Bless your heart. Perhaps you don’t understand the definition of the word “moron?” A person who uses explicitly flawed math to underpin a patently specious argument is a moron. That’s a fairly unassailable assessment. Allow me to reaffirm my belief that @kenyarider made a moronic statement.
I strenuously object to being called a “monster,” or deserving of a “special place in hell,” or assumed to be some sort of Trumpian wingnut for having the audacity to hire people and pay them well.
The “you’re new here” argument is a sort of quiet bullying that some people default to when they lack specific knowledge or insight to otherwise advance a conversation. The OP sought specific knowledge that I possess. My response was an “I know” statement. What has happened thereafter is that the conversation has descended into a series of “I think” arguments. With all respect, the OP was NOT seeking a series of opinions. The OP sought factual knowledge. A handful of people have shared information; many others have responded with opinions…some of which are demonstrably uninformed.
Listen, I hear and understand the concern around employees vs. contractors. I get it. I also get that my owner has a team of advisors and lawyers and other sorts who provide counsel on these matters. I abide their counsel. My sense is that their counsel is not grounded in some theoretical ideal, but, instead, based on the pragmatic realities of our sport. What I can speak to with first-person expertise and knowledge is the process of identifying, engaging, and retaining top-level talent. I have put forth what the compensation levels are in our program. I can speak to why we structure our compensation in this manner. I can appreciate and respect - even if I disagree with - dissenting sentiment. I have a very hard time tolerating being called a “monster” or some similar assessment when I am confident that the program which I am tasked to oversee is an absolute leader in workplace safety, team management, and people support.
In my view, it is an entirely different topic if someone would like to start a thread about fair labor practices in the horse world. This would be very interesting. In the meantime, my program pays fairly, treats its people well, presents world-class horses, and competes with integrity. For better or for worse, the argument around employment vs. contractor is largely an academic exercise as it pertains specifically to our industry - if the horse industry were to overnight mandate that all eligible staff become classified as employees, then what would happen to our sport? My strong suspicion is that many people would suddenly be managing and grooming their own horses. Unemployment would be rampant. So, given the particular dynamics of our industry, I am proud to treat our people with decency and respect their talent. I am equally proud to defend our practices when a moron uses flawed math to suggest that the team that I lead is somehow overworked, underpaid, or subject to poor working conditions.
Let me ask those of you with a dissenting view: Are your grooms employees? Do you provide health insurance? Retirement plans? Are you paying “under the table” or are you properly issuing 1099s and documenting their engagements (if not employees)? Are you providing vacation days? What are your work hours? What are your work place conditions? Do you pay bonuses? Are your grooms legally in the country? Are you supporting the visa processes for them and their families? What is your grooms’ total compensation package? Are you dumping your grooms six deep into a trailer and four deep into a hotel room, or are you providing quality housing to them and their families? I think that there is a “glass house, throwing stones” sort of hypocrisy permeating the responses to my initial post. Here is what I know: When I am tasked to find a new groom, I never have any shortage of top people asking to be considered for the position. At the end of the day, the market speaks - I can attract and retain the top people because my program is a fair and positive work environment. If that weren’t the case, turnover would be astronomical, and new people would be impossible to engage. Such is not the case.
@MHM, the issue isn’t that a moron said something with which I disagreed. The issue is that they misstated facts to justify a specious conclusion that descended into a personal attack.
threads wander away from the original topic all the time. Especially when a poster brags about paying under the table over six figures.