Leasing - the good, bad, and ugly!

[raisethebar]

I have never personally leased out any of my animals but lately I have read quite a few Facebook posts about how terrible people’s experience with leasing was. Is that the norm? In the future, if all goes well with my guy/my life, I think this is something I would consider for my situation. I know each and every situation depends on 1 - person leasing, 2 - owner, and 3 - horse but there are so many situations for me to consider…

* What percent of hunter/jumper horses do you think are leased out in the US?
* How easy have your experience with leasing been?
* Do you find that people tend to re-lease horses easily?

I am also looking into hearing how many of you on here had good but also bad lease situations. What happened? Where/why did it go wrong? Where/why did it go right?

I just would like to educate myself on the situation. The concept sounds great, but is this something I’m willing to risk?

Thanks!

[2tempe]

Back in my H/J days, I leased two different horses. One was owned by out of state trainer who leased to me w/ requirement that he stay with my trainer (they knew each other well), no higher jumping that Adult Ammy classes. It was a paying lease 6 month increments, I had him two years. It was all fine, no issues. Formal lease document.
Second time was a free lease, owner couldn’t get horse sold over summer, I offered to take over his board and care, and show him a little over the winter. Very informal, no paperwork, just a toast at cocktail party, lol. Had him about 9 months or so, and we did well; she got him sold as a result.
Have leased out my dressage mare - to a trainer I knew. Formal document, went to another barn. It was fine.

Do it with people you know and trust. Do it with a document. Put jumping limits on it. - you cant necessarily control what is done at home but it is better than nothing…
IMO, no stats, leasing in the hunter world is somewhat common. Jumpers, dont know. Dressage much less common.

[silver_charm]

The only time I leased outside of the barn, horse was already coming in on trial to be a lesson horse. He’d been out of work, 0% suited for the original job. Another girl at the barn and I leased him for a year from the owner as a jumper. Paid for insurance, had a contract, kept the owner updated with any sort of maintenance questions and as we moved him up to new jump heights. Everything was dependent on staying with trainer, as we did end up moving barns. Lease ended a few months early due to sudden lameness, we had the vet out and based on the diagnosis owner decided on surgery to be done back with her vets. All very civil with good communication.

I hope to do another full lease in the future, again within a stable program with insurance and a contract. With the availability of social media and the ease of photos/videos now I feel like it’s easier to keep track of how the lease is actually going. If owners are really concerned, keeping them in barn or at least within a certain radius is pretty common.

[Sueby]

I lease one of my hunters to a lady at our barn and it is a great arrangement. She pays for all the expenses, minus his insurance costs, I pay that annually. It’s been almost 2 years now and they love each other and he is looked after so well under her care. He will also retire at her place when it’s time.

He had to be leased out of the facility I’m at (we both have the same coach anyway) and that was pretty much my only stipulation in our contract.

[OneTwoMany]

We have a sales barn. If a horse won’t vet 100% clean, sometimes leasing is a good compromise. However, we only transact with trainers we know, or trainers that have a good reputation in the industry. It is so easy for a lease to go wrong and when it does, the owner bears the most risk. It cannot be emphasized enough that it is important to transact with a professional with a good reputation.

I would guess we have offered leases on 10-15% of our horses, again, in order to over-come concerns around vetting issues. All of our leases were lease to buy and they all ended up in a purchase.

Of course it goes without saying that you need a good contract, insurance and you should have a means by which to check up on the horse during the lease period.

[Jersey_Fresh]

I am no longer a H/J rider but I leased my hunter now eventer for 7 years (the grey in my picture). It was a free lease where I paid all expenses on him but didn’t pay them a fee. I had a great experience and got to have a horse I couldn’t afford to buy outright at the time and they got a great home for a horse they weren’t able to sell. We had a very good lease contract in place.

I kept him at my trainers barn until I moved him home about 5 years into the lease. The only minor issues I had were when the owner would offer up opinions on his care that went against what I felt was right and some times, hurt my feelings because I felt like it implied I didn’t take good care of him. For instance, expressing concern about me moving him home to my own farm-which I felt was 100% unwarranted-because among other things, we both traveled for work. I explained to her that I had a ton of experience and that we had multiple farm sitters lined up for the rare time both my husband and I were out of town. Part of why we moved them home was because his care at a full care barn had become questionable (horse was losing weight, I found him without water a few times etc) and I didn’t trust the BO anymore but I never told her that.

There were a few other instances like suggesting I didn’t vary what I did enough (I did dressage, jumping and XC lessons, hunter paces, trail rides and hauled him to the park in town at least twice a month to hack out) but again those were minor.

I respected her opinion but also felt that I had leased the horse longer than they had owned him before leasing him out, and I knew him like the back of my hand. And in those 7 years, he had turned into a completely different horse than what they knew.

The hardest part for me was knowing every year, at lease renewal time, they could just tell me they wanted him back and refuse to renew the lease. So I walked on eggshells every May. It all worked out and after those 7 years, my in laws purchased him for me as a birthday present to make him “officially” part of the family.

[OneTwoMany]

@Jersey Fresh

The hardest part for me was knowing every year, at lease renewal time, they could just tell me they wanted him back and refuse to renew the lease. So I walked on eggshells every May. It all worked out and after those 7 years, my in laws purchased him for me as a birthday present to make him “officially” part of the family.

What a terrific outcome. Your in-laws sound like wonderful people. Congrats!!

[Xctrygirl]

Have leased a few times and they were mostly really good transactions. You definitely need a solid lease contract. There are great ones for purchase online. DON’T skip that step. It can protect your horse and your interests.

I will lease again and I think the only thing I would shore up is that any set requirements (Shoe types, vaccination date range reqs and show limitations) might be spelled out a bit better in the next go round. Nothing earth shattering but those were areas where some liberties were taken to my dismay.

Em

[Jersey_Fresh]

@OneTwoMany

What a terrific outcome. Your in-laws sound like wonderful people. Congrats!!

Thank you. They are incredibly generous. He is the most annoying, frustrating, pain in the butt horse I have ever ridden-the highest of highs and the lowest of lows. But he has taught me so much wouldn’t trade him for anything.

Now that he’s 19 and I finally own him, I know he will live out his days here and be buried on our farm when the time comes. That alone was a big reason why they bought him for me.

[blondewithchrome]

I have leased a few and have always had a great experience, both as the lessor and leasee. In both scenarios, I signed a formal lease contract stipulating payments, boarding location, supplements, veterinarian preferences, long term injury procedures, etc. any major changes in program or location needed to be approved in writing by owner. perhaps a little excessive, but I want all bases covered!

“Releasing” is a tricky concept IMO because at some point, depending on the lease, the leasee may have paid the price of purchasing the horse (if for example, lease of horse is 1/3 his sale cost/market value, and you lease for 3 years…well, maybe should have just bought the horse) - however if you have no intention of selling your horse and your leasee just loves him and wants to renew the lease, well then, there you have it!

I agree, having a formal contract in place is absolutely necessary. You can search this forum for “lease” threads and read a few horror stories…

[Classic]

I have overseen several very successful lease situations. The best ones are for sweet horses that may have a couple of limitations, but are healthy enough to do two fun lessons per week and some showing. And the owners’ child who owned or leased the horse is in college and because they are so attached they don’t want to sell and want it to stay with the trainer who knows all of its traits and knows how to keep it happy.

[heelsdownlibby]

I’ve leased three horses.
The first one was with my very first coach, I was about 11 at the time, had been riding once a week for a few years, and we wanted to lease before buying. I leased him for two years, he was the perfect horse to learn on! Not a show animal, he was an old trail horse that was 100% bombproof. It was a great situation so we could have a little more experience before I got my own.

The second wasn’t so great. This time I was 15-16, and did already have a horse of my own. A lady who usually hauled in her horses to the barn I was at for lessons and training let me “free lease” her gelding at the farm. We paid to renew his coggins and vaccines so I could show him, got his feet done, teeth floated, chiro, and SmartPaks to get him in show shape (he was a skinny tb pasture puff when he first came to the farm) and I rode him nearly every day. Long story short we (my parents and I) were naive and there was no contract. The owner completely disappeared for a couple of months, and didn’t pay board. Eventually she started coming out all the time to ride her horse, and I was upset because she wanted nothing to do with him at the beginning, and then after we got him healthy and fit and went to a couple of shows she wanted him back, at the beginning we thought we might buy him and then she decided he wasn’t for sale when he was fixed. My trainer at the time terminated the lease and made her take him home. I was angry at my trainer at the time, but she did make the right decision for me and I’m thankful now. I’m really glad we didn’t buy him, because then I probably wouldn’t have gotten Rivie.

The last situation was for Rivie, my big warmblood jumper mare. I leased her at our farm, not theirs, for 4 months before we bought her. The family who owned her were friendly acquaintances, and they asked if I’d be interested in leasing her because they saw my ISO ad and she fit most all the criteria. She’d been sittin in a pasture for six months, and they were deciding if they wanted to breed her, so they had me lease her for that quarter (3 months) and then in March we could either purchase or she’d be in shape to be bred. It extended until mid April because towards the end the PPE showed she was a roarer, but we opted out of tieback surgery (which is what her previous owners wanted, but we got a couple other vet’s opinions before making our decision. Their insurance would have covered surgery but our insurance lists it as a pre-existing condition. Same company, she just changed hands.)

Leasing can be a great tool to get to know a horse or to feel like owning one with less commitment, but always have a contract and stick to it!

[WolfestoneFarm]

I’ve never leased but I have leased my mare out twice. So this is just my experience as someone who has leased out. And just something to be aware of when you do lease.

First experience was a short term lease to an extremely small college program. They used her for advanced lessons. It was a great fit and they took amazingly great care of her. She came home at the end of the semester and was delivered looking the exact same way she left. I would lease to the program again in a heartbeat.

My second lease was AWFUL! We had an equine lawyer make up a contract which included insurance requirements, feeding requirements, and the condition in which she should be returned. I did a property check at the barn before she went and the woman rode her for a few weeks prior to taking her. After five months I got a phone call saying my mare was dangerous and needed to be returned. They dropped her off the next day. She was 200 lbs underweight (they had switched her diet completely because they didn’t want to purchase Cavalor). Her mane was 8 inches long and she wasn’t body clipped like I had asked. I got on her and she immediately panicked and almost flipped over. We had the vet out and she had a separated pelvis. After a million attempts to contact them the trainer called and said my mare had slipped and fell on concrete and broke the tree of their saddle. They wanted me to reimburse them for the loss. Countless attempts to get them to have their insurance company pay for my vet bills was a complete fail. We ended up retiring her and She happily lives in my backyard with a miniature donkey… a far cry from her days as a 1.20m Jumper just three years ago.

So my biggest piece of advice would be… always communicate with the owner and return them in the same condition they came in. Always be honest and follow through with your contract. I didn’t go after them legally I just was glad my mare was home. She was in a stall for six months and has a hitch in her step. But she LOVES being a retired princess lol