Making sense of first lease

[Amberley]

I honestly wouldn’t spend $100k on trying to compete with that kind of support. Is your trainer even qualified to teach you? If someone has only ever shown the 1m themselves how can they be qualified to bring a student along? Or select a lease horse? How unhappy will you be if in a year you are still jumping 2’ or 2’6"?

I know you’re in LA which isn’t cheap COTH tends to skew towards the money is no object crowd and genuinely believe you need to spend 6 figures to show at all but there is a middle ground. I know people actively competing in SoCal who are not spending anywhere near what you are proposing and who have far more experienced coaches if what you are saying is true.

[endlessclimb]

I don’t think this person is ready to “go it alone” as this is their first go-round with this level of showing, and I doubt that an owner would appreciate a “go it alone” approach for a nice quality 30k lease (I wouldn’t!!)

That said, you are far, far more in the loop on this type of thing than I am!

[endlessclimb]

God, if I ever spend 100k to show 2’ for a year, someone please just put me out of my misery. I can’t.

Yes I know lots of people do it. There’s nothing inherently wrong with it. But holy hell 100k to jump puddles.

[centaursam]

This is what I’m trying to understand because despite what everyone is saying, $100k is just ridiculous.

I would love to talk to these people that you know. Do they own or lease?

[centaursam]

I know, it’s absurd. And my trainer cut my jump lessons since many of her school horses are lame so I’m not even getting a chance to practice as much until I do find a horse.

[Horsegirl71]

Pricing sounds about right.
I would be majorly concerned about me being the only person showing at the barn. For 100k a year, I would rather go to a barn that caters more to the environment I want to be in.

[Rel6]

@centaursam

A few people have suggested I’m at the wrong barn for my goals and I think that’s accurate and has been for years. But I’m assuming serious show barns here in SoCal would probably make $100k look like a joke.

I can’t speak to your market specifically, but generally you can find an in between of “IHSA barn that doesn’t otherwise go to shows” to “serious show barn.” It might look like a barn that does a few big shows a year with smaller shows (or some schooling shows) scattered in between. Maybe someone more familiar with your market can opine on that.

But I will say, even at a “more expensive” barn, your show costs may be lower. You won’t be footing 100% of your trainer’s lodging, meals, gas, etc. A bigger barn may have horses in-house you can try and potentially lease, cutting out some costs associated with trying a bunch. You may be able to lease a fancy lesson horse for a show season to start showing and see if you enjoy it. If you’re going to spending a lot of money, spend it someplace that does what you want to do. That much money is going to feel a whole lot worse if you spend it only to realize you are struggling to get to any shows.

[centaursam]

These are some great points, thank you. I’ll start looking around. I know of many barns around my area, some farther than others but I have options.

[Amberley]

It’s still possible to show off the trailer in SoCal at very decent venues. If I had a kid or client who was new to showing and I wasn’t already going to multi-day shows that is 100% we’d be doing.

[Xctrygirl]

So tell me again how the hierarchy and control that trainers instill in their clients isn’t a bad thing? That fairness in time, money and effort works out for all???

Because I see @centaursam about to lay out 6 figures to do something that most lesson barns have a “Steady Eddie” type to teach students with and maybe show here and there. Now I can see hers are lame which leads me to think her horsemanship is lacking a hair. Sure it could just be abscesses and bad timing but I just don’t see the cross section of a trainer whose bills I want to take on that much.

No offense OP, but I was expecting that you were a solid 1.10m jumping Ammy with goals to gather some amount of points for a year end award. In my book, you are better served by finding a different lesson barn, with more solid horses (Sound!) and move up the ladder that way. It’s a less than ideal time in any part of the horse world to invest big $$$$$$ unless you have it to spend comfortably.

Get more miles if you want with lessons at two different barns so you can jump more. Going that way you will be able to get FAR more miles on yourself than leasing would allow and I think would still keep your expenditures more reasonable. Even with some low level shows.

Best of luck,

Emily

[Heinz_57]

@centaursam

This is what I’m trying to understand because despite what everyone is saying, $100k is just ridiculous.

Since you have a background in dressage as well as jumping… have you ever considered moving over to eventing? Perhaps there is an eventing coach in your area. Leases aren’t as common as in H/J but they aren’t totally impossible either.

I totally understand if you want to stay in jumperland and the idea of XC doesn’t appeal, just wanted to point out that there is another jumping discipline where things (and horses) don’t cost near as much.

[centaursam]

No offense taken I’ve wasted many years with really bad trainers unfortunately. Suffice it to say, I no longer trust anyone fully at this point, hence why I’m on here seeking guidance.

I’ll seriously consider switching barns. I’m in need of a change anyways so maybe this is impetus to seek a different place to ride.

[centaursam]

I’m definitely open to eventing. I can put that on my radar when finding another barn.

[Peggy]

@Amberley

It’s still possible to show off the trailer in SoCal at very decent venues. If I had a kid or client who was new to showing and I wasn’t already going to multi-day shows that is 100% we’d be doing.

Ya. You could hit Paddock and trailer in for the day at a Gold Coast. Will be more achievable if the horse is more of a been-there-done-that type who doesn’t need trainer rides first. If you do a multi-day show pick one that’s close to home (meaning you’ll may be at Hansen Dam or LAEC, where you could also do a cheaper show) so no hotel costs and the trainer could run back and forth and still do lessons at home.

Another thing to consider is, outside of leasing and showing, are you happy with the progress you’re making and the care the horses receive? If the answer is no, maybe time to move on.

I do it for maybe a third of what OP is saying, but the horse lives in a “backyard,” we ride on our own, and meet the coach at shows. Also no lease fee. I show in the meter jumpers and show about ten times a year at places like Thermal, Oaks, Del Mar, Galway.

[clanter]

@ZuzusPetals

At this point, with costs, why aren’t we all just moving them into our dens or spare bedrooms? Sigh

in the early 1990s I came home to find daughter and her horse in the den watching TV. she said it was too hot outside for her horse

[findeight]

Am in the might not be the right barn for you camp and the fact trainer is looking for something young enough to bring along is a yellow flag. That is not what you need to learn the HJ show ropes. You need to lease an older BTDT schoolmaster type and you do not need fancy.

Trainers often push less finished, fancier horses on clients to create additional income for themselves via training, lesson and pro ride costs. No blame there, it is their job but is not what you need when you are looking for an entry level lease horse. Smart, savvy trainer will pair you with what you need now and help you as you move forward which will insure more modest but longer term income for trainer and boost for their reputation. You need to find one of those.

The great thing about lease horses is you can walk away at the end of the term if you grow out of the horse ability wise, it has soundness issues and/or you realize you are with the wrong trainer at the wrong barn.

Seems to me that your budget should allow you to sample several different barns/programs and half or part lease suitable horses as you advance. Cannot recommend a year lease for you right now in your current situation, think you can do better as you get more familiar with what your options are and who/what is out there barn and trainer wise.

Can you just go watch a show that you are considering showing at? Sit and watch carefully, hang around the schooling ring and in gate, watch how trainers prep their clients and debrief riders after the round. It can be very revealing and costs nothing but your time.

Often the best are not the best known and do not openly advertise.

[MissusS]

I know nothing about nothing, but reading this thread the thought that occurred to me a few times… “Is this this right barn for you?” - and it sounds like others who know much more than I do are chiming in with the same thought.

I’m glad you are open to considering other options - 100K/year may be in the ballpark for your area, but that is still a serious investment. I hope you find what is best for your situation and I wish you much success.

[centaursam]

Can’t remember the last time I was happy with the progress I’ve made honestly.

Most of the trainers I’ve had were trainers that are in it just for the money or for people who want to put around every weekend with no serious goals of competing. Every time I move to another trainer, I ask around for recommendations, and ultimately end up with the same type of trainer that isn’t really serious.

[centaursam]

I’m definitely open to a shorter lease or a half lease but according to my trainer, those can’t really be found.

I can also watch a show. I’ll do some research and see what’s out there

[dmveventer]

@centaursam

I know nothing with respect to how the age of a horse factors in to this other than the basics. I also have no clue what the difference is between the price points of horses. What’s the difference between a $20k horse and a $30k horse?

I haven’t seen anyone else address this question so as a rule of thumb - annual lease prices for a full lease tend to run between 25-50% of a horse’s sale price. Others who are more in the loop on the market can correct me if I’m wrong, but from what I’ve heard they’ve been trending closer to 50% since COVID. A nice schoolmaster packer type is definitely going to be on the higher end for a lease fee since they have a lot of experience to offer and by leasing you get to dodge the retirement question. To get a feel for sale/lease prices in your area you should be able to join some Facebook groups and just lurk for a while, but a knowledgeable trainer is really the best place to start. It doesn’t sound like your trainer is capable of filling that role for you (and I see more than one red flag in what you describe about her in general so I’m definitely in the camp that votes to move along).

@dags

A one-year lease on a good teacher will put you in a much better position to shop the market. You’ll be able to handle a wider range of animals and can maybe weight athleticism a bit higher at that point, whereas right now you need the “teach me how to horse show” model.

Second this, and will throw in that if OP is open to moving barns they could achieve the same goal with a half-lease on a horse in a nicer program and save some money towards the eventual purchase. IDK what her financial situation is but if she can’t easily rebuild the savings spent on the lease fee to have a solid purchase budget when it’s time then holding off on the lease might make sense.

@centaursam

This is what I’m trying to understand because despite what everyone is saying, $100k is just ridiculous.

To be frank, showing on the H/J circuit in a HCOL area IS kind of ridiculous thing to do. (ETA I mean this in the financial sense, not a dig at those who do it. My own horse spending is equally ridiculous.) You’d be better off deciding if that’s really what you want to do/if it’s worth it to you than trying to DIY it as someone with limited experience. DIY is also generally not an option for leasers, and not a good idea for a new owner. Spending a few years in a more expensive but quality program can start you off on the right foot and help you develop the experience and network you’ll need to cut costs in any significant way down the line.

Or you can switch disciplines as someone else already suggested Eventing is substantially cheaper and tends to encourage people to be more independent anyway.