Lease and Trainer Commission

[Demerara_Stables]

@findeight

And yes, even small private barns I boarded at had a boarding contract even if it was only two paragraphs. Also, yes I have had to produce a boarding contract (and in one case proof of ownership). Twice, once after a barn was foreclosed and seized by authorities and once when the trainer/BM was physically evicted immediately from the property by law enforcement at the direction the property owner/landlord.

In a third case, I saw signs I didn’t like and left one barn a few weeks before ATF raided it for guns and drugs. Everybody who was still there had to show valid contract and proof of ownership before removing their horses and the feds were not easy to deal with as far as their tack and equipment.

Omg

@Topline888 there should absolutely be a boarding contract, and although the best ones are written by attorneys, I think it’s prudent to ask for one (even if it is very basic and not by an attorney which of course is $$$).

I have a boarding contract, but not yet a training contract, although I charge for training a la carte and provide my rates and policies in writing ahead of the client moving in. When my program is larger I will add a training contract. My policies are very straightforward but I want everyone to be on the same page so there are no surprises on either end. IME that keeps a lot of sour grapes out of the relationship.

[OverandOnward]

I am so done with every excuse horse people can come up with for no contracts. And then the horror that – gasp – someone cheated them, and there is no real recourse.

At this point in history, the horse industry has to start considering itself an adult. It is time to see a refusal, or simply the absence, of a written, signed contract, for buying/selling, for boarding, for help with a search, etc. and so on, as a Big Red Flag.

Not having a contract leaves the person fronting the money unprotected. Those trainers, and others, including horse owners/sellers/buyers, who act as if wanting a contract is a shocking level of distrust, should be the ones who are viewed with suspicion.

It doesn’t have to be a multi-page tome with every legal nuance detailed. It can be a one-page list of the items agreed. Signed by all parties. That may not be the “best” contract or agreement, but it is better than nothing.

One of the primary reasons to have a contract is not because of lack of trust. It is a written set of reminders to both parties of what was agreed. Memories drift, naturally. Apart from the intentional memory drift.

It’s time for a refusal to sign a contract to be a reason to walk away. From a deal, from a seller, and from a trainer or barn owner/manager.

[findeight]

It’s not that I don’t trust you, it’s that I don’t trust anybody. Simple. Practice saying and doing it with any body or entity you give money to in return for a service.

[Demerara_Stables]

@OverandOnward

It is a written set of reminders to both parties of what was agreed.

This. I hate doing things in person or over the phone without a written summary afterwards. I often go back in texts to remind myself what we agreed to, and in this industry where it seems EVERYONE does something a little bit different, writing down exactly how you do things means no one assumes what the process is and is surprised later.

[paw]

@OverandOnward

G-you would not be in contact with so many people and horses of that interest without the trainer’s investment and time into maintaining a facility and a program that facilitates g-your horse activity. Without it, g-you would not have found this horse. Even if the trainer did not directly assist.

OMG - seriously? No. Just no. There are lots of ways folks can be acquainted with other horse folk that do not involve (g)you. I do not owe (g)you a commision on a horse I find without (g)your actual involvement. (G)You may decline to accept this new horse, in which case I will take my business elsewhere.

[findeight]

That kind of depends on the buyers background and experience selecting suitable horses for their specific needs and expectations though. Particularly dealing out of their local area/state/country with professional dealer/sellers in an industry not known for….ahhhh…truth in advertising. Heck, many operate without even written contracts as discussed above.

[OverandOnward]

@paw

@OverandOnward

G-you would not be in contact with so many people and horses of that interest without the trainer’s investment and time into maintaining a facility and a program that facilitates g-your horse activity. Without it, g-you would not have found this horse. Even if the trainer did not directly assist.

OMG - seriously? No. Just no. There are lots of ways folks can be acquainted with other horse folk that do not involve (g)you. I do not owe (g)you a commision on a horse I find without (g)your actual involvement. (G)You may decline to accept this new horse, in which case I will take my business elsewhere.

The way this is written totally misread the quoted paragraph.

“I do not owe (g)you a commision on a horse …” The commission discussed was to the trainer who maintains a program, and possibly a facility as well. Not to the individual who is not a trainer. The entire post outlines the scenario a bit more.

Just noting that, otherwise it doesn’t really matter. Other people seem to have understood it.

[paw]

I don’t believe I misread. I would not pay a commission to a trainer in whose program I rode who was not directly involved in the purchase of a horse I bought. The idea that I “would not be in contact” with the right people but for involvement with the trainer is likely BS.

[findeight]

You know, many times advice offered is aimed at the general readership likely to be looking for advice and not directed specifically at anybody. Don’t take it personally, many readers may lack your experience based network.

[Demerara_Stables]

All the more reason we should educate the general, less experienced, readership about sketchy policies so they can choose what trainer to work with with their eyes wide open.

There is absolutely benefit to working with a trainer throughout the whole process for the less experienced buyer, and in that instance where the trainer is actively helping you search and try the horses, you should pay a commission. However, saying that you should pay a commission because you happen to have your horse with BNT Mary and that means that Sally Smith also trains there so you can buy her step down horses is nonsense.

[OverandOnward]

That is why we have contracts. So everyone knows up front what they are agreeing to.

If someone disagrees with something in the contract, they don’t have to a sign on. And/or they can ask for a change. They can sign a version that is more specific to their case.

Everyone will be clear about the expectations, from the beginning.

Many potential conflicts can be avoided, or quickly resolved by referring to the contract.

[Demerara_Stables]

@Topline888

We have no boarding contract.

Yes, we should, but we (g) often don’t.