How to handle non-paying client

[qhaftershock]

So this might be better served in off course, but I wanted to get h/j trainer input. I braid and clip professionally, and while I am relatively new at doing it professionally (3 years), I have been very busy and have lots of repeat customers. All of my customers have been pretty great, and I have not experienced a non payment situation until this one (knock wood).

I used to board at a local barn, and moved in the spring (on good terms) to a less expensive facility while I took a break from showing. The barn owner/trainer was the first person I clipped/braided for, and I give her a special price as a thank you for taking care of my horse for years and a thank you for giving me a shot/working through growing pains as my skills developed. I also gave my fellow barn mates a lower price when I boarded there. After I moved my horse, I went back in June to clip for the barn owner and another barn mate wanted her horse clipped too at the last minute.

I owed this barn mate a partial clip (she won a bet we made months prior and if she won I owed her a partial clip), and she wanted to change it to a full clip since it was going into summer. I told her it would be $45, which is the difference between the partial I owed her and the full clip. She agreed and said she would get me a check. I clipped the horse. No check, so when I stopped out six weeks later (early August), I asked her if I could get a check. She said she would send one to me. I didn’t think it was a big deal because I know her and thought I would get paid.

She texts me about something unrelated mid-September, and I bring up paying me, and she says money is tight because of an injury and will pay me when she can (roll eyes). I see her at a horse show in early November and ask for a check, and she doesn’t have her check book but will send me one that week. That was 2 weeks ago. I sent a message this past Monday, and got no response at all. I have learned my lesson, and no special breaks no matter how well I know anyone, but would really like to get paid.

Do I contact the trainer and ask her to pay me and invoice her? As a trainer, would that rub you the wrong way? That’s probably how I would handle it if it was anyone else, but its awkward that I know these people personally too. I don’t really want to get trainer involved (she’s my friend/trainer too), but I don’t know how else to handle this now that she has stopped responding completely. But on the other hand if she has enough money to horse show, she should be able to pay me $45 and I need to get this invoice taken care of. Thanks!

[BAC]

This person has made it very clear she is not going to pay you. And for such a small amount of money I don’t see any way of recovering it. I guess you could mention it to the trainer but she may not want to get involved. Obviously you won’t do any work for her in the future now that you know she doesn’t honor her debts.

[mmeqcenter]

Why would you invoice the trainer for the other person’s service? It’s not the trainer’s responsibility to cover everyone else’s bills. Unless a previous agreement was made between trainer and horse owner saying trainer would pay and HO would reimburse them, yes, I would consider it to be highly inappropriate to invoice the trainer or involve her in any way.

You can send HO a final bill and notice of sending to collections, if you really want to go after $45 that bad. But for that amount, I’d personally consider it a loss, decline to ever provide that HO services in the future, and refuse to provide services to anyone without payment up front before you start.

[Highflyer]

@mmeqcenter

Why would you invoice the trainer for the other person’s service? It’s not the trainer’s responsibility to cover everyone else’s bills. Unless a previous agreement was made between trainer and horse owner saying trainer would pay and HO would reimburse them, yes, I would consider it to be highly inappropriate to invoice the trainer or involve her in any way.

You can send HO a final bill and notice of sending to collections, if you really want to go after $45 that bad. But for that amount, I’d personally consider it a loss, decline to ever provide that HO services in the future, and refuse to provide services to anyone without payment up front before you start.

Agree with this-- and I’d add an option to pay by Paypal or Square or something similar to eliminate the forgotten checkbook excuse in the future.

[enjoytheride]

At this point I’d ask her publicly, on FB or at a show in front of a lot of other people. 45 bucks is nothing to someone you’ve seen at shows since then. I wouldn’t invoice the trainer, who had nothing to do with your arrangement, but I would casually let her know her client will have to find other clipping services in the future.

[mh97]

I hate people like this. At this point I’d chalk it up to a loss. Definitely don’t expect the trainer to bill her for it, the agreement was between you and the client and had nothing to do with the trainer. It’s not the trainer’s responsibility to pay their clients debts.

If I had any friends who provide similar services, I would be sure to let them know so that they know not to deal with this person. Karma will come back to bite her. Word spreads fast about people like this.

[Horsegirl_s_Mom]

@Highflyer

Agree with this-- and I’d add an option to pay by Paypal or Square or something similar to eliminate the forgotten checkbook excuse in the future.

How about venmo? My daughters introduced me to this, and it really is wonderful for exchanging small amounts of money. All the younger people seem to have venmo. Bonus: if someone owes you money, you can send a request; since it’s all automated, it doesn’t have the awkwardness of a personal encounter to ask for money.

Unfortunately, in this situation it seems clear she just doesn’t want to pay you. I wouldn’t ask the trainer to pay, but I might ask the trainer if she could give a gentle reminder to the owner who owes you. If the owner realizes the trainer knows about her failure to pay, she might just be embarrassed enough to cough up the money.

[qhaftershock]

@mmeqcenter

Why would you invoice the trainer for the other person’s service? It’s not the trainer’s responsibility to cover everyone else’s bills.

Totally understand this, but I have many times had trainers pay me for braiding and then invoice their clients, and for a previous late pay client, the trainer checked in if I had been paid fully, and sent me a check themselves and took care of it with their client. But that was an 18 horse barn and they have had trouble finding a good braider in the past, so I think she wanted me to be happy. That’s why I asked, because it seemed weird to me at the time, but I have had trainers take care of stuff like that, and I wasn’t sure if I should consider that the norm. Also, I probably should have said, when I boarded there it was a regular practice for the trainer to credit my board for my work (both for her and other clients) and then add the charge to their bill. But now its different because I don’t board there anymore.

I have always settled up with the trainer ( and by proxy people at the barn) at the end of the month, and if I am not getting paid here that will change for all of them. That was part of my thought process about contacting the trainer, I do a lot of work for her when she isn’t there, and she pays me later. She will likely not want that agreement to change because of the convenience factor for her, and if it weren’t for this, I wouldn’t mind keeping it the same because I have about 40 months of history of getting paid. But I will change it if I don’t get paid. I kinda want to give her a heads up/ see if she can get the client to pay up. The current system was working, but not if I am now not getting paid now. I guess this is part of the transition from providing a service to friends vs. doing so professionally.

ETA: I accept Paypal, Venmo, and Zelle to keep all of my clients happy The original offer to pay (as she was getting in the car to leave after bathing her horse) was that she would Paypal me after her appointment that night, guess she never intended to do it. I just used check to make it less lengthly to type.

[centaursam]

As someone who is in a service business and sees how even invoices can be abused and never paid, I strongly suggest you never do work without first getting paid. Take this as a lesson and move on. Not your fault in any way, it’s just part of running your own business.

Have a website with a portfolio of your work so people see what you’re capable of and then be upfront about how much and when payment is to be made before you start any work.

[OnDeck]

You’re never getting your $45 unless she calls and asks you to clip again in which case you can ask for the $45 plus your next payment up front.

In the future I would ask for a check to be left at the barn for you. It seems awkward at first when you’re dealing with friends but it’s much less awkward in the long run. You do, however, have to be prepared to actually turn around and leave if you show up and there’s no check (after a courtesy call giving them one last chance to send it via paypal).

[CHT]

If one of my clients stiffed a service provider I would want to know. That doesn’t mean I would accept responsibility for it, and I may decide to do nothing, but I also may decided to approach my client about it.

So, I would mention the issue to the trainer, but I would not suggest they pay on the client’s behalf.

I wouldn’t make it public on facebook. That might not go the way you want it to.

[gottagrey]

If you do Paypal send them a final invoice via Paypal and see what happens. And just never provide your services to this person again unless they pay you up front.

[FAW]

write it off as experience. $45 too small to collect through the court system

[GraceLikeRain]

You provide a convenient but not mandatory service to your old trainer and their clients. Those clients are actively putting money into the trainers pocket each week. Even if you have a great relationship with your old trainer, their clients are still the top priority. If you involve you old trainer or create ill will over $45, your trainer may be more than happy to find someone else to clip horses. Personally, I’d drop it. If the trainer asks you to come out to clip, mention that your new policy is that you must have payment in full before clipping.

[OverandOnward]

@qhaftershock

…
I have always settled up with the trainer ( and by proxy people at the barn) at the end of the month, and if I am not getting paid here that will change for all of them. That was part of my thought process about contacting the trainer, I do a lot of work for her when she isn’t there, and she pays me later. She will likely not want that agreement to change because of the convenience factor for her, and if it weren’t for this, I wouldn’t mind keeping it the same because I have about 40 months of history of getting paid. But I will change it if I don’t get paid. I kinda want to give her a heads up/ see if she can get the client to pay up. The current system was working, but not if I am now not getting paid now. I guess this is part of the transition from providing a service to friends vs. doing so professionally.
…

But as you tell the story, the system hasn’t broken down. Just one customer.

Be careful about punishing everyone for the sins of one. In your shoes, I wouldn’t want to create an uncomfortable situation after 40 months of being paid by everyone else at that barn.

If you do adopt a policy of payment up front, then it’s a universal policy and you aren’t singling anyone out. I agree with the other suggestions that you do need to get paid before doing the work. Be prepared not to do someone’s horse if that check isn’t waiting. For some, a time or two of that may be necessary to get them to remember. You can always say something like “Well there wasn’t a check so I thought you changed your mind.”

And part of your policy should be that if Probationary Friend wants services, the $45 has to be paid up front along with the cost of those services. In your place I wouldn’t take a check from her, just cash or Venmo or another immediate funds transfer channel… Sounds like you are already in that corner.

It seems that you are a bit fixated on the $45, which you are certainly owed but seems out of reach. Do separate the rest of your customers from this one. Unless there is something more going on, it sounds as if the rest of your business is paying well. Only the one customer burned the bridge between you.

[jonem004]

I would be disinclined to cause any tension in your relationship with the trainer over $45. If you’re getting consistent clipping and braiding work from them, then let that business keep coming. I wouldn’t, personally, even change my billing policy for a preexisting client.

I WOULD be a petty bitch and wait until the trainer asked me to clip/braid Sally Who Stiffed You’s horse, and then say, “I’m sorry I can’t. Sally has an outstanding balance from 2012.”

And of course, start having your new clients pay when they book.

Off sides, why is it so hard for horse people to pay their bills? Why the heck can’t they ever seem to show up on time?!? 😤

[poltroon]

I just want to say it really sucks when this happens. I remember a long long time ago, when a trainer called me in to braid for her group when I was a broke student. The ponies were very fancy and the client had plenty of money… and I think the client didn’t get that not everyone does. I did get paid eventually but I had to hang around all day to get that money, and I didn’t even have enough cash on me to buy something for lunch.

Thirty years later, I’m still mad about it. :lol:

[appendix100]

My trainer has booked things, & invoiced clients for them, but that was the understanding up front (ie trainer gets all the shavings for the barn at a show, & he invoices client for them at the end; or trainer books someone to come in & braid all 8 horses at a show, pays for the service & invoices the clients). The trainer is not responsible for services she did not contract for, any more than you would expect her to pay the vet bill of a deadbeat that happens to board at her barn.

I would just kiss the $45 goodbye, & call it a learning experience. Not worth your time to really pursue it. I would however never clip for that person again.

These are not services that are required for the health or wellbeing of the animal, therefore there is no reason they should be provided without payment.

Established, good, clients you could allow to pay at the end of the show once all the charges are done. (Initial braiding, repairs during the circuit, etc). New clients should pay up front until they have an adequate track record of reliability.

[OneTwoMany]

@qhaftershock

So this might be better served in off course, but I wanted to get h/j trainer input. I braid and clip professionally, and while I am relatively new at doing it professionally (3 years), I have been very busy and have lots of repeat customers. All of my customers have been pretty great, and I have not experienced a non payment situation until this one (knock wood).

I used to board at a local barn, and moved in the spring (on good terms) to a less expensive facility while I took a break from showing. The barn owner/trainer was the first person I clipped/braided for, and I give her a special price as a thank you for taking care of my horse for years and a thank you for giving me a shot/working through growing pains as my skills developed. I also gave my fellow barn mates a lower price when I boarded there. After I moved my horse, I went back in June to clip for the barn owner and another barn mate wanted her horse clipped too at the last minute.

I owed this barn mate a partial clip (she won a bet we made months prior and if she won I owed her a partial clip), and she wanted to change it to a full clip since it was going into summer. I told her it would be $45, which is the difference between the partial I owed her and the full clip. She agreed and said she would get me a check. I clipped the horse. No check, so when I stopped out six weeks later (early August), I asked her if I could get a check. She said she would send one to me. I didn’t think it was a big deal because I know her and thought I would get paid.

She texts me about something unrelated mid-September, and I bring up paying me, and she says money is tight because of an injury and will pay me when she can (roll eyes). I see her at a horse show in early November and ask for a check, and she doesn’t have her check book but will send me one that week. That was 2 weeks ago. I sent a message this past Monday, and got no response at all. I have learned my lesson, and no special breaks no matter how well I know anyone, but would really like to get paid.

Do I contact the trainer and ask her to pay me and invoice her? As a trainer, would that rub you the wrong way? That’s probably how I would handle it if it was anyone else, but its awkward that I know these people personally too. I don’t really want to get trainer involved (she’s my friend/trainer too), but I don’t know how else to handle this now that she has stopped responding completely. But on the other hand if she has enough money to horse show, she should be able to pay me $45 and I need to get this invoice taken care of. Thanks!

If the trainer asked you to clip the barn mate’s horse, then it would be acceptable (perhaps even mandatory) to inform the trainer about the payment issue. If the trainer was not involved, then the dispute is between you and barn mate and it would be wise to keep it that way.

I agree with an earlier poster that punishing the trainer for non-payment of a barn mate could back fire. I would proceed with caution.

When running a business it is important to keep everything business-like. Resist the temptation to respond with emotion. If you are changing your payment policy, it should apply to ALL clients. If you are changing your fees, it should apply it to ALL clients.

It is likely you will never collect the $45. Shaming the person on FB would not be a professional response. Chalk the $45 up to experience. Send her a final invoice and request payment with Paypal (or whatever service you use) and then move on. Adjust your policies and prices if needed. Many service industries experience deadbeat customers. It is a cost of doing business. Make sure you are charging rates that make business sense and cover all your costs. And don’t be afraid to acknowledge that the costs of doing business include the occasional non-paying client.

[meupatdoes]

@qhaftershock

I have learned my lesson, and no special breaks no matter how well I know anyone, but would really like to get paid.

I don’t get what the special break has to do with it. You give a discounted price to the barn owner and the barn mates from that barn. This has nothing to do with timely payment of that special price.

@qhaftershock

Do I contact the trainer and ask her to pay me and invoice her? As a trainer, would that rub you the wrong way? That’s probably how I would handle it if it was anyone else, but its awkward that I know these people personally too. I don’t really want to get trainer involved (she’s my friend/trainer too), but I don’t know how else to handle this now that she has stopped responding completely. But on the other hand if she has enough money to horse show, she should be able to pay me $45 and I need to get this invoice taken care of. Thanks!

Uh, …no? The trainer has nothing to do with this issue. The trainer and everyone else at this barn has paid you timely. The trainer is not your collection agency for her clients, and she does not owe you collection agency services. I don’t get why you would be MORE likely to ask a trainer who isn’t your friend to act as your collection agency, either. It’s completely unprofessional and not the way to handle this, whether you know the people personally or not.

This is $45, so not any amount of money that is worth going to small claims over, (and certainly not any amount of money worth going completely outside of professionalism for and taking someone to Barn Aisle Court), so the way you handle this is you go back to the same barn next year, give the same discount you have always given to all the people who have been loyal customers and timely payers, and when your delinquent payer tries to get on the list too, you say, “So sorry, no services for you.”

Done.

Btw, I deliberately posted before reading any other replies, so this is my response unfiltered by reading any other responses.