Others may correct me but a mini donkey might solve your problems. My ex-boyfriend had one who was lovely…but over a period of time he killed three large dogs who were in the pasture. He was just doing his job!
As a dog trainer - as huge, big, no to the B. Tervuen. Fantastic dogs - they are on my want list. But not for the novice owner who will be short on time. Great Pyr. will likely not be satisfied with “only” five acres to roam. If possible I think a donkey may be a great answer!
5 acres is the total property? So remove at least 1/2 acre for the house and whatever lawn and driveway you have.
I would not at all consider any LGD breed for a first-time dog. They really do require very careful people socialization so you don’t end up with a dog who disobeys you (common with those breeds) and attacks someone invited onto your property as their way of defending it.
5 acres really isn’t enough - they WILL be leaving, one way or another.
If you have just 1 horse right now, and that will be Horse 1 on the property, then right off I’d get a mini donk who is already known to dislike “visitors”. Keep in mind if you end up with a pet dog of your own, donk may not take kindly to him either, and that’s ok if what you’re really after is a donk who will keep fox and coyotes away. You’ll just have to never let your dog in range of donk.
4 acres is the most pasture you’re going to have, by the time you take into account a shelter, dry lot, manure management area, and hay storage. The more different animals you get, the more variety of paddocks you’re going to need. Horses can live with sheep and goats, but you’re still talking about quite small acreage, and they’ll all have to be off grass when it’s too wet.
That means a few smaller paddocks, and that means the more animals, or the more variety of animals, the more separation they’ll need, or you raise the risk of fights and injury.
While I was one of the people who said “donkey,” and I myself own mini donkeys… I do not recommend a mini-donkey if you are worried about coyotes, etc. While adorable and wonderful, and yes deadly to smaller dogs, coyotes are not solo and a pair will take down even the meanest mini. Most minis are 30-35’’ and IME are daintier than their horse counterparts. They have the kill-kill-kill drive, but they also know when they are outmatched and will run. Plus I think a standard will make maintenance alongside a horse easier, minis need more micro (or mini?) managing :lol:.
A standard would be far better. I may eventually get a standard for Rory because he grew up playing with a mini, so he has all the wrestling and mean donkey tricks down pat but grew too big for his mini.
I have to agree with TheJenners’ comments. A mini-donk would be prey for predators. I’d also be worried about the amount of grass a mini would consume paired with a horse. Many years ago, we had 3 standard donkeys with our Shires and after about 2 years or so, we had to fence off a smaller paddock for the donks because they had access to too much grass. My farrier and I were worried about the consequences for their feet and weight.
We now have 2 Poitou donkeys and they have their own small field. When the Shires have eaten down a sufficient amount of grass in their own field, we move them down to the next field and then let the donks graze the Shires’ upper field. It has worked very well. Having said that, there are no large predators here in the UK that would preclude the horses, donkeys, and our 8 pet sheep from living out 24/7 in the mild weather.
Donkeys are excellent “guards” and will bray and/or chase off any predators once they have a sense of their territory. There are quite a few sheep owners who subscribe to the keeping of donkeys to protect their flocks.
While I have never owned goats, I have a friend who does. Keeping goats is not the same as keeping sheep. Apparently, goats need dry shelter from wet weather to prevent pneumonia, among other problems.
You don’t need a lgd or a personal protection dog. You need what us southerners call a yard dog. A yard dog stays in the yard and alerts you to the presence of visitors, intruders and varmints. They should have a big enough bark and presence to deter people from just bopping up to the house but not bad enough to eat the UPS guy. The presence of a yard dog will also deter varmints.
My best yard dogs have all been dumped. For some reason, they seem to appreciate having a warm, dry bed and regular meals. Currently I have 3 yard dogs, a bloodhound, a catahoula and Buster, a lab/pit mix. Buster is the best of the lot. He seems to be able to distinguish between folks that might be up to no good and repairmen, delivery people, etc. He is incredibly loyal.
I would go to the shelter or rescue and look for a youngish big friendly mutt. There are tons of lab mixed out there. Don’t discount pit mixes. They can be wonderful dogs. If possible find an experienced dog person to help you pick.
As far as predators are concerned, is there a problem in your area? Rural coyotes generally prey on small game, carrion and fruits. There are tons of coyotes in my area, but we have no problem with livestock predation. They might take a kid or a mini goat but I doubt if they’d tackle a mini donkey.
Personally, I wouldn’t have goats. BTDT, never again. Hard to contain, have a death wish and like to tap dance on top of cars. Mini or standard donkey, maybe.
Another vote for a donkey as your horse companion animal and a “yard dog”. I have been around dogs my whole life but never owned one myself until we adopted ours from the shelter almost 10 years ago. I would try for something really Lab-looking and around 1 year-ish. Our dog is loyal (she knows where her next meal is coming from), was super easy to train, and is reasonably smart around the horses, especially considering she isn’t at the barn every day. She barks at the doorbell and the UPS truck but would not hurt a fly. She’s big enough to deter people but lets my kids literally climb all over her. (FWIW, we suspect she is a British Lab- she has an ear tattoo and shows a lot of the characteristics of that type) Good luck!! It sounds like an amazing place- what an awesome adventure you are about to embark on!
Thank you!!
Sandysmom, I really like the yard dog concept.
The breeds that have been mentioned can be a lot of dog and a challenge for a first-time owner. Have you considered something like a Border Collie or Aussie who would be good around the animals, be a great companion, be happy living in the house with you, and probably be protective of you? They do need a job and to be kept busy, physically and mentally. I also think a “yard dog” would be just fine. Do know that not every dog is just going to hang out and not wander, and a wandering dog is a bad thing. Look into some good rescues in your area and work with one to find the right dog for you, a good rescue will not give you a dog who is too much dog for you and will take the dog back if it doesn’t work out.
I agree with those who say to be careful about taking on too much responsibility. Figure out how much work it is to have your own place and take care of it and a few animals and go from there. Also, with a house and barn and driveway on five acres, you can end up with less grazing land than you think. How much room you need per animal will depend on what part of the country you’re in and how fast the grass can regrow.
Good luck.
Much depends on where you live. In the Northeast, a “yard dog” that is tied up and lives outside would be considered neglect and probably a call to Animal Control.
I personally would not leave a dog alone and loose with access to my horses/livestock because I would be concerned about it chasing. If loose in your yard with access to visitors you are also at risk for it biting delivery people, neighbors, etc.
Again I will say that if you don’t want a dog because you want a dog - don’t get one. I can’t imagine worse advise to a 1st time dog owner that works full time than to get a Border Collie to leave in the yard.
This would be my concern too.
If you have just the one horse now, then I agree that a donkey would make a good companion. I too worry that a minidonk would be pretty easy prey for a couple of coyotes. As already mentioned, they travel in pairs usually, and could easily take down a minidonk or a goat. IME they won’t bother the horses. I have seen my horses run them out of the pasture.
Since you will be working from home (did I get that right?) it seems to me you will need a companion dog, who will alert you to people coming on the property and act as a deterrent. IMO the best combination of companion dog, farm dog is a GSD. You can often get adult ones from a rescue or a breeder - but NOT for leaving loose on the property when you are not there, or tying up to a tree.
We have always had a large dog run for when we are away from the house, but the dog comes inside with us when we are home, comes with me when I am outside in the barn or the yard.
They were originally bred to be a farm dog, and they are usually good around horses and other livestock, you may have to watch them initially around your cat - but they are not inclined to ‘chase’ chickens or other small critters IME.
I too would nix the goats. I had one, and she was a lovely creature who I got as a companion for an orphaned foal.
As the farmer - a goat farmer - dropped her off at my farm, his taciturn words of advice were: “goats always want to be where they’re not.”
Yes, yes and yes. And they have the ability to put that into action.
Good luck, Ziggy! start small, have fun!!
It’s illegal here to have a dog chained up outside, and there are definitely leash laws (meaning if found on a neighbor’s property, they could call the pound to have him picked up, no questions asked).
IMHO it takes the right dog to begin with, then then good training on top of that, to end up with one who will happily laze around your property, but still be on guard for intruders
I have several friends with GSDs, mostly Great Pyranees, some Anatolans. Of those with GPs, some of those dogs are strickly outdoor dogs, doing their job 24x7. Some are also part time house dogs. Not all individuals are suited to be part time house dogs. ALL of them have either wandered (despite having 20-50 acres of their own), jumped fences, or dug under fences, to do go whatever it is they feel the urge to do. One friend actually had one stolen off her property, in broad daylight, and while she can’t prove it, she’s strongly suspicious he was taken to be a DGD - drug guardian dog.
Thanks all. Just to be clear, I would never, ever chain a dog up in my yard, leave it loose while I wasn’t there, etc. I also don’t want a dog that wouldn’t be happy sticking around on 5 acres, because it would prefer to patrol 50 acres 
so appreciate everyone’s honest thoughts above on specific breeds. When I’m imaging a “yard dog”, it’s a companion dog that’s happy with some space, and doesn’t necessarily want, or “need” to be inside with me 24x7.
I am going to analyze the hell out of the situation before I make any final decisions, because that’s how I roll, ha. Hence asking for input now! I expect it will be probably at least 2 months of getting acclimated to the property before I bring my horse and a companion for him there. There are nice fencing, and shelters with runs up already, but I need to build a proper compost area, make a plan for cross-fencing the main pasture with hot tape, etc.
I’d like to put in a word for a male, neutered corgi. They are, of course, bred to be an all round farm dog. Good with livestock and excellent companions and guard dogs. , as herders, they won’t wander off and leave you and are very bright and trainable. Their size makes them easy to have inside and outside with livestock as well. Any dog might chase a horse, etc. but our corgis have always been easy to train to leave horses alone when necessary.
The females can be quite bossy, which is why I suggest a male, neutered corgi. Basically obedience class and attention to the dog is probably enough for a first time dog owner to end up with a gentleman corgi to fit your needs Corgis are smart and trainable but not to the extent of attention required by living with a border collie, for example.
our acreage includes horses, geese, cats and d some cattle, and the corgis are great with all of them. They are especially good at moving larger livestock, like cattle from one pasture tor to another or even brcinging them into the barn area
they will certainly sound the alarm for any visitors or predators. Our corgis are n the house at night, but we have never lost an animal to any predator and there are coyotes everywhere here b
I have to disagee, or really be sure that the dog does not have uncontrolled access to the horses. I had to leave a barn, with a BO that was wonderful, in part, due to his GSD harrassing my mare. Dog thought it was great fun to go after her while she was stalled. Got to the point that If he was there when i was leading her by, she would jump over and try to stomp the dog. BO kept him around due to coyotes, but … To this day, if my mare sees a GSD, her mind is on the dog and I know she is thinking of stomping it, no matter what I do.
IMHO, this has to do with how the puppy is raised and trained. I know too many people with Great Pyranees who guard - unattended - their horses, sheep, and goats, including foals (not sure about lambs and kids). All day and all night.
The dogs were raised with those animals from the time they were old enough to spend time outside. They learn that way those are the creatures they are supposed to protect.
We have three lab mixes - one a vaguely shepherd mix, one more of a hound mix, and one more of a golden mix. Both are similar to what I would recommend for you. Get a 6month -1year old pseudo rescue dog (find one that had a great home life but was given up for a known reason) that has a strong lab base. It means you miss the annoying stage of puppyhood and can focus on training it to do the job you want. It will be loyal to you, chase birds and rabbits, and look intimidating while still being low enough energy to feel manageable for a first time dog owner.
And I definitely would recommend the donkey to the goats or sheep - similar feeds, farrier needs, and space/fencing requirements to your horse.
Herding breed v. LGD. And yes, breeding, temperament and training.
Personally, I would never allow a dog to have access to my horses unless it was a LGD that had been trained. For the sake of the horses and the dog(s). But, to be honest, I doubt most horses need a LGD at all. Smaller livestock, maybe…or a secure barn at night. My friend’s adult male goats had outside access at night but her does/babies/young goats were always put in.
“Farm dogs” would reasonably be an all-purpose herding/protection breed, but without training and a job they are likely to create a job for themselves whether you want it or not. Same with Border Collie.
DONKEY sounds like the “dog” you need 
BCs are the best dogs ever. And a NO for a first time dog owner.
Thank you - I totally saw “LGD” instead of the GSD that’s actually written there! :eek:
Thanks for this, the thought of Corgis did cross my mind. I’ve seen them behave well around horses, and their size and temperament are probably more manageable for a first time owner like me. Maybe there would still be some deterrent just from having dog scent on the property, too.
I adore heelers and border collies, but don’t expect to have enough time for one 
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