Jingles for Evil Burrito: post 774 COTH jingles worked again!

[cayuse]

Oatie had 5 teeth extracted and it took about an hour and a half. My vet at the time did the procedure and not the dentist I used as she had an interest in dentistry and did a lot of it so I trusted her, plus we wanted to get him done before my mini had sinus surgery at Tufts, I couldn’t deal with two at the same time. So the vet squeezed him in.

He was heavily sedated, done standing. She was very careful to loosen things up and be as gentle as she could. That evening he was eating mash and chopped hay the next day. Pain seemed minimal, but we gave him small doses of banamine to keep him happy. Both the vet and dentist said that the pain relief from having the diseased teeth removed is fast, once the tooth is gone the pain is gone (except for the healing up discomfort from the extraction).
Oatie is 12.2 hands so his mouth was fairly easy to work in and there was no jaw concern that I was aware of. Are they worried about Odie’s jaw because of his size? I will say when my mini had teeth out it was difficult, but those were back teeth. Oatie and Odie

Oh, and I did not watch!

[TheJenners]

@trubandloki

Jingles for you having to deal with the stress.

Thank you I only leaked a little at the barn. I did cry some when I went back to work and some coworkers asked how the appointment went.

@cayuse

Oh, and I did not watch!

I’m not going to either! I got a little urky just watching her wiggle his teeth. I already have a teeth ick (which is not awesome given my job and the population’s general disdain for dental hygiene…) and need anti-anxiety meds for my own dental stuff for anything more than a cleaning, which I can muscle through on sheer will alone, and I definitely don’t like thinking my little charges might have been in pain and I didn’t notice.

We had the QOL discussion in regards to compounding this with his arthritis and she still feels that what she sees is that he gets around really well considering and while I self-report that cold weather is harder and he fights with the farrier, I invested in the sling and the farrier uses a dremel versus trying to rasp and most of the year he is perfectly happy - or should I say, perfectly evil . She said I am far, far from being neglectful or cruel and to not even worry about that. Obviously I worry too much. I tried to insure my two mares last year and finally gave up because apparently I have the vet out TOO MUCH. I got fed up dealing with all the documentation they wanted because I had the vet out too many times for reoccurring abscesses on the yearling (probably a mineral deficiency caused by my water treatment system, added Z:Cu and it’s never happened since even through “abscess season”) to make sure it wasn’t something more serious. I got fed up with insuring my older mare for other reasons as well, but they wanted to exclude her whole skin because of season allergies. What a scam.

[Simkie]

What about a fence sitting approach to his mouth? Remove the teeth that are easy. Leave the ones that are recalcitrant. Does it have to be an all or nothing thing?

Getting an opinion from a vet that specializes in dentistry could also provide more insight on the risk.

[TheJenners]

She wants to remove the ones that are causing pain. He has lost some weight, which I thought was because Argie was winning the hay bag argument and had recently started hanging two hay bags… should have been a clue I can get her to send the xray too, but all the front teeth are affected.

[endlessclimb]

This is exactly how we are handling my Old Man and his EOTRH. I will pull the ones that show pain or are loose, but I’m not going to yank them out ahead of time. I plan to xray annually to ensure it’s progressing as expected.

[Simkie]

But removing some–the worst ones? that are loose–will improve his pain, right?

Sure, removing every affected tooth might be the textbook way to address this, but in real life it’s a balancing act because of his wee little jaw & the risk that brings.

So does removing the “low” risk teeth get him back to a baseline level where he can eat, and then you just reassess regularly and pull the others as they progress & become lower risk.

This stuff develops over time, and he’s been eating okay until recentlyish? So not unreasonable to think that if you can just get the worst teeth outta there that he’ll be okay until the others progress (then lather, rinse, repeat.)

[TheJenners]

Oh I see what you’re saying.

So yes, the xrays definitely show absorption or whatever its called at every root of his lower incisors and potentially moving into the canine and maybe even the first molar? I asked, pointing at the cloudiness in the pictures, but she didn’t think so. During the physical exam, I was standing on his right, the tooth that’s missing IIFC is either the one just left of center or the one next over to the left, he didn’t exactly cooperate with me looking and it took two doses of the good stuff to let her get a good look and then xrays, because, you know, Evil Burrito. The next one over from it is loose. The one closest to me, so the far right corner incisor is very loose. I don’t know the status of the one or two (?) remaining to the left because I wasn’t on that side, but can’t imagine they are in great shape either. So it sounds like a full sweep of all affected teeth

[cayuse]

This is what we did with Oatie, removed the worst. There were 2-3 borderline ones that the vet wanted to “wait and watch” with. A year out and that plan proved to be the best choice for him. He’ll probably need the others out at some point but so far he’s doing so much better. Fingers crossed.

[cayuse]

How is Odie doing?

[TheJenners]

Well in just the few days I stopped using the hay nets and started putting the hay on the ground, he already packed on the pounds and is back to being cresty so definitely Cushings. We haven’t scheduled the surgery yet because I am going out town the last weekend of March (one night) and don’t want my barn sitter to have to deal with rinsing his mouth. He is just as sassy.

[TheJenners]

Mucking before feeding (how dare I??)

And feeding… why do I bother with two piles?

[TheJenners]

Lord they are little fatties Volley did sharesies with them all winter, hence the move. And they were getting hay she dropped, which was probably how Odie was maintaining weight, once they got moved and only got hay in the nets was how I noticed the weight loss… She is a sweet little (big) filly.

[cayuse]

Glad he’s doing better. My guy couldn’t navigate the net either right before we had his teeth out. He does ok with it now but I just feed him on the floor, one less chore. They are both the cutest things with their fancy stripes!

[TheJenners]

Yeah I suspect no more nets after surgery too, but my vet said there is a new Cushings med she wants to try. I tried Prascend with Argie and it was a hard “no” but she said the other stuff (cipro something? but not the human abx, something else) is effective, less likely to be rejected, and thankfully cheaper too…

[Simkie]

Cyproheptadine, but it’s overall a lot less effective.

Treatment with pergolide or cyproheptadine of pituitary pars intermedia...

[TheJenners]

Ohh thanks I’ll read this! Probably more effective than nothing. Argie won’t eat the prascend, period paragraph. Maybe two or three days of a small dose, after that he won’t eat a thing other than hay for a couple weeks and even treats from me suspiciously… he is very much like a cat

[Simkie]

Yeah, cypro is better than nothing!

Fwiw, I found it very easy to syringe prascend into my mare who noped right out of eating it. For as objectionable as she found it, she never fought or said no getting it by syringe. Horses are so weird.

[cayuse]

I had a pony on cyproheptadine. It is sometimes used for headshaking syndrome, she was on it for that. I got it flavored from Wedgewood and she ate it up ok. IIRC is was fairly inexpensive, cheaper than Prascend by far.

[TheJenners]

Oh thanks to you both.

As an aside, I reached out to the breeder and if the worse thing happens, they will take Argie back and put him with their geldings One less heartbreak if it happens.

[sparkygrace]

This pill popper has worked like a charm for me. My miniature horse will not eat his Prascend pill mixed with his pellets, so I use it to administer the pill. He knows the routine and lifts his head without a fuss.

Amazon.com : TAOZUA Cat Pill Shooter, Pet Pill Dispenser with 2 Silicone Tips, Medicine Pill Pusher for Cats, Puppies and Small Animals : Pet Supplies