I own Gumby in horse form. He is coming 7 and we finally got him straight-ish. Then we were working on getting him stepping under with the inside hind. Now that is working but the outside hind is staying too close. This boy is 16.3 and all legs. Very elegant but definitely a challenge to get the balance. His default is to over collect. On the flip side the upper level work should be a snap. You can feel a pirouette in his canter, talent for piaffe and passage, etc. But the basics might do us in! We are really working hard are keeping the forward in the gait. Doing some shoulder in both in the trot and canter. Insisting he stay over to the outside rein. Anyone have any additional exercises to try or advise?
You need your horse to be straight.
If he’s not, he cannot be through in his body and c’early step under.
What you feel as over collecting is probably more your horse blocking at the withers. The head/poll goes up, the back gets hollow (even slightly so) and the hind legs are stuck together.
You need to unlock this by keeping the poll lower and stretching out a bit.
This isn’t much about being forward than being straight and having the horse unlocked at the withers/in front of the saddle.
It will be the same with piaffe and pirouette. Your horse will need to learn to reach down/out for the contact to be straight.
This is all about the quality of your half halt.
6 Likes
Hack outside, varied ground, up and down hills so that he learns where to put his feet. But that might not be practical for you.
2 Likes
What exactly is “the outside hind is staying too close”?? Is he very narrow in build? You can’t ever go wrong with shoulder-in at all gaits. Add leg yield and simple turn on the haunches and front end. Teach him that you will place his legs.
I suggest not pushing a 7 year old too much if you want to ride this horse in his teens. Highlighting his talents might get you into trouble (soundness) unless he’s actually physically ready to explore these talents. At 7, I’d say be conservative if you want him to be sound in his teen years.
Hm. Do you mean that the horse needs to better step under himself? Are you looking for hind leg separation in the canter? IME, some horses naturally so this better than others, but there is room for some gait improvement. It comes down to strength and impulsion from the hind end. My 7 year old has a hind leg they really reaches at the canter (falls under my own leg - if that makes sense). But he’s just that way in his gates. If I don’t let him move freely with impulsion or stifle his movement, I bed he’d lose some of that. So I would work on straightness, impulsion, and doing transitions within the gaits.
If you want to gain some more control over directing the hind legs, master turning the haunches, leg yields, shoulder in, and canter walk transitions. All require hind end engagement to be done properly.
1 Like
We use counter canter to get better engagement and separation of the hind legs in the warm up, even doing some forward and back in the counter canter if needed. I’m always scolded for riding the gaits too small in the warm up, never achieving good engagement. A bigger trot with more transitions and a big counter canter usually get us on the right page first and then we can school for collection.
2 Likes
It sounds as though the horse travels narrow behind from your description.
Increasing work that will build up the hind hind end, including properly executed lateral work such as S/I . Hill riding. if at all possible will really help.
I’m going to assume that you’re suffering the classic problem of lack of longitudinal distance between the hind legs in canter.
That’s an easy fix - strength and forward. Both are easily accomplished with trot canter trot canter trot canter trot canter trot canter until you think you might never want to do another canter to trot transition. Ride forward into the trot and those hind legs will get stronger, step under better, and separation will transfer to the canter in time.
I get the feeling you’re confusing “over-collection” with getting tight and stabby behind and needing both hind legs for support due to weakness and possibly asking for a bit too much before he’s ready. Remember they are ballet dancers and it takes for freaking ever for ballet dancers to gain the strength and balance to be able to do more than a few knee bends and slow turns. Take your time. I love the leggy horses, but I do think they take a bit more time to develop.
3 Likes
Thanks for all the suggestions. To be clear, we are not riding pirouettes, pi/pa right now at all. What I meant is that you can feel glimpses of that work in his baby collection work already. He gives the rider an incredible feeling. We are working on the second level work at the moment which is a bit behind in the training for his age but he has needed every bit of the time to develop. This horse is gifted for collection and uses it as an evasion as well as being narrow in build. My trainer also feels it as a strength issue. I agree on the hill work, but it’s too snowy/icy here right now.We are doing lots of trot canter trot like Sascha suggested keeping him forward and a bit longer and open in his stride as well as shoulder in. The half halts are good, completely off seat with no hand. He is very sensitive. He just doesn’t know where to put his feet now that he is straight and stepping through. It’s different than it was just even a month ago when when were really focusing on engaging the inside hind leg. That part is now going well, but it’s like he has also brought the outside hind in too. We do get him to separate but I was curious if there were some other recommendations as I haven’t ever dealt with one like this. I’ve ridden a bit of stiffer smaller types that want to push more than sit and this guy is completely different.
Okay, so I guessed right, so that is absolutely a strength issue. The other thing that you can do to help (if you have good help/already know how/are smart enough to learn from good videos) is starting in hand work. The basics in walk - walk, halt, rein back, turn on forehand, shoulder-in, leg yield, and full pass. Then when you have a really good handle on all that, start with the lifting of the hind legs to lead to half steps to lead to piaffe. The strength you can build this way is amazing. It will lead to truer collection and will help to maintain looseness as strength is built (hello full pass, I love you lol) and it’s a nice change for the horse to do difficult stuff without the weight of the rider. I swear it helps them get into their own bodies better which translates to better carrying of the rider.
ETA - raised walk and trot poles AND low stretchy-neck and stride poles are also extra helpful. Make a rotation through the week of different extras* each day so you’re not over-straining the horse.
1 Like
Thank you Sascha! Great ideas and he loves poles!
1 Like
I agree with Sasha - raised walk, trot and canter poles - appropriately spaced. You can raise them by putting them on anything, we use wood blocks with a small “v” cut out to hold the pole in place. We have PVC pipe poles at the barn but I can tell you that my horse respects actual wood poles.
