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Judges: standard deduction for stop + poop?

Say for example your hypothetical baby horse never poops under saddle, and you or someone like you is at a show and may or may not be doing a 20m circle when said horse stops dead to poop.

What would be the standard deduction of marks, if there is one? Someone (not me) got a 4 on this last weekend and that not-me person felt perhaps it was generous :grimacing:

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I have no idea, but I love your post! Thank you for this.

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4 for breaking gait sounds about right. Thankfully I havenā€™t had this happen, hopefully I didnā€™t just jinx myself!

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At one show, my horse stopped to pee while walking across the diagonal during the test. I think I got a point off, but the comment was ā€œnature called at X.ā€ Iā€™m not sure how a judge would penalize a horse stopping to poop or pee. They may all see it differently. Some horse can go on the run; others wonā€™t.

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One of my young horses stopped right at C, tail over back, grunted, all with me kicking like crazy. We finally got going again. When I circled around, there was exactly ONE little ball of poop. I could hear the judge laughing. I donā€™t remember what the score was. I had a pretty good laugh about it too.

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:laughing: :rofl:

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Judges are supposed to ignore that the horse is pooping, and score what happened i.e. breaking gait. Most would err on the side of a little generosity since they can see that the disobedience has a reason from the horseā€™s point of view. As a rider you should not generally allow your horse to stop for this reason, but I think most of us would not choose the show ring as the time and place to have this discussion for the first time with baby a horse. And of course at home there is the temptation to allow horses to stop since you will have only one pile to clean up rather than a dozen or so individual turds dribbled down the whole long side. Remind me to give my mare an extra carrot for voluntarily waiting until she is in the cross ties after our ride to poop (EVERY ride).

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Iā€™m older than most of you folks, and when I was being taught back in the dark ages, it was IMPERATIVE that your horse never break gait for these calls. NEVER!!! OMG, I can still hear my trainerā€™s voice and sheā€™s been dead for about 25 years nowā€¦

However, I was shocked to my shoes to find that several venues now insist that riders stop when nature calls because ā€“ NEW FOOTING. They donā€™t want manures spread into the footing, and so the horse must promptly halt, do its thing, and you hop off and pick up the pile either then or after the lesson (and in the mean time, everybody rides around it so their horses wonā€™t kick it around.

I donā€™t show anymore, but I sure wondered what the ā€œruleā€ is now, since more and more venues are obtaining this pricy footing.

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It is extremely rare for either of my mares to poop while being ridden. I could see a nervous poo happening at a show though = no chances for teaching to poop on the run.

Clinic I audited last weekend on fancy footing, the clinician admonished the rider not to ride through the poo, and then sent an onlooker to pick it up right away.

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I have a mare who leaves a trail behind her EVERY RIDE. Havenā€™t gotten to show her yet, hopefully sheā€™ll give up that habit first.

I also have a gelding who must be untacked in the washrack because he pees after every ride. If the washrack is in use, cleanup in aisle 1! Makes a double mess, because have to spread shavings to soak up the pee. Came in handy at a show once, one of the few times Iā€™ve seen USEF show up to drug test. Told them theyā€™d better be on their toes, because he was going to pee! They were grateful, because the horse in the stall next to us took HOURS!

Another gelding would poop after every ride (at least it wasnā€™t in the arena), so I kept a muck bucket handy, and as soon as that tail went up, muck bucket against his butt to catch it all!

And long ago I had a gelding who would stop and pee on the walk to the arena. Had nicely fertilized grass there!

Horses and their bodily functions. :roll_eyes:

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I had a horse at training level, when we were supposed to do a walk-trot transition directly in front of the judge halt and poop. She also was not one to go under saddle most of the time, so we hadnā€™t yet had practice. I kicked and got no response, looked at the judge, shrugged, and we both laughed. I think I got a 5 with the comment ā€œreluctantā€ on the transition. Had it been stopping in the middle of a figure, I think even that generous judge would have given it a 4.

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I wonder if it depends on the status of the show. Iā€™ve found judges at schooling shows, and with classes with less experienced horses and/or riders, to be forgiving of all kinds of natural events that occur during a test. But not nearly as much with the more advanced shows and levels.

I was riding an opinionated, experienced 23 yo gelding (not mine) in a small, low-level schooling show dressage test. He was technically semi-retired into a life of privilege. He did these little jobs just for fun and exercise.

The horse and I disagreed on the question of stopping the test to check out one of the spectators standing near the ring for horse cookies. I managed to win the point, but the horse then retaliated by launching into a few energetic bucks to emphasize the privileges which he felt should not be questioned. I thought ā€˜well dang there goes the scoreā€™ but we pulled together and finished the test.

The judge was offering comments after the test, so I asked ā€˜other than the buckingā€™ for comments. She responded happily ā€œOh he was just playing! I didnā€™t change the score for that!ā€

Alrighty then! :laughing:

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You nailed it! A few years ago at a local show, a person ran into the arena between dressage tests to pick up poop. The judge screamed at the person to get out. The arena had new, expensive footing and some people were conditioned to run out immediately when a horse pooped to pick it up. It was pretty funny, really.

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If there is any justice, this post will be granted entrance to the Best Posts of COTH. :grin:

Weā€™ll see where the thread goes, if it becomes one of those COTH immortals. :slight_smile:

At a previous barn a fellow boarder had that problem. She was diligent with the shavings clean-up, but of course it got old for her.

She taught her big gelding to ā€œpeeā€ on command - and just as importantly, to ā€œstopā€ on command. Good smart horsemanship, I thought. After every ride she had him pee outside before they came back into the barn. Something that never occurred to him before that, I guess.

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Surprised the judge was upset that someone would pick between tests. I can see them being upset if someone ran out during a test but between tests seems like a very good time to clean the manure from the ring.

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The next rider was already warming up in the arena. It was the judgeā€™s prerogative to decide who could be in the arena.

The time for that is during scheduled breaks - no matter how fast you think you are it can take several minutes to get in, clean up, and get out, and the judge doesnā€™t want to fall behind and get late on the schedule. Everyone appreciates a show staying on time, especially the judge and scribe!

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:open_mouth:

Wow, people must be going really slowly.

I am fine with the judge doing whatever the judge wants to do.
My experience is that the ring gets cleaned between riders if there is manure. That way the manure is not mixed into the footing by the next rider. Clearly other people have a different experience.

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Actually, there is (or was last time read) a rule about not changing the surface between tests. Say a stray piece of paper flutters in during a test. Unless it can cause physical harm, it is not to be removed. Seems silly to me but there ya go.

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Couldnā€™t it be argued that the poop in the arena changed the surface? so picking it up would be returning it to its original state and making it more fair.

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