Is this a 10 walk? Or a lateral walk ? Or just unsound?

[Mohan]

@dotneko please warn us if it’s an inflammatory website like dressage hub. I’m sure the video is great but I’d rather not give that woman traffic.

[dotneko]

@Mohan

@dotneko please warn us if it’s an inflammatory website like dressage hub. I’m sure the video is great but I’d rather not give that woman traffic.

oh, sorry, it was the only one that popped up showing a lateral walk. Warning added.

[Mohan]

I figured. I’m guessing by comments you are a judge? That’s awesome.

[Unfforgettable]

In the last couple of steps of the first video the walk gets better. That whole clip is a great example of how taking up too much contact…even though it isn’t much contact…can negatively affect a great walk. The second clip where he is allowed to really stretch out freely and forward shows a lovely walk.

[Mohan]

Could you explain further? From the first video it looked like the rider was just a passenger. I don’t mean that in a bad way I just mean she was letting the horse walk.

[sparkygrace]

@DownYonder

1 – A horse with a superb walk was often described as “walking like a panther.” One particular inspector sometimes used the expression “she has a walk like a hooker.” Although I never saw an inspector give a horse a 10 for a walk, I did see some that scored 8s and 9s. The horse walks through the entire body - swinging hips, swinging topline, swinging shoulders, head bobbing slightly up and down in rhythm with the stride, everything loose and supple, in a pure and regular rhythm, displaying clear overtrack, and covering a lot of ground with each stride.

That’s how the big walk was described to me, too, except it was a tiger walk. (Just another cat.) Some trainers warned against buying a walk like this because it was harder to collect. You implied that by saying a horse like this should be ridden by a good trainer. Pushing a horse like this for too much collection too early can result in a lateral walk. I’ve seen it. I remember a trainer who turned every horse into a goose-stepper by collecting too much. It’s really easy to ruin a good walk.

[Unfforgettable]

If you watch closely, in the first video as he comes around and through the corner you can see him having to swing his right hind out, and when he straightens it gets cleaner. She is using some leg as well, and isn’t just being a passenger. He is a bit too restricted in front in this clip and being asked for more contact at the walk than needed at this stage. Slow the front down and the back end has to compensate. He’s compensating by reaching out behind rather than under and fully forward. Taking up too much contact at the walk in the early stages can teach a horse to shorten and change its stride behind…and changes the timing from 1…2…3…4 to 1.2…3.4.
Clear as mud, right?

[dotneko]

@DownYonder

I used to be a bit involved in the breeding world and spent some time both here and in Germany with warmblood registry inspectors, and also with young horse trainers. A few things I learned are:

1 – A horse with a superb walk was often described as “walking like a panther.” One particular inspector sometimes used the expression “she has a walk like a hooker.” Although I never saw an inspector give a horse a 10 for a walk, I did see some that scored 8s and 9s. The horse walks through the entire body - swinging hips, swinging topline, swinging shoulders, head bobbing slightly up and down in rhythm with the stride, everything loose and supple, in a pure and regular rhythm, displaying clear overtrack, and covering a lot of ground with each stride.

2 - It was/is often difficult to get that kind of walk in an inspection or show environment, as tension (whether from anxiety or excitement) negatively impacts the quality of the walk.

3 - The mere act of bringing a horse more into contact causes the horse to tighten certain muscles, which biomechanically affects the lossey-goosey quality of the walk.

4 - Horses with natural big and good walks need to be trained by riders with a fair amount of experience and feel, because those kinds of walks can be easily ruined by asking for too much contact, too much “collection” too soon. Even for a rider with a great deal of talent and finesse, it is near impossible to not affect the quality of a good slinky walk as s/he brings the horse more into contact with the bit.

I think these two videos reflect aspects of the above points. In the first video, the horse is being ridden into the bridle - and the quality of the walk is not as good as it is in the second video. In the second video, the horse is being allowed to stretch down into a long rein and show his natural walk. (This is not at all to imply that the rider is bad – I think she is doing quite a nice job of allowing this horse to show his natural gaits, esp. in the second video, although I wish that video showed some walk other than on a lengthened rein.)

That said, I had a homebred mare with a huge, ground-covering walk. She was barely 16.1h, but it was sometimes a bit of a challenge keeping up with her when walking her in hand (trying to shorten or slow her walk affected the quality). She could outwalk nearly every other horse in the barn, including the 17h big guys. And under saddle, she was so loosey-goosey and had so much swing that riding her walk would give my hips and lower back quite a workout – it was actually good physical therapy!

Marilyn Monroe walk. But I am dating myself lol

[Tarlo_Farm]

@Unfforgettable

In the last couple of steps of the first video the walk gets better. That whole clip is a great example of how taking up too much contact…even though it isn’t much contact…can negatively affect a great walk. The second clip where he is allowed to really stretch out freely and forward shows a lovely walk.

Exactly what I was going to say. In the first video, as they come out of the corner, the walk starts to swing better. That horse is amazing. Sitting that trot will create abs of steel.

[Joanne]

Does anyone know who bred Fire Kracka?

[lorilu]

I just edited my remark because the system “fixed” my comment. A lateral walk is 12 (space)34.

[eightpondfarm]

i see his right hind moving more, stretching more underneath him, than his left hind. His distances are unequal. Perhaps that is only because he is curving. I don’t count exact time between the beats/footfalls either.

[enjoytheride]

I guess you and Carl Hester should go back to judging school because this horse is lame and possibly neurological

[dotneko]

@enjoytheride

I guess you and Carl Hester should go back to judging school because this horse is lame and possibly neurological

I’ll call Carl and see if there is a two for one discount. I’m wondering just how many walks some have critically watched. I’m in the 30-40 thousand judged walks range conservatively. Don’t think I’ve ever scored one a zero, but I have given a 10 a few times.

[strangewings]

Thank you that is very nearly 2-beat, moreso than i have seen before. The slow motion clip is still 4-beat except maybe 1-2 steps. If anyone knows the original source of the video it would be interesting to see it. What is presented as “correct” in that clip is still a slightly irregular 12(space)34 (using lorilu’s notation), so it would be interesting to see the end of the video.

Re: the other animal lateral gaits, i believe they are usually 4-beat most of the time.

Camel lateral tendency (4 beats)

Camel Ride for Babies | Camel Ride for Kids | Camel Video for Babies

Giraffe lateral tendency (4 beat)

Giraffes walk, gallop and play at ZSL Whipsnade Zoo

[Bogey2]

I have a horse who walks like that and he is not neurological nor lame. I do have to be very careful to not interfere with my seat or it goes lateral. He is an extremely loose mover even at the age of 18, always has been. Thankfully my trainer understands how to manage this type of mover.

[Bluey]

60+ years ago I was a teenager and we started some colts for an Arabian breeder.
One of those was a beautiful, kind of shy light bay colt with some white.
He moved like this one, like a big cat is a great description.
He felt like riding a slinky cloud, not sure how he would have worked for a true dressage horse.
The breeder aimed his horses for endurance.
We tried some jumping and he was fenomenally athletic and very careful and scopey.
Several in our riding center were very interested in him but the breeder was not selling, he and a bigger grey colt were his favorites and not for sale.

I was about the only one that rode him, I was barely 90 lbs and a very soft rider and the instructor
kept saying he was too light and sensitive, he didn’t want him to have but the lightest ride, so as not to interfere with his awesome way of moving, poetry in motion.
I don’t remember his gait being anything but pure, huge and very forward, not lateral at all.

I have never since seen a colt like that or ridden one that feels like that, you don’t forget that ever.
Riding that colt was as close as being one, a centaur.

I wonder how this rider would say how riding this horse feels.

[sascha]

@dotneko

I’m wondering just how many walks some have critically watched. I’m in the 30-40 thousand judged walks range conservatively. Don’t think I’ve ever scored one a zero, but I have given a 10 a few times.

It doesn’t really matter how many you’ve looked at if you cannot tell that the walk in the first video does not have, (quoted from the FEI rules)

“The walk is a marching pace in a regular and well-marked four (4) times beat with equal intervals between each beat. This regularity combined with full relaxation must be maintained throughout all walk movements.”

Equal intervals between each beat. Not shorter between LH-LF and RH-RF and longer between LF-RH and RF- LH.

Get out a metronome. Try to set it to hit all 4 beats of that walk in the first video. It cannot be done. The second video you’d have a much better chance because the walk is clean, not lateral.

[strangewings]

@rothmpp

V that each side makes.

Can you elaborate on this and how it is used to identify a lateral tendency?

[blue_heron]

There was a thread a while ago about lateral canters. In this post, the first horse has a lateral canter and walk to a much more obvious degree than above.

Reality check: fixing the lateral canter

[Horse Riding - Lateral Canter - Smarn the Horse] [Furiosa Left Lead (Lateral / 4 Beat) Canter January 2016] The first one is very obvious once you see it. The second is a lateral tendency that I think could be improved with training and a lameness eval. I think there are videos of this horse breaking up the canter, or of her greatly improved. ETA: So yes, both the pacing kind and the flat kind. The flat kind can be improved with forward motion and fitness. Sometimes y…

I have a hard time believing that Carl Hester called that exact walk a ten. Maybe there were nicer parts of the ride or he was referring to another day like in the free walk video. I see a young stallion with a little tension that’s being exacerbated by the rider pushing him forward instead of slowing him with the seat. I don’t see a horse I would be concerned about neurological issues. This horse does have a regular as in rhythmic and supple walk, but it’s not being showcased in the video posted by OP.