Jumper stallion suggestions - particularly with L-line blood?

[eniskerry]

I don’t know for sure yet if I’ll be breeding this mare next year, but wanted to start thinking about stallions to be prepared. Mare is papered Hanoverian and approved for breeding with the AHHA here - she was imported as a sporthorse years ago and competed up to Grand Prix, spending most of her time in the Jr/AO jumpers with a young rider. Her breeding is Continue/Weinberg/Pilot - http://www.horsetelex.com//horses/pedigree/1543738.

I have her in foal to Albarez right now and will consider breeding back to him again once I see the foal. However, I also want to explore other options and am particularly interested in jumper stallions with Holsteiner L-line blood. This mare’s dam has produced 4 other offspring that I can find. Three of those were by Lord Z (Lord/Calando), and include Hanoverian Verband approved stallion Laith and another stallion sold in the Verband auction. This mare’s other half-brother is by Landclassic (by Landadel) and is WBFSH-ranked jumping 1.6m.

She’s a big-framed, older-style mare so a little refinement would be nice and I definitely don’t need to add any size! Jumping talent is certainly #1 priority, but a good brain is also a plus. Although she’s a heavier older-style mare she definitely has a lot of “go.” I would prefer to use fresh semen but might consider good quality frozen.

[sixpoundfarm]

Lord Z semen is available Frozen with a LFG. (If thats been a good cross for her)

[Maryanne_Nicpon]

LINARO! Now you have to use frozen since he is deceased, but his frozen is great. I bred to him three times. One colt is showing successfully in FL at 1.15m. Another colt is showing 1.2m-1.3m and is standing at stud in S. Korea. If I am not mistaken, Linaro was accepted for breeding by the Hanoverian verband too, so you could go either way.

[Bayhawk]

The last stallion I would ever breed to for jumping would be Linaro. He is not an inheritor. He is very good at making breeding mares and dressage horses though. we also see him in the motherline of some top jumpers but not directly by him.

[omare]

I think these are the L stallions- Larimar, Lasino, Limbus - on the 2013 list offered by Foxfire Farm (Karen Reid) . Happy Hunting!

[EquineLVR]

What about Livello?

[Bent_Hickory]

[QUOTE=Bayhawk;6750842]
The last stallion I would ever breed to for jumping would be Linaro. He is not an inheritor. He is very good at making breeding mares and dressage horses though. we also see him in the motherline of some top jumpers but not directly by him.[/QUOTE]

I agree. I bred Linaro to a very good Hanoverian JBP mare before he was imported to the US. The resulting colt was tall, dark and handsome and a pretty mover. We sold him as a 5yo for decent money. He did the A/A hunters with his new owner for a while, but I’ve lost track of him. While I might use Linaro again to produce a mid-level hunter, I would not, as Bayhawk noted, expect him to produce a top-level jumper.

[eniskerry]

Thanks for the replies. I know there are a few good frozen options, but was really hoping to find a stallion available fresh. This mare has never been bred with frozen semen and she’ll be 18 next year so I’m hesitant to rock the boat from what’s worked so far.

Any thoughts on Lamarque at Wild Turkey Farm? I’ve done a search here and found a few threads but would be curious for any updates.

On a side note, where did all the L-line blood go?? When I started looking around for a fresh stallion I was shocked by how few choices I’m finding!

[Bayhawk]

[QUOTE=eniskerry;6753211]
Thanks for the replies. I know there are a few good frozen options, but was really hoping to find a stallion available fresh. This mare has never been bred with frozen semen and she’ll be 18 next year so I’m hesitant to rock the boat from what’s worked so far.

Any thoughts on Lamarque at Wild Turkey Farm? I’ve done a search here and found a few threads but would be curious for any updates.

On a side note, where did all the L-line blood go?? When I started looking around for a fresh stallion I was shocked by how few choices I’m finding![/QUOTE]

You can thank Cassini , Caretino , Contender and Corrado for that. They were such consistent inheritors that the breeders quit using L because the market made them rich with the aforementioned stallions.

It is very importtant to think generationally and have L in the motherline.

[Molly_Malone]

Lagoheidor? He’s by Landadel, but I don’t know if that makes him an L line stallion? (although maybe he’s too substantial?)

[RedMare01]

Landkoenig (Hanoverian, by Landadel) is here in the US and is a lovely, top producing stallion. But he will add height, along with great temperament.

[rosebudranch]

What are everyone’s thoughts on Limoncello II?

[Maryanne_Nicpon]

This is one of my Linaro geldings. He is out of an FEI dressage mare. He is winning every weekend in 1.15 and will move up after WEF.

http://www.minglewoodsporthorses.net/Pages/larz.aspx

[Bayhawk]

My German shepherd can win every weekend at 1.15 meter.

Please let us know in the future if you have the extremely rare Linaro that can actually jump at the higher levels.

[Bayhawk]

[QUOTE=rosebudranch;6754405]
What are everyone’s thoughts on Limoncello II?[/QUOTE]

Nice stallion. Nice type and mover. Good for this country. Not meant to make top jumpers with…otherwise he should do very well here producing horses for our predominant amateur market.

[rosebudranch]

[QUOTE=Bayhawk;6755592]
Nice stallion. Nice type and mover. Good for this country. Not meant to make top jumpers with…otherwise he should do very well here producing horses for our predominant amateur market.[/QUOTE]

Good to hear this opinion as I breed for the amateur market

[sixpoundfarm]

Is HH Linton standing with Fresh or Frozen only? Really nice looking stallion, Successful in the upper levels, good damline. Seems to be a reasonable fee too.

[sylvan_farm]

A friend of mine has 2 or 3 Limoncello (at Fox Fire Farm) offspring out of a Rampal mare that are super. Very modern, tall with long legs and big frames. Very good movers with lots of jump. The 4 yr old seems to have unlimited scope. And his 50-something amateur owner rides him.

I bred to Linaro twice, two quite different mares, and the offspring - both fillies - looked exactly like the mothers. So he did not add anything to the mix in this first generation.

[Fred]

I bred to Lavita a number of years ago. I am not sure if he is still standing.
I also bred to Landslide a number of times, and loved the offspring I had but I think he may no longer be with us.
Landslide was inbred to Ladykiller xx which was one of the things I liked about him.

[szipi]

I grew up riding Holsteiners in Europe. Being a very tall guy, they would always put me on the larger stallions, who were almost always direct Landgraf offspring… rode probably a dozen of them, even a couple of older Ladykiller sons. I am very fond of them because of their incredible, steady and smart minds, their movement and their incredibly powerful way of jumping. They all had good technique, with tremendous scope.

Also, they were all slower maturing horses and not as super quick as a lot of jumpers that are preferred today. I believe the reason why they fell out of favor for a good 10-15 year period, was using performance in the young horse classes as a main selection criterion, where there is no time for a horse to mature, they are often pushed to the top way too soon.

Breeders in Europe, however, found out that a lot of times by pursuing the early results and the quickness, they also bred the power, scope and often the steady mind out of their horses and in recent years there is a resurgence of L-line blood.

In the past two decades, breeding my own and training/handling/riding/showing hundreds of Holsteiners or horses with Holsteiner blood, I found that while using a lot of older-type “L” blood on old-fashioned mares may not result in the desired product, however, Landgraf stallions produced a large number of absolutely amazing offspring in the US, where the mares are mostly TBs or TB based.

Some may argue against this point, that there have not been internationally successful “L”-line horses produced in the U.S… I believe this is not necessarily due to `the lack of quality, the lack of “horsepower” (because I worked with a lot of these horses). It is mainly due to the lack of professional, high level training system.

My belief in the above is the reason, as you all know, why I own such an “L”-line stallion, Lotus T. I believe, based on experience that he produces higher quality and with more consistency than most other stallions who I bred to and whose offspring I trained. That’s why I would recommend the O.P. to look into breeding to Lotus T. Now, he is very tall and does produce size… but if the offspring is too tall for most riders’ taste, I might just have to look into buying him/her for myself, hahaha.