Wow, incredible Sir Donnerhall filly, Croisadore!!!
Thanks Sparkybella!
The other stallion I will put out there as producing elegant horses with very good length of leg is Fuerstenball. I have yet to see a photo of a short-legged or heavy Fuerstenball foal. Our 2010 Fuerstenball filly out of a Harvard/Akzent II dam will definitely be taller, more elegant, and has a longer length of leg all around. And the Espri mare is in foal to Fuerstenball for 2012 so I will be able to compare the differences shortly.
I have six offspring of Dressage Royal from various mares. All are leggy, elegant, have correct relation between the stifle and elbow, short cannons, GREAT dispositions and lovely movement.
Great to hear about Dressage Royal. Did he improve the leg length and type in all you mares?
Love love love the consistency of his foals! I try to get some photos posted. FWIW The youngsters I have seen from WakeUp (six year old champion tied with another lovely horse) are extremely consistent as to type and temperament also. And they all seem to get his great top line, super loin connection and long legs with correct proportions.
But am curious since you have xx in you dam lines, if Dressage Royal improved the length of leg and type, or he just complimented your mare base?
Bats - your grey horse is lovely but I wouldn’t say he has long legs per se. His legs are long relative to the rest of him. In proportion.
Crosiadore - I have a Hano mare just like yours! Older, tons of bone, really short stout cannons, a bit of length in the back (mine might be a bit shorter than yours but still longish). Powerful and strong. Interestingly mine is half TB - you really can’t see any TB in her look though - or her foals! Scored straight 8s from the Hanoverian Verband too. She’s more old fashioned than I prefer so I look for stallion that will help to shorten the back and refine the look. I have used Prestige VDL twice (her last foal is still too massive) and will use Furst Nymphenburg this spring.
I aim to shorten the back rather than lengthen the front leg, if this makes sense. I much prefer a squarish horse but take great care not to reduce the bone or create a ghastly German Shepherd look.
As far as the OP’s question goes, I too think SH and many of his sons have a reputation for giving a longer front leg.
Crosiadore, I didn’t put DR to unproven mares. In each case his foals are longer legged than the mares previous foals by other stallions, with his lovely profile and sweet nature. While very talented, our oldest two are four year olds. The black is 16.1 and the chestnut is 17.2 (dams both chestnut). Very fancy movers. Catherine Haddad gave the tall chestnut the 2 thumbs up as an international prospect so we are thrilled. We are not breeding for the young horse classes per se so we expect a lot of talent for changes, piaffe and passage and it seems to come with the package.
Are there any Donnerhall lines that add length of front leg? Should clarify: D with no R since my mare is the R.
Not again, I never implied your mares were unproven? Just curious if the mares you put to Dressage Royal were more old-fashioned in type, and whether Dressage Royal modernized them? That is what this discussion is about. Thanks for the clarification.
I expect just the same from our horses. If they can do the young horse tests along the way great. Some can, some can not. I do not hold it against them either way.
When I hear ‘long-legged’ I cannot help but to think of Bretton Woods.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLSQSS-3DQ8&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoCidsn3vrY
Where did it come from for him?
Johnson’s Jazz or Flemming? Or the dam’s De Niro or Romancier?
posting for not again -
From L-R
Don William
Daylily
Dream Girl
Dreamcatcher
Dolce Elise
Dolce, Don William & Dream Girl are all full siblings. Their oldest 1/2 brother by Weltmeyer does not have the length of leg or elasticity of these 3. I ride these guys and their basic nature is a whole lot easier than the Weltmeyer - that is for sure! :winkgrin: Same great push from behind & super correct but improved trainability/rideability. (but don’t get me wrong - I adore the Weltmeyer but was glad for a few years that there was just 1 like that to ride each day!)
Daylily is out of a different damline but shares the same damsire as Dreamcatcher (Again and Again) but with a different damline. She is a delight - plain and simple. He is just getting started and makes my mouth water - same for his younger full brother. We had 1/2 siblings to the DR’s out the of the same mares prior to these guys and had bred their dam’s, so longer legs is definitely coming from DR.
I’d have to go look in his files & pull pedigrees but as I recall Doringcourt (exp. to New Zealand), Damsey & UNO Don Diego do not carry any serious TB up close in their damlines. However, Dandy de la Roche and Desperado OLD do. FWIW.
And I might be wrong - but I think not again was going for the caution of knowing what your mareline throws before diving headfirst with a stallion that ‘should’ fix/improve/change something dramatically. Sort of a controlled experiment rather than a blind leap…but I could be wrong, too. 
Hope that helps!
Thanks. I am aware of what my dams and their dam lines produce. Topic was about producing a more modern horse, and I am pretty sure it came up do to some Hanoverian Inspectors penalizing some Hanoverian mares at a recent Inspection for not being modern enough? Pure and simple. It was not about young horse classes, etc. Think the OP was looking for some ideas for stallions that would refine.
I was interested in stallios that add a longer front leg. The inspector was harping on getting the front leg longer and more uphill build. Looking at the frozen semen ads it doesn’t look like many have a longer leg. So it made me wonder which ones actually do throw a longer leg.
[QUOTE=back in the saddle;5879779]
The inspector was harping on getting the front leg longer and more uphill build. [/QUOTE]
I just have to ask to make sure I understand the whole picture - there are several areas which can make a horse less uphill or “uphill”, depending on your definition. One is a “shorter” front leg. One other is a gaskin that’s too long, putting the stifle too high. One is a lighter front end with a heavier hind end.
Does the mare actually have a very good hind leg and barrel and shoulder/withers, and really just needs a longer forearm to raise the front end?
The comments were all directed at horses with obvious short front legs. Looking at the horse from the side, the front leg looked short. The withers were generally level with the croup (not all) but some had a deep heart girth and short front legs. Add a few inches to the front leg and the entire front would be lifted so the withers were above the croup. The others were old style and needed modernization everywhere according to today’s standards. (I personally like the big oldstyle warmloods)
As DownYonder said in another post, it’s all about lightness in front, as in way of going ,not lighter front end compared to the hind end conformationaly. They wanted balance and harmony in the conformation.
[QUOTE=back in the saddle;5879660]
Are there any Donnerhall lines that add length of front leg? Should clarify: D with no R since my mare is the R.[/QUOTE]
I bred 4 leggy mares to a Don Fredrico stallion in Oz. He effectively shortened the front legs on all the progeny so it isn’t a cross I will be in a hurry to repeat. Though for some reason the 5th mare, shorter legged than her sisters, threw to HER father and the offspring is very leggy.
Danone II gave me a nice leggy filly from a big, solid mare.
When I think of long legs I immediately think Sandro Hit and then I think of Jazz (neither of whom are known to throw ammy friendly temperaments). I’m pretty unconvinced that long legs have anything to do with success at upper level dressage, but they sure do look nice. Just look at the horses at the top level of dressage, not that many of them are long legged modern types. Most of them are pretty moderate in terms of length of leg.
Do you think those showing now that are moderate in leg length is because the long legged deal wasn’t as popular 10 or so years ago when those horses were bred? Or are there thoughts of lack of FEI ability or increased FEI abililty with the longer front leg? Does anyone have any experience with Floriscount throwing long legs and height without bulk? Maybe the jury is still out but I like him. What about using him on a DF mare who is small and short backed? People have suggested to not double dip on the Donnerhall blood for fear of the long back, but as I am getting ready to order a special short saddle to fit my girl I am wondering if it matters for her! I would love to hear of more examples of stallions that have thrown long legs without adding mass. What about Falsterbo? I also love Londonderry and have heard he does this. Would love some more fresh options though.
Lotus T
[QUOTE=back in the saddle;5878291]
List the stallions that consistantly produce offspring with longer front legs.
I’ll start:
Stedinger[/QUOTE]
Lotus T is definitely one of these stallions:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4SfHHhoc_8
