Can someone tell me what these two stallions bring to the table and what type of mare they cross best with? The last two may be too young to really say, but I know the KWPN keeps good data, even on foals.
Negro
Lord Leatherdale
Everdale
Fairytale
As a breeder of Dutch horses I can tell you what adding Negro to the equation is expected to bring - POWER, especially in the hind leg. This goes back to Negro’s sire Olympic Ferro who was a powerhouse… What Negro doesn’t reliably bring to the table is enough length in the front leg, and that’s when you add a German pedigree that provides that - see Lord Leatherdale’s pedigree.
The other two stallions are combinations of the two above with Negro always appearing as the dam sire and Lord Leatherdale as the sire’s father.
Hope this helps…
Thanks Seigi. How about limbs? Is Negro known to pass on good fundamentals (other than length of leg)? How about LL and fundamentals?
And type? Do the Negro offspring have a heavier type?
You’re welcome, Blume Farm…
Looking at my 2012-2013 report of breeding values and statistics for KWPN-approved and KWPN-recognized stallions, here is what it says about Lord Leatherdale and Negro…
Lord Leatherdale -
Dressage - 67%
Conformation - 83%
Loose Movement - 83%
Height - 83%
Negro -
Dressage - 93%
Conformation - 95%
Loose Movement - 95%
Height - 95%
So now you know the reliability factor when it comes to passing on those characteristics, and then you need to know how these stallions were scored for those things at their approvals.
I’m in a little bit of a hurry right now and need to get going, but it probably wouldn’t be hard for you to find those scores.
Best,
Siegi
I’m wondering about the semen quality of Negro vs. his offspring mentioned.
The frozen semen for all of the stallions mentioned by the OP is handled by Hilltop Farm/Select Breeders Services (SBS). Without sounding like an advertisement for them, they will not ship out semen that isn’t practically perfect. Your stud fee for the subject stallions covers not just one insemination and I invite you to read the terms of their frozen semen contract.
I’ve had two Everdale foals this year and am working on a Negro pregnancy as we speak…
Ferro semen was always incredible and it looks like his son Negro’s swimmers are rocket fuel as well.
[QUOTE=siegi b.;7638573]
The frozen semen for all of the stallions mentioned by the OP is handled by Hilltop Farm/Select Breeders Services (SBS). Without sounding like an advertisement for them, they will not ship out semen that isn’t practically perfect. Your stud fee for the subject stallions covers not just one insemination and I invite you to read the terms of their frozen semen contract.
I’ve had two Everdale foals this year and am working on a Negro pregnancy as we speak…
Ferro semen was always incredible and it looks like his son Negro’s swimmers are rocket fuel as well.[/QUOTE]
Awesome. I have always been very impressed with my conversations with Hilltop, but have not used them yet. I appreciate your feedback. I’d love to hear your thoughts on what you got from Everdale sometime. 
We have several Hilltop babies and Hilltop have always been very professional, courteous, and helpful. Highly recommended.
Breeding is a crapshoot, particularly with some in the industry (we just added a real classic to our list of horror stories - another cycle missed!).
It is my understanding that Negro offspring are considered “late bloomers” and that they can be difficult in the wrong hands. I seriously considered breeding to Negro about 5 years ago. I knew a couple of Negro offspring in person, knew a person whose daughter was a working student with Anne v. Olst and rode several offspring, owned/campaigned one successfully in Europe. Many were considered to be of “tricky” temperament, best suited for a more professional or very experienced amateur ride.
[QUOTE=TrotTrotPumpkn;7638608]
Awesome. I have always been very impressed with my conversations with Hilltop, but have not used them yet. I appreciate your feedback. I’d love to hear your thoughts on what you got from Everdale sometime. ;)[/QUOTE]
I have used Hilltop and will attest to their great professionalism.
J-Lu - It always takes two to tango… Would I breed a mare with a “tricky” temperament to Negro? Probably not, but that’s because I think the mare contributes more in the “temperament” department because she’s the one raising the foal.
I bred my good minded ex-FEI Dutch keur sport mare to Negro last year and she had a lovely Negro filly this April. My mare is not super modern, but she is not a very heavy mare, and her bloodline is about 30% TB, so I felt I could go with Ngro since I had heard that his offspring could be a bit on the heavy side. I chose Negro because I was looking for dressage talent and I was aware of what everyone says about him not adding front leg height. I am breeding for myself and I am a competent adult amateur who works full time with a trainer.
I really like my Negro filly. While I don’t think Negro added leg, he didn’t remove leg. She is shorter coupled than her mother which I think is a plus, and I think this was from Negro. The filly has a very pretty head and overall is very well put together, but her mother is a good mare so I cannot attribute these qualities just to Negro. She is very bold and friendly and tends to be a “busy” baby (she goes over to look at everything , mouths things, picks things up, will pick up buckets and plastic bags and shake them, etc.)I have already trailered her with mom 3x and she went right on and off the trailer without any fuss. She is learning how to lead easily. So she seems to be a very smart and trainable baby, but I am expecting that she will test me at some point, since she can sometimes be a bit pushy. I would not want to see her in inexperienced hands because I think she is smart enough to develop bad habits, but she responds quickly to correction and seems eager to please. I am particularly pleased with her movement; she is a little powerhouse with a lot of suspension in the trot and good mechanics. My mare is a very good mover, but I do think Negro added the suspension in the trot. Overall, I would have considered rebreeding my mare to Negro, but had already booked her to Everdale for this year.
One stallion that I think sounds interesting is Wynton (Jazz x Matador II). I hear his temperment is not as hot and spooky as Jazz but he seems to have retained Jazz movement and talent in dressage. It looks like he may throw a longer leg, but I am not sure about this. He has several approved sons, is competing at the Grand Prix level.
Hilltop was awesome to work with and my 20 year old mare took with a single dose of Negro frozen semen, however I did bring her to Mid Atlantic for ultrasound monitoring for breeding. The semen quality was excellent, per my vet.
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