doing that, you will keep falling off (or picking up bad habits being too defensive). It sounds like you ARE working on it though, so that’s good.

Basically, don’t be afraid to look at yourself, your riding, and your horse and find what needs to be fixed. Just because there are things to work on doesn’t make you a bad rider. And the first step to being a GREAT rider will be accepting that you might not be as good of a rider as you think you are deep down (and I don’t mean this for just you, it applies to everyone!)

1 Like
#48

Yeah! Thank you, your advice helped me plenty, I ended up talking to my trainer and he was on the same page as a few others who commented on the thread and we worked at low jumps and on my rhythm.

You’re right on that, I’ve seen quite a few olympic riders who look like monkeys on their horses but its impressive to see how comfortable or how well the horses work with them.

You’re also right when you say I have some confidence issues, it just takes me a lot to accept when I’ve had a good round or when I can accept that I do have at least a bit of skill.

1 Like
#49

Young women are socialized to be hyper sensitive to public opinion. And hyper critical of each other. This can lead to social anxiety that impedes competence in sports.

You only get to be a good athlete by going inside yourself and blocking out all that noise. No one ever won a marathon race by having a panic attack half way through that her shorts made her butt look fat.

If the other girls were not being nasty about your riding they would be nasty about your hair cut or your saddle pad or the color of your horse or your brand of helmet.

In other words you just need to block them out, and focus on doing your own best
If you think there is a degree of truth in what they say then you fix your riding yourself.

But you really need to stop listening to rail birds and listen to your coach.

I think it’s one of the reasons young men do better in competition of all kind is they haven’t been socialized to worry about what everyone else is saying. They just try to do their best and try to win. Girls are at a disadvantage from the start because they get sidetracked by social anxiety.

6 Likes
#50

A horse that is appropriate for your skill level =/= a horse that you don’t have to work hard on.

But if you want to hear that everything is fine, which seems to be what you want, I’m sure you can get that somewhere. I’m not going to waste my time with this because you clearly don’t want to hear what people have to suggest that might actually make your situation better.

Don’t sell yourself short. Your situation could be better, more fun, and safer. It’s not about the ribbons.

11 Likes
#51

You aren’t pushing your capabilities if you don’t fall off. I’m not saying every day, but if you aren’t willing to fall off, you will never push past what you feel comfortable doing.

I think I have to be in 500 or more falls. Horses crash, bucks, ejection off young horses, slipping on uneven ground, pushing up the levels in competition, all are some of the reasons I’ve fallen. My two this year so far is a horse ran head long into us as the canter in schooling at a show and the other was a trip and roll warming up in the arena at home.

To me, a rider who has never fallen is a scared rider. They are stiff and not willing to do anything unless it is some perfectly controlled environment. Ask any top jockey. They probably fall off in the 1000s of times range.

I think falling off gives you confidence. You know how to handle things when they go pear shaped. You realize that not all falls are the end of the world and that you can just get back on and try again.

This is why I have a reputation of being able to ride the wildest unbroken horses. At the same time I love training my greenies to jump big and be trusty friends when the fences get huge.

2 Likes
#52

My riding teacher does not have a “pretty” position all the time, and sometimes she gets down on herself about it.

HOWEVER she is one of the most effective riders I’ve seen.

I may well be wrong, and if I am just ignore the rest of what I say.

I am getting the impression that you are not SURE about what exactly is an effective and “pretty” seat over fences.

There is an old book, with lots and lots of pictures, of the jump from take-off, over the fence and through the landing, with all the ugly and ineffective seats shown, described, with the rider’s mistakes analyzed and good, good suggestions of how to improve. It is “Form over Fences” by Jane Marshall Dillon. This lady ran one of the top riding schools in the USA when I was a kid. She taught two riders when they were children who, as adults later, ended up on the US Olympic team and won Olympic medals, Kathy Kusner and Joe Fargis. She took these two kids, both “natural born riders” and gave them the foundation they needed to make it to the top of the heap when they got older.

This book is no longer in print but usually there are plenty of copies available through Amazon, usually for less than $20.00 USD.

This book will give your brain an effective “picture” of what is and what is not a good seat over fences. When I started re-riding I was hoping to get back into jumping and I gave my riding teacher a copy of this book, telling her that if I ever succeeded in jumping again that this book showed what I wanted to do. Unfortunately for me my Multiple sclerosis continued getting worse and I finally gave up that dream, but I most definitely became a better rider for trying to get my position RIGHT. Meanwhile my riding teacher has used this book to get her eye better when she teaches her students.

I fell off the pony the second time I rode. I fell off horses a good bit over the decades (almost 50 years now), on the flat and over fences. The last time I fell was last year. You are not alone.

3 Likes
#53

I kind of agree that there is something to be said for going back to basics when you’re confidence is shaken. I went from jumping reasonably well in the 1.20s to literally back to lunge line lessons and little equitation courses to get my position way more dialed in. It was humbling but really good for me.

I just do not think a dirty stopper is a good idea when you’re trying to make the move from the 1.10 to the 1.20s. This is one of the larger chasms to cross as a rider and should be done with care.

I also think a well schooled or as you say “automatic” horse like the one you were lucky enough to borrow is a thing a beauty. It is not a robot, it is an animal that was given time and care to develop.

When you ride a horse who is very well broke and for whom the job is simple, you learn so much about how to do it correctly. Riding a straight horse often shows you where you are crooked. Riding a horse who helps his rider at the jump teaches you how to someday help a greener horse.

I think most of us here know and appreciate and frankly revere the school master, for they are the best teachers in helping us learn how to do it right in the first place. So that’s what we are hoping for you to have.

7 Likes
#54

I’m curious-- is winning all that matters to you? It seems that you are quite focused on the fact that others comment on your equitation or ability yet you focus on “well I won didn’t I!??” Are you skipping steps to win? Riding rough and ready to get a ribbon is different than building the skills needed to be both “pretty” and effective-- that’s good equitation and horsemanship.

Constantly falling off due to your lack of confidence or eye or missing skills or being mounted on a green or dirty horse is not normal. Can it make you a better, gutsier rider? I suppose so. Is this fun for you?
RAyers has a very different perspective in some senses (perhaps it’s the male rider perspective? The professional rider perspective? The eventer perspective? I don’t know) than my own. I’ve never wanted to ride the green, hot, unbroke challenge you on everything horse. I want to ride a safer, manageable, pleasant horse when I jump around. Call me an old lady (because I am!) but I don’t have fun when each ride is a guessing game of not if I come off through my own mistake or by accident, but when I come off because Horsey is beyond my ability or not ready for the questions.

3 Likes
#55

@RAyers
I agree with you 100%, I would rather challenge myself with horses that need me to ride them so that when I do ride them well, easier horses will seem like a cinch.

The more replies I get the more i notice that people in the US really are sort of up tight, or at least most seem to like everything controlled, 100% safe and no risks. I mean the best of horses are the toughest to ride, the satisfaction you get from finally getting that perfect ride when training hard with a challenging horse is the best feeling ever.

Your reply actually brings me a sense of ease, I hope to be sort of a rider like you that people know I can handle any horse and get them in the right shape and form. And I want to be able to start my own foal one day, make them the way I want them, etc.

#56

@Jackie Cochran
That sounds like a good book! I’ll try to get it. I know I have an effective seat but the problem is I don’t exactly look ‘pretty’. My horses in pictures and videos always look comfortable, at ease, and very willing to jump while i sort of look like a potato at times XD
Thank you for the tips, hopefully I can get the book to be shipped to Mexico or find it around here.

#57

@greysfordays Yeah, I went back to small jumps today, .80 - .90, before doing a small 1.20 6 obstacle course and it really helped my hand position and my confidence.
I ride a couple of ‘forgiving horses’ and they help me learn the tools that i can then apply on my horse, but usually I get an automatic horse maybe twice or three times a week since my trainers horses tend to sell a bit quickly ‘^^ But this one stallion I ride i just love him… wish I could keep him, he doesn’t save every jump but boy is he an amazing guy, helps me out a lot.
But I really love my current horse, he may be a bit tougher but he really does help me at times. As I’ve said before he really isn’t a dirty stopper, only when I don’t ride him well or mess up badly. He has taught me more than I ever thought possible. I used to not even be able to jump a simple crossrail and now I’m jumping 1.10 with ease and climbing up all thanks to my partner.

1 Like
#58

@Calvincrowe
Oh, when i keep repeating that i win I mean to say that I have an effective type of riding style, that no matter what horse I’m given I can be effective with them and usually come out on top. Sorry if it sounds like bragging, I don’t mean to sound pretentious. English isn’t my first language.

I absolutely love riding horses that challenge me, makes me learn to be tougher, ride better, and make myself think fast on my feet because you never know if you might mess up or the horse messes up and you have to be quick to fix it. I don’t like the safe, automatic horses simply because i feel like they do everything for you and I don’t know, might be because I’m young, but I find it boring. makes me not as satisfied when I finish my rounds.

#59

Some of the people on this forum have had quite a bit of success at levels above what you are doing, and I can promise you that they weren’t doing it on “easier, automatic” horses. Although my trainer always said that some of the most effective riders were the ones who made it look easy.

You will get farther when you listen to everything being said to you, not just what you want to hear. You’re young and ambitious and I get that. People are trying to help you. I get the concept of working your way up the levels on a green horse, or on a horse that’s difficult, or whatever - I’ve done it. So have many other people on this forum. But you clearly don’t want advice, you want to hear that it’s totally normal to be having the issues you’re having with that regularity (it’s not), that you’re going to be fine (I hope so), and that having a bunch of blue ribbons means that everything is going great (it doesn’t). You could be safer and ultimately have more fun if you worked on yourself and worked on being a stronger, more effective rider (if you fall off when your horse stops, you’re not tight enough). But hey, live your truth. Win your ribbons. Try not to break your neck in the process.

12 Likes
#60

I started riding when I was six,and I’m almost seventy now. My lifetime estimate is that I’ve come off around seventy times. I did hunting, jumping and lots of showing, tons of lessons and practice, and I just think falling off is part of the deal. In my senior riding(60 till now) I’ve only come off twice, but I’m doing much less really active riding and mostly mosey around on my careful little quarter horse. But falling off is part of riding and nothing to feel bad about. It means you’re riding!

3 Likes

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