Lameness- possible ring bone

[Madi96]

My mare has been off on her left front for a week and a half now. I thought it was because I had a bad farrier (all her shoes were falling off, I’m relatively new to the area and got the person from a list people at the barn apparently use). I just got her a new farrier (seems much better so far) and her shoes are all fixed. He did suspect that the lameness may be from ringbone and couldn’t find anything when he tested her left hoof. My horse has only been handwalked since Tuesday of last week with a ride that ended up being very light today (thought she’d be better with the new shoes). Left my vet a voicemail asking when she can come out to do x rays but what should I do up to that point? Just keep handwalking or would a turnout be ok as well? She usually just rolls. The weather is supposed to get rainy/windy so likelihood is she will be extra challenging to handle- I can tell she already has a lot of energy. Thinking of cutting her hay and/or grain back- thoughts?

on a differential note can anybody tell me about the x ray process or their experience with ring bone if you have had one? Are x Ray results immediate? I find it odd that she feels good going to the right but not when going to left. I’m a first time horse owner and pretty new so I’m still learning a lot when it comes to things like lameness.

As for “symptoms” of ring bone the only thing is the change of gait (feels good going to the right but lame to the left) and some hardness the farrier felt on the medial area I believe near the pastern. There is no heat or swelling anywhere on her left leg and when getting shoes she showed no signs of being in pain. Some background info: she’s a 22 yr old big warmblood with a slight left hind suspensory ligament issue. She is on monthly adequan and legend shots and gets a daily equiox tablet. She is stalled and moving to pasture is not an option.

Sorry the post is huge, trying to give a decent description of what’s going on! Any responses would be greatly appreciated!

[Scribbler]

Don’t cut back hay, but feel free to cut back grain. I would give her quiet turnout. I believe ring bone is most closely related to arthritic ossification, so movement isn’t going to make it way worse the way moving on a soft tissue injury does.

It is very common for horses to show up lamer in one direction than the other because of how the weight the different legs in a circle or corner. Indeed that’s a major diagnostic tool to help you figure out which leg is the problem.

IME xrays are immediate, the vet calls them up on their laptop and discusses them with you there.

Ringbone is like arthritis progressive and irreversible. You might want to Google this. There are things to ease the pain and slow the progress.

For an older WB who is also already on maintenance, it could be anything. Certainly a bad shoeing job could cause soft tissue injury inside the foot.

Did you do a pre purchase exam with xrays when you bought her last year,?

[Madi96]

No prepurchase exam. I was leasing her with two other people and asked the owner about bringing her to college with me and essentially got her for free. Her former owner told me she never had any foot issues the only thing being that they are small for how big she is. I somewhat know her former owner through other people I know in the horse world and doubt her former wouldn’t have disclosed past feet issues if she had any though

[Scribbler]

OK, that makes sense. If she has ringbone it has probably been growing slowly for some time, and you would have seen it on PPE xrays if you had done them.

A 22 year old huge warmblood mare is going to be somewhat fragile. The bigger they are, the more stress on their legs. Small feet are another weakness. Also once there is a chronic problem in one foot or leg, they can injure another foot or leg compensating for that.

You say she is on adequan and legend. Those are typically prescribed for joint problems. Do you know what her joint problems are?

She is also on a daily NSAID anti inflammatory pain killer. Do you know why that was prescribed?

This is where a PPE could have given you a good baseline for knowing exactly what’s going on with this mare.

And yes, if you used a bad farrier that cut her feet to the wrong angles and then she pulled off her shoes, absolutely she could have aggravated an existing or latent condition, or had a new acute injury such as pulling a ligament inside her hoof.

[Madi96]

I put her on adequan over summer because she has arthritis and was stiff. I’m not a super big fan of powder supplements for her since she’s a super messy eater when she eats her grain. A bunch of people at my barn at home use adequan and recommended it. The vet also thought she could benefit from something for her joints. As for the legend and equiox when I brought her up to school she was “dragging” her hind legs and her trot was uneven. This happened two days after she ran back to the barn when I was trying to get her used to the property. Had the vet out and she noticed her left fetlock drops lower than the right. The vet said he thinks it’s her left suspensory so she’s in equiox which put her pretty much back to normal. We added lengend since the adequan wasn’t enough.

Regarding her shoes I should probably clarify she did not pull them off. The shoes were still on the toe but not on the heel so when she lifted her feet the shoe would drop a bit.

For decreasing her food intake why is it better to reduce grain over hay?

[Scribbler]

Grain (which isn’t always really grsin) is more concentrated calories that can give extra energy and many horses do just fine without grain especially if they aren’t in work.

Hay or grass, on the other hand, is the necessary basic food for horses and they are designed to graze about 18 hours a day. If you are worried about high energy cut the grsin. Not the hay.

I recommend Juliet Gettys Feed Your Horse Like a Horse for a good overview of current best practices in horse nutrition. It’s your first horse, you need to get up to speed fast on this.

As far as the equioxx, am I to understand that the horse was lame, vet says suspensory problems and possibly dropping fetlock, so you put her on a painkiller and kept her in work?

If that is the case you need a new vet. Once the tendons get strained or injured the horse needs rest not just painkillers. The equivalent for humans might be carpal tunnel syndrome which just gets worse and worse if you pop advil and try to ignore it.

Dragging hinds is often a sign of suspensory damage, more than arthritis.

Honestly not everyone can manage to keep an older horse with preexisting issues sound. It takes care, medical intervention, and sensible attention to rest and workload.

I know one teen at our barn that was leasing steady older horses, and she managed to lame at least 3 into early retirement.

Anyhow, I think you need to get a lameness workup with this horse now from a good lameness vet including all the xrays you would do on a PPE. You need to know what is going on in there to have a treatment plan, which might include some stall rest and some expensive meds.

As you do your belated PPE, you also want to consider if this horse is in fact the right horse for you right now. If she is on lease, you might want to send her back to her owners? If they have been doing a better job of maintaining her soundness? Because this horse may not hold up to the level of riding you want to do given your current level of horse care savvy.

[Madi96]

I own her as stated… as for my vet she was the head surgeon for years at UC Davis, so I am sure she is just fine. She is not on equiox because it is a painkiller- she is on it because it is also an anti inflammatory. We also did flexion tests. Again, with the equiox she returned very close to normal- just a long warm up needed. My vet is not concerned about the suspensory issue, just said it is very minor and to watch it. I wouldn’t have put her back in work if she wasn’t better. I appreciate your advice but respectfully disagree and trust my vet about how to handle her suspensory. She was struggling with the work prior to being on equiox but the work actually helped her feel better. Regarding if she is the right horse for me, I would appreciate it if you did not comment on this. I knew she was an old horse when I decided to own her, and the story of how it worked out is long and complicated. If she can no longer handle the work of course I will always do what is in my horse’s best interest and keep a cautious eye on her. I am aware of my experience level but I am trying my best and have trainers etc to help me. Thank you for explaining the grain though. Hers is a beet based low sugar for seniors but also high in fat so that makes sense (I am aware of their grazing nature but my horse gets 5 flakes of hay given her size so I was wondering if it would be better to cut since she has so much or replace it with some lower calorie stuff)

[Scribbler]

Ok I am glad to hear you are confident in your vet care. You should be taking all your questions about this new problem to your excellent vet.

As far as nutrition, I’m recommending an excellent book (it was the recommended reading for the Equine Nutrition Coursera I took a few years back) because it will explain in detail why a foraged based diet is so important, and why you don’t cut out hay if a horse is on stall rest.

You could give her ample hay plus a ration balancer if you are worried about her getting explosive or fat in your current grsin. Though beet pulp plus fat is more a “cool calorie” recipe.

As far as whether this horse is right for you, if you ask for advice on COTH people can and will say whatever occurs to them. My point was that if the mare is showing more and more lameness problems you may not be able to keep her sound and working at your desired level.

I do think you should ask your very excellent vet for a more systematic workup so you know what’s really going on in there and you can be proactive.

[Marla_100]

Madi96- respectfully said- When you come on a horse forum seeking help and suggestions for problems you’re

having- please LISTEN, don’t argue, and take in the suggestions from responders and consider the poster could

be helpful. It doesn’t help if you immediately defend your vet- who may or may not be a hands on, experienced

lameness vet. An ex-surgeon may not be the best analytical determiner of actual lameness. Surgeons are

usually good at repairing problems but that is after a lameness vet diagnosed the problem.

When you’re new and inexperienced with horses, it’s always best to just be quiet and LISTEN. Otherwise you’re

like the hundreds of other NEW posters who come here, asking for help or suggestions and then turn around and

tell a poster they’re all wrong and you know your ‘excellent’ ex- surgeon vet is the best of the best at lameness.

Just listen and consider the poster may be helpful and correct.

[Madi96]

While I don’t agree with everything I do see what you’re saying. I’m planning on taking a look at the reading mentioned. My original post was to get people’s experience with x rays and/or ring bone. Thanks for people’s info with the x Ray part though.

[Scribbler]

Well, get a diagnosis first before you worry to much about ringbone. Also ringbone can affect different parts of the pastetn with different effects.

Xrays and other radiographing techniques are common and portable these days and the vet will interpret them right there at the appointment. However it is also worth noting that visible damage may not correlate with pain. A horse can have ugly xrays and no pain, or an X-ray that looks ugly but is not the source of the pain.

I agree that a really top lameness specialist is going to probably have more ideas about hoof and legs than, say, someone that specializes in colic surgery. You might want to ask your vet for a referral. I honestly am worried about a drooping fetlock.

If you want the basics on ringbone and portable radiograph options, there are lots of general overviews on line that are accurate and basic.

[Madi96]

Ok thanks! That gives me a better idea.

[shortenmyreins]

My experience with ringbone was on my gelding about 15 years ago. It’s basically a type of arthritis, so easy movement is good for them. He warmed up slowly - he got a solid 10 minutes of walking at the beginning of the ride, then he would pick up a slow, shuffly trot. I ignored the horrible feeling of the shuffle trot until he started to take longer steps and reach for the contact. He told me when he was ready to get to work. He got bute before I rode - Equioxx was not around at that time.

He told me that he wasn’t comfortable jumping anymore - he didn’t want to land on that left front. He also made a point of always stepping down into his stall with his good front leg. Big lengthened trots and lots of canter seemed to bother him but for regular stuff there was no noticeable lameness once he warmed up. When hacking out I always walked down hills as downhill is hard on them.

Ringbone can be articular (in the joint) or non-articular (not in the joint). Where it’s located will likely have some effect on what type of treatment would be done. We think that my horses ringbone also bothered his suspensory ligament.

I would be concerned if my horse was already on a daily dose of Equioxx and was showing lameness. I would turn my horse out daily until the vet arrives, unless the lameness gets worse. If the horse is currently noticeable lame at a walk, that might be a different story. Handwalking should be no problem - arthritic joints need to keep moving.

But as always, get a vet out to get the correct answer for your situation.

[Madi96]

Thanks for the info! She is normal at the walk, but I agree it’s concerning that she’s already on equiox and lame. The vet’s coming out in a couple days but wanted to get a little info on ring bone beforehand in case she does have it. Thanks again.

[stanza]

My guy was diagnosed with “Ringbone” back in 2011. Ringbone as I understand it, is Osteoarthritis. Sadly, my guy has it in his lower and upper pastern. I did a lot of research and found a drug called Pentosan can help with this type of arthritis, and started him on it back in 2013. It worked for him, but now he is 22 yrs old and I’m having trouble keeping him sound.
One thing that helps a horse with Ringbone is having a good breakover, and being regular with the trim/shoeing. My “lameness” vet, said if a horse can go without shoes, and you find a good barefoot trimmer, it’s better for a horse with arthritis to go without shoes.

[Madi96]

Ok thanks for the info! I found out that my girl does have ring bone and significant arthritis. I’m going to retire her but want to keep her as comfortable as possible. I was talking with some people and they also mentioned Pentosan- I’ll definitely check it out. Will also have the farrier add a break over to her shoes.