Jumpers, if you want an audience, we need to change our image

[twixNnater]

@Denali6298

Your comment about quality is part of the problem. Should I not show the AAs in a pair of $50 breeches, a used non-trendy saddle and a borrowed show coat? Helmet cost is not related to safety btw.

On the contrary. As long as you and your horse are clean, tidy, and making an effort to be well presented you can wear whatever works for you and whatever you can afford. I think this goes triple for kids, because they’re just going to grow out of it anyway. When I was a kid, I was taught that cleaning all of your tack up meticulously, shining your paddock boots, wearing garter straps neatly tucked in, putting your hair in a net, keeping your show clothes clean, and showing up early to bathe any green off your pony and have them dry in time for your class is how you show respect for the judge, your trainer, the show management, your horse, and yourself.

But no, the outfit does not make the rider. When I was trying to do all of this in hand-me-down clothes at shows as a kid there were obviously rich kids who had Tailored Sportsman breeches (back when they were in the prime of their coolness) and new custom or semi-custom boots. However, on the other side of the fence, there was a rag-tag little boy who used to show up on the weekends in a rusted-out stock trailer with an old man and an Appaloosa. That boy looked a hot mess and if anyone could have gone fast enough for no one to see it, it would have been him. (You could still tell…but that may have been because there were lots of stares hoping that Appy wouldn’t catch a toe…if it did, they were going down.) That little boy was Kent Farrington.

However, I will still maintain that the reason you see riders up their fashion game as they go up the levels is because a lot of what goes into the more expensive brands is meant to serve a purpose to riders. Those rubber sticky knee patches you see on Animo, Equiline, GhoDoh, and Cavallaria Toscana breeches freaking work! Way better than suede. I love being able to wash the removable liner in my Samshield helmet. Or replace it when it gets squished down and I feel like my helmet isn’t fitting as tight as I like. Samshield will take my helmet in if I fall and hit my head, thoroughly assess if it’s been damaged, and either fix or replace it.

And it’s a perfect demonstration as to why we need to separate H/J from the jumpers in this thread. Last I checked no one really over analyzes clothing in the jumper ring. Hunters? Well clearly, there are posts that say as much.

And oooooo gurl! What jumper rings have you been at? It’s more fun then the hunters in my part of the world, since you can do so much more. How much bling pushes you over the line to tacky? What coat color can you wear that’s unique, but not gaudy. Oh my gawd did you just see someone in pink/purple polos/boots and matching pad carrying a sparkle heart crop? I’m fairly surprised there’s a self-respecting trainer that would let someone walk out of the barn like that. And if someone where’s a dark thong under their white breeches…lawd have mercy!! Even the nice Safe Sport moment “back in the day” where the jump crew was very happy to see that the plastic surgeon’s attractive wife was wearing a birth control patch on her bum…through her white breeches. (As if that would increase their chances?)

[cdwallflower]

Jimmy Wofford had a similar article in…Practical Horseman ? I beleive, saying the same about how riders need to be more athletic wear and less traditional because the times are changing. I wish I could locate the article, it was a few years ago.

[twixNnater]

@Denali6298

Saddleseat shows the people are at the rail hooting and hollering like and NHL game. It’s impressive really to see the horses get energized and the riders navigate. It’s really cool. It’s also why I think they are nuts lol. But ya know it works and that’s the show atmosphere. It really was no different imo to an NHL game. That’s the sport I grew up watching live. I was in my 20’s when I watched a game on tv for the first time.

The horses can deal. The people can’t.

Thing is. I’ve shared back barn space with Saddleseat people at a combined shows and they’re also spraying fire extinguishers behind their horses on the way up to the ring, because they want them lit up and scared. They get part of their sport’s desired look by having the horses panicked, so roaring crowds right next to the ring helps them, if anything.

Conversely, if you have a nice hunter and you want them to put their head down and poke their nose out in a relaxed position, you’re not going to be excited to have crowds of fans screaming and waving. You think they have a problem with drugging horses now. Imagine what will happen then.

And if you have a competitive jumper you need to come off a short, pretty much blind turn and jump something on a sharp angle at speed to win the jumpoff, you damn sure don’t want it to get distracted by someone in the crowd waving a flag instead of the horse looking where it’s going. That’s a good way to crash or make a stopper out of a nice expensive horse. And the high-level performance horses you watch on TV are worth millions of dollars. In fact, that’s why they took the horse swap out of the final four of the World Cup Finals. Too risky that someone else would crash and break your horse.

[atl_hunter]

@twixNnater

Thing is. I’ve shared back barn space with Saddleseat people at a combined shows and they’re also spraying fire extinguishers behind their horses on the way up to the ring, because they want them lit up and scared. They get part of their sport’s desired look by having the horses panicked, so roaring crowds right next to the ring helps them, if anything.

Thank you for once again being the voice of reason. Part of the culture of that sport is activating the fear response because “it’s pretty.” which is not someplace I want the sport to go.

[Denali6298]

@atl_hunter

Thank you for once again being the voice of reason. Part of the culture of that sport is activating the fear response because “it’s pretty.” which is not someplace I want the sport to go.

So my comment about that was in regards to my friends barn and they did nothing like that. I watched and saw. Ya might want to clean your own house before throwing shade.

Further more, no one in the jumper ring cares how much I have paid for stuff or if I made it myself. If you think they do you are probably the person noticing and your priorities are skewed.

[atl_hunter]

@Denali6298

So my comment about that was in regards to my friends barn and they did nothing like that. I watched and saw. Ya might want to clean your own house before throwing shade.

Further more, no one in the jumper ring cares how much I have paid for stuff or if I made it myself. If you think they do you are probably the person noticing and your priorities are skewed.

Sweetheart, my horse jumped a tinsel jump under a spotlight in a filled arena in Texas to a roaring crowd. You may wanna check yourself, boo. Oh yeah, and he’s a rated hunter who has shown at WEF. He’s also a green.

[Denali6298]

@atl_hunter

Sweetheart, my horse jumped a tinsel jump under a spotlight in a filled arena in Texas to a roaring crowd. You may wanna check yourself, boo. Oh yeah, and he’s a rated hunter who has shown at WEF. He’s also a green.

I wasn’t using you as an example just your post. I have no idea what you do for prep or lack there of. Sorry it came off that way. Also I would love to see a hunter round with a roaring crowd.

[atl_hunter]

@Denali6298

I wasn’t using you as an example just your post. I have no idea what you do for prep or lack there of. Sorry it came off that way. Also I would love to see a hunter round with a roaring crowd.

One of my childhood friends is a Saddlebred trainer and I have known him and the sport for 30 years. I have seen what happens, and I speak from the heart. I have also had the unfortunately duty of standing in for the sponsor of a class, and I had to sit in the middle of the ring with the organ player in a special sponsor chair and watch the madness right from the center of the ring. It was disturbing. I also had the responsibility of pinning the ribbon on a winning horse who had been terrorized by people on the sidelines shaking empty milk cartons filled with rocks. Ever try to pin the ribbon and stand in the win photo with a horse that is fearing for its life? I have. I never went to another show again. It was a whole dfferent picture from the middle of the ring than on the sidelines. It was disturbing.

I will tell you, the event in TX was AWESOME!! I wasn’t able to attend but have the video (I have him in training remotely to give an up and coming apprentice rider a chance to show and bring along a nice green hunter - it’s my way of giving back to the sport). To see my hunter hand galloping around the arena full of hootin’ and hollerin’ Texans, hopping up on a pedestal, and jumping a 3’3" tinsel jump under a spotlight was insane! People came by to get their pic with him and to meet him - they thought it was so cool. I bought him because he was unflappable but this truly endeared him to me. I know people like to make statements on this forum about drugged hunters, etc… but this is just a really well trained, quiet and lovely unflappable horse. He could have a future as a NOLA police horse - he actually loves a crowd and people.

Anyway, there are all kinds of horse expos, and people from all walks of life attend. We could use more outreach attempts from people, like me, who are willing to put their horses out there. When I was a kid, I remember watching the Rose Bowl Parade and there were three girls on their pristine hunters in their show attire. I will age myself here, but it was 1980 and the announcer spoke about how the outfits cost $1000. But as a kid, that made a huge impression on me, because I knew since I was 8 that this sport was going to be expensive and that I would need a good job. It truly inspired me. Now I have the hunter and am doing that same outreach that influenced me when I was a child. If we aren’t a part of the solution, then we are all a part of the problem.

I’m doing my part to help introduce people to the sport and to help young up and coming riders along. My questions is, what is everyone else doing to help?

[Denali6298]

@atl_hunter

One of my childhood friends is a Saddlebred trainer and I have known him and the sport for 30 years. I have seen what happens, and I speak from the heart. I have also had the unfortunately duty of standing in for the sponsor of a class, and I had to sit in the middle of the ring with the organ player in a special sponsor chair and watch the madness right from the center of the ring. It was disturbing. I also had the responsibility of pinning the ribbon on a winning horse who had been terrorized by people on the sidelines shaking empty milk cartons filled with rocks. Ever try to pin the ribbon and stand in the win photo with a horse that is fearing for its life? I have. I never went to another show again. It was a whole dfferent picture from the middle of the ring than on the sidelines. It was disturbing.

I will tell you, the event in TX was AWESOME!! I wasn’t able to attend but have the video (I have him in training remotely to give an up and coming apprentice rider a chance to show and bring along a nice green hunter - it’s my way of giving back to the sport). To see my hunter hand galloping around the arena full of hootin’ and hollerin’ Texans, hopping up on a pedestal, and jumping a 3’3" tinsel jump under a spotlight was insane! People came by to get their pic with him and to meet him - they thought it was so cool. I bought him because he was unflappable but this truly endeared him to me. I know people like to make statements on this forum about drugged hunters, etc… but this is just a really well trained, quiet and lovely unflappable horse. He could have a future as a NOLA police horse - he actually loves a crowd and people.

Anyway, there are all kinds of horse expos, and people from all walks of life attend. We could use more outreach attempts from people, like me, who are willing to put their horses out there. When I was a kid, I remember watching the Rose Bowl Parade and there were three girls on their pristine hunters in their show attire. I will age myself here, but it was 1980 and the announcer spoke about how the outfits cost $1000. But as a kid, that made a huge impression on me, because I knew since I was 8 that this sport was going to be expensive and that I would need a good job. It truly inspired me. Now I have the hunter and am doing that same outreach that influenced me when I was a child. If we aren’t a part of the solution, then we are all a part of the problem.

I’m doing my part to help introduce people to the sport and to help young up and coming riders along. My questions is, what is everyone else doing to help?

That sounds awesome!! And you know your question is mine too. Again I used your post to jump off.

[AffirmedHope]

We have to make it more accessible at the grassroots level. That’s where it has to start, unfortunately, most families can’t afford the $500+ it costs just to board the horse every month.

As for crowds, have any of you been to the Grand Prix at Devon. It gets WILD and most of the horses handle it just fine.

[dags]

I gotta say, this has been a bit of a concerning thread. There is very little prioritization of the horse’s well-being in all this talk of drawing NASCAR-esque crowds… and since we spend half our time complaining about a lack of horsemanship on this board, I am puzzled to say the least.

I think it a bit disingenuous to compare Elite Pro “give back” to the likes of Michael Jordan’s annual basketball camp in Santa Barbara, where all he needs to provide are a court and b-balls. Is the pro supposed to provide a string of school horses for all these up & comers to learn on?

I don’t know if American Royal still holds saddlebreds & hj on the same week, but that was certainly an eye-opening experience for me, and an eye-bulging experience for my poor hunter who found himself surrounded by rattling leg-chains and convinced Jacob Marley himself was coming for him. Then I watched them take those classic white-eyed victory lap photos, complete with a small pot & spoon percussion band chasing the horse, and I’ve had a real hard time finding respect for that discipline ever since.

Devon has helped to change that a bit, and Devon itself seems to be the ideal this thread seeks? Crowds, ferris wheels, heavy spectator traffic, it is a delight. So it does exist, despite the stuffy clothing, because it’s literally nestled in an urban area (and increasingly encroached). Compare to KY Horse Park, 20 minutes from Lex proper, and 20 minutes too far for any of the townies to even consider.

As a junior in Tulsa in the 90s we had exactly one A-rated show, The Tulsa Charity, and the Sunday Grand Prix was held as a stand-alone class downtown in the park or on the fancy golf course, and was WIDELY attended by non-horse folk. They seemed perfectly entertained without all the hootin’ & hollerin’ because let’s face it, showjumping (& dressage) is as much art as it is sport. And just because you don’t go hootin’ & hollerin’ around a museum doesn’t mean you aren’t fascinated by the work, even if you don’t know much about it.

(To that end, some of our horse sports are inherently more dangerous than others, and Grand Prix show jumping is one of them. Mind blown that it is even being discussed that we open the door to fan interference that distracts a prey animal on it’s way to a 5’ oxer.)

I miss those standalone classes. People came with picnic baskets & and paid $X/car or something, and others purchased tables. Us mere mortals showing the jr/am divisions ran during the week at the fairgrounds and helped fill the coffers that afforded the downtown class. I would love to see those come back in some of our smaller cities (ie: not the $$$$$ production they’ve put on in Central Park…) as I believe it truly funneled new kids/clients into local barns.

Otherwise, I very much agree that a lack of physical access to horses is what is slowly strangling the sport (if by sport we mean organized recreational access). But, if remote work continues after Covid, and this exodus from the high-priced cities actually does happen, moving consumers closer to us AND leaving them with a little more cash in their pockets, we might just find some saving grace.

(apologies this is all over the place; was hit with a whole lotta feels following this thread, most based astonishment)

[dags]

@AffirmedHope

We have to make it more accessible at the grassroots level. That’s where it has to start, unfortunately, most families can’t afford the $500+ it costs just to board the horse every month.

As for crowds, have any of you been to the Grand Prix at Devon. It gets WILD and most of the horses handle it just fine.

It gets wild at appropriate times. There is also pin-drop silence, also known as suspense.

[foursocks]

Thank you, dags- very well put. This sport involves animals, not cars or other inanimate objects. It involves horses, not bulls (and rodeos can hit a whole other level of sketchiness that seems fine to not replicate). And it involves jumping large obstacles at speed with large show jumpers, not poor, sweet Saddlebreds or TWHs going around an oval in what passes for a trot and turned into terrified, sweating messes to make it more “exciting.”

And honestly, the clothing part is just a silly thing to fixate on. I was thinking about this subject last night and trying to imagine the ridiculousness of watching dressage riders competing in sporty (whatever that means) clothing versus their tails.

I’ve been watching some of the Miami GCC reruns and all of those random beach spectators seem pretty fascinated with the show jumping, despite the jackets. Olivier Phillappaerts jacket was amazing, by the way!

[Denali6298]

@dags I wish I could like your post more than once. The problem I see is, even with the big classes the excitement isn’t really conveyed on the TV as much as it is in other sports. Live is always more thrilling but when show jumping is broadcast it doesn’t come through. In part the announcers are to blame. They are dry and bland.

[Kirikou]

@dags

Devon has helped to change that a bit, and Devon itself seems to be the ideal this thread seeks? Crowds, ferris wheels, heavy spectator traffic, it is a delight. So it does exist, despite the stuffy clothing, because it’s literally nestled in an urban area (and increasingly encroached). Compare to KY Horse Park, 20 minutes from Lex proper, and 20 minutes too far for any of the townies to even consider.

Coming from Europe I’ve always been puzzled by all this talk in US “English” circles bemoaning the attire (as in spectors don’t want to look at us beign stuffy or men don’t want to event because they have to wear breeches? I mean, what do military guys do in other countries? And American football kids or wrestlers don’t seem to mind wearing tights…)

Anyway, I think the main problem is lack of accessibility: as @dags mentioned earlier Devon seems to run their show more in line with the GCT shows - which tend to draw large crowds of equestrian/non-equestrians alike.
The other part of that lack of accessibility is related to cost: you don’t seem to have much of a “lesson barn” culture here anymore (that other thread about ‘who owns schoolhorses’ was interesting in that so many seem to say “I have a couple schoolies as step up so that clients can buy a horse”). If you look at other countries (UK, Germany, France), there are - affordable - lesson barns in pretty much every town and many kids, at some point in their life, have had some kind of English riding instruction. They’re thus more likely to have an understanding of what’s going on in the ring. (people do ride in the US but more people are familiar with the Western Pleasure/trail riding type of riding which doesn’t have much in common with Grand Prix jumping).
Equestrian sports are never going to be “soccer-like/football-like popular”, but it could be like golf. And the difference between Jumpers/Dressage and golf in the US is that, yes, it can be extremely country-club expensive, but also most towns have a small private 9-hole course where you can go and learn as a not-rich kid or have a beer with your buddies at the weekend (regardless of your socioeconomic bracket). Golf is “approachable” in the US (more so than in Europe actually cost-wise), Jumpers/Dressage discipline-types are not here.

[tohorse]

@Kirikou

Coming from Europe I’ve always been puzzled by all this talk in US “English” circles bemoaning the attire (as in spectors don’t want to look at us beign stuffy or men don’t want to event because they have to wear breeches? I mean, what do military guys do in other countries? And American football kids or wrestlers don’t seem to mind wearing tights…)

Anyway, I think the main problem is lack of accessibility: as @dags mentioned earlier Devon seems to run their show more in line with the GCT shows - which tend to draw large crowds of equestrian/non-equestrians alike.
The other part of that lack of accessibility is related to cost: you don’t seem to have much of a “lesson barn” culture here anymore (that other thread about ‘who owns schoolhorses’ was interesting in that so many seem to say “I have a couple schoolies as step up so that clients can buy a horse”). If you look at other countries (UK, Germany, France), there are - affordable - lesson barns in pretty much every town and many kids, at some point in their life, have had some kind of English riding instruction. They’re thus more likely to have an understanding of what’s going on in the ring. (people do ride in the US but more people are familiar with the Western Pleasure/trail riding type of riding which doesn’t have much in common with Grand Prix jumping).
Equestrian sports are never going to be “soccer-like/football-like popular”, but it could be like golf. And the difference between Jumpers/Dressage and golf in the US is that, yes, it can be extremely country-club expensive, but also most towns have a small private 9-hole course where you can go and learn as a not-rich kid or have a beer with your buddies at the weekend (regardless of your socioeconomic bracket). Golf is “approachable” in the US (more so than in Europe actually cost-wise), Jumpers/Dressage discipline-types are not here.

This. Today we were just rewatching the SJ world cup final and my husband had a funny observation - right after Eve Jobs rode Georgina Bloomberg. He had only a half laugh when he said that perhaps we should reconsider our hobby :o It’s quite sad that the soft image of the sport is that you have to have billionaire parents to make it in this sport at the highest levels. This combined with the general perception that the rider just sits there doing nothing really makes it appear that it’s just one of those things rich people do.

I’m European and I grew up in a lesson barn culture, my parents refused to pay for my lessons after a certain, early age. While it wasn’t easy and I had to groom/exercise ride for a pro to learn the ropes and later leave to be able to show at a national level it was possible. After a couple of years in my mid teens I started working for a breeder on sales commission basis and shown through 1.20 on self made greenies, who weren’t sold at earlier stages (and typically for a reason…). The breeder I rode for paid for my show fees, but they were a fraction of what they are here. There were definitely kids ‘who had it easier’ on made horses, with expensive coaches and coolest tack, but we still rode the same classes and were competitive with each other. Of course the great horses got sold fast, but those of us who didn’t have a stable show horse were often the better riders as far as ability to ride and develop different horses went. I know a couple of girls back home who are still riding on similar terms, others have graduated to being owners and doing the ammy classes. Now that i think about it, the guy who qualified for Tokyo Olympics - a couple years older than me, did have a couple (cheap) horses at a farm his family owned back home literally in the middle of nowhere, but got a few lucky breaks, got noticed by horse owners and look where he is now! He definitely has the talent, but I swear he didn’t come from money. I can’t imagine that sort of story playing out here.

Also now that I think back I think the sport was a lot more supported at the county/municipality level. I know at least in my district the county would allocate some money for the local barns to host shows and some sport barns would get show expenses paid for if they had junior riders (i.e. youth development funds). So there was definitely a lot more support at the local level, shows were far less formal, there was always a food cart, pony rides for 50 cents a lap for spectators, performers, of course the local kids competing and all of it affordable for the average person.