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Man fatally mauled, dog killed, by pit bulls on dog walk

The Menagerie
#781

This came up on VIN the other week after the woman was attacked in her own yard

2016 Dog Bite Related Fatalities. 31 victims.

c = child

  1. Tyler Trammell-Huston © of California - sister’s 3 x pet Pit Bulls
  2. Payton Sawyers © of Virginia - babysitter’s pet Pit Bull/Rottweiler Mix
  3. Talan West © of North Carolina - neighbor’s 1 x Pit Bull & 2 x ‘mixes’
  4. Aiden Grim © of Ohio - family pet Labrador/Shepherd ‘mix’
  5. Suzanne Story of North Carolina - her pet Pit Bull ‘mix’
  6. Gladys Alexander of Washington - neighbor’s 2 x Pit Bull/Labrador ‘mixes’ & 2 x Labrador/Pit Bull ‘mixes’
  7. Bessie Flowers of North Carolina - her daughter’s 2 x pet Pit Bulls
  8. Sonda Tyson of Florida - her pet Pit Bull ‘mix’
  9. Sebastian Caban © of California - family pet Pit Bull ‘mix’
  10. Manual Mejia of Florida - pack of (alleged) Bulldog/Malinois ‘mixes’
  11. Antoinette Brown of Texas - (tbc) 7 dogs of unknown type
  12. Adonis Reddick of Missouri - his own pet Pit Bull
  13. Earl Stephens Jr of California - a friend’s Pit Bull
  14. Hunter Bragg © of Maine - a friend’s Pit Bull
  15. Erin McCleskey of Texas - pack of 6 adult dogs of varying ‘mixes’
  16. Jocelyn Winfrey of Connecticut - a friend’s 2 pet Pit Bulls
  17. Susie Kirby of California © - 1 or both of her uncle’s Pit Bull/Sharpei ‘mixes’
  18. Elizabeth Rivera of Michigan - her own pet Pit Bull
  19. Kayden Begay © of Arizona - a neighbor’s 12 Pit Bulls
  20. Crisencio Aliado of Hawaii - 2 x roaming Pit Bull ‘mixes’
  21. Michelle Wilcox of Georgia - her boyfriend’s pet Pit Bull
  22. Derion Stevenson © of Las Vegas - a friend’s Pit Bull ‘mix’
  23. Michael Downing of Florida - his near neighbor’s 4 dogs, all mixes of Rottweilers, German Shepherds, Chow Chows
  24. Susan Shawl of Colorado - her son’s 2 x pet Pit Bulls
  25. Jane ‘Doe’ © - infant of Texas - unknown breed - family member’s dog.
  26. Piper Dunbar © of Kansas - her father’s friend’s 2 x Pit Bulls
    (206th CHILD to be killed by Pit Bulls’ since 1980, and 155th child killed by Pit Bulls’ since the CDC stopped tracking deaths by breed 18 YEARS ago).
  27. Kyana McNeal © of Michigan - newly-acquired family pet ‘Doberman Mix’
  28. Daisie Bradshaw of New York - 2 of her daughter’s Pit Bull Mixes OR German Shepherds (tbcf)
  29. Isaiah Franklin © of W. Virginia - family pet Pit Bull
  30. Valente Aguirre of California - pack of 5 unknown breed dogs
  31. David Fear of California - 1 x Belgian Malinois, 1 x German Shepherd dog.
2 Likes
#782

31 deaths out of a population of 331 million. There were 38 deaths from lightning in 2016 per the NWS.

There were an estimated 70 million dogs in the US in 2016, and fewer than 100 killed people.

Sh*t happens.

http://www.lightningsafety.noaa.gov/fatalities.shtml

1 Like
#783

Please stop denigrating a member with an opinion different from yours, you’re lowering the tone again.

We already know there are still people breeding pit bulls in Ontario, I reported one of them myself. There will always be people trying to maket large sums of money for illegal things. That does not mean that the Ontario pit bull/type BSL hasn’t prevented more bites/attacks caused by pit bulls or took care of and prevented future threats of over population. Your “dog bites in Canada” are up is deflecting, we’re talking about pit bulls, not other breeds.

My dog did not need a muzzle at all times, I personally chose to muzzle him in public because I was not going to take any chances whatsoever in him just snapping some day. No, he was not some maniacal dog that would lunge and bark at everyone/thing, I as a responsible owner ensured there woul be absolutely no chance tht he could seriously injure someone if something set him off.

Regardless, I knew his potential(like any other dog) to become aggressive under the right/wrong circumstances and I wasn’t stupid enough to think that a dog of his size couldn’t cause some serious damage to a person or another dog if he decided to attack. In his entire 13 years he never bit or attacked anyone because I made sure he couldn’t if he ever decided to.

don’t want to own a dog (unlike CT) that shows human aggression that cannot be untrained and has to be walked with a muzzle on always

If a dog shows human aggression because of its past treatment you actually think you can, “untrain” that? A dog that has been trained to attack may be able to have some of that trained out of them but a dog with PSTD because of past abuse cannot have their fear trained out of them. It can lay dormant under the right circumstances and home but there is always a good potential of a flashback causing them to show aggression or attack.

Dogs are profiled because of their looks because the standard personality for each breed runs true. If I see a dog that looks like a shepherd mix I am going to err on the side of caution and assume that dog has strong protective instincts. I will do the same for any breed from a Yorkie to a pit bull, stereotypes and profiles are there for a reason. No, not all dogs fit into the personality profiles they’ve been given, but most do.

2 Likes
#784

I’ve said the same before and made the same points, I just didn’t feel the need to spell it out in an essay like I felt I had to this time after being accused of hating pit bulls by someone other than khall.

2 Likes
#785

I would call that a bogus link, pit bulls are at the top for fatalities, not shepherds or any other breed.

2 Likes
#786

That’s a lot of pit bulls/mix/types.

4 Likes
#787

World wide the pit is not at the top. Its not even at the top in Canada.

#788

There may be a reason for that - countries where the American Pit bull Terrier and other are banned:
https://petolog.com/articles/banned-dogs.html

2 Likes
#789

Some shelters are no longer trying to determine breed mixes. Coincidentally, the first picture that comes up for Portsmouth (VA) Humane Shelter is, surprise, a pit/pit cross. I worked in Portsmouth; there are A LOT of pits in that town & not nice ones. It’s ~30-40 minutes from VA Beach where the rescue pit killed the old lady.

A shelter in Shenandoah is doing the same thing.

The insanity never ends.

http://wtop.com/virginia/2017/07/ano…dogs-by-breed/

My mother jokes that her grade pony is a “registered” Amish Driving Pony (or a Miniature Friesan, but that 's another story). But there is a phenotype for that type pony in her area - black, 12-14 hands, heavy bodied. AmShelterDog is a useless term.

1 Like
#790

I’ve also heard of shelters that call anything with a squarish head a Labrador mix.

To me, it’s not the breeds, but the fact that red flags are ignored and previous attacks aren’t reported, because people don’t want to get the animal in trouble with animal control, or it’s a family member, and nothing is done about earlier, progressive aggressive behavior. And pits are the only dog with a TV show where the stars deliberately rescue animals with human, and animal aggression, and then whine about the restrictions the court put on the animal. I find it interesting that in one case, the star of the show took a dog from a group attack on a innocent person, and then the true facts about the animal were easily available online from local newspapers. Lying and getting animal off death row is not helping their contentions that almost any dog can be rehabilitated.

If people took responsibility for their animals, and kept aggressive dogs in a controlled environment, and took proper care of them, then maybe there wouldn’t be so many attacks on people who are not bothering the dog at all. However, when you see people adopting a dog that have no intention of training, confining, or treated the animal like a member of the family, and who ignore escalating bad behavior, it’s almost inevitable that innocent people will suffer and die from dog attacks.

Animals aren’t just an accessory, and when people refuse to treat them like a living creature, that needs attention and care, and refuse to admit an animal isn’t suitable for a neighborhood, then tragedies will continue to happen. I think in some cases, people want a tough, aggressive animal as a part of their own tough guy persona, and don’t want a dog for a companion.

3 Likes
#791

31 people were killed by dogs in the US in 2016. 38 were killed by lightning in 2016. The US had a population of about 330 million people in 2016. It had an estimated population of 70 million dogs, of which about 75 were people killers (that includes the ones in packs).

How many people were killed by other people last year?

Overreaction much?

#792

Not to these countries. Kind of amazing.

Argentina
Parts of Australia
Parts of Austria
Bavaria
Belarus
Parts of Belgium
Bermuda
Parts of Brazil
Parts of China
Parts of Canada
Denmark
Ecuador
Finland
France
Germany – Pit bull type dogs are banned in 15/16 German provinces.
Guyana
Ireland
Israel
Italy
Parts of Japan
Latvia
Liechtenstein
Malaysia
Malta
New Zealand – Not only are pit bulls banned, but pit bulls and other breeds deemed “menacing” by the Government are not considered for adoption and are euthanised as a matter of course.
Norway
Poland
Portugal
Puerto Rico
Romania
Russia
Singapore
Spain
Switzerland
Turkey
The UEA
Ukraine
United Kingdom
Venezuela
https://petolog.com/articles/banned-dogs.html

2 Likes
#793

And then there is the ban from travel and import…https://petolog.com/articles/banned-dogs.html

When countries ban aggressive breeds, it also means that the airlines who serve those countries must ban the breeds as well. Airlines will not carry a pet into a country when the pet does not have the proper immigration forms or is on the banned breed list. The consequences of ignoring this list can be distressing at the least and disasterous at the worst. Should a dog on the banned breed list make it to immigration, in most cases it will be returned to the originating country at the owner’s expense; however, in some cases, the animal will be put down.

If you are the owner of a dog on the following list, you need to take extra precautions that the country to which you are traveling will accept your pet. Keep in mind that these aggressive dog bans, in many cases, are not based on any restrictions put on the pet (i.e. that they will be muzzled while in public,) or the fact that they are a mixed breed. If your dog even resembles one of these breeds or behaves in any way aggressively during the immigration process, there is a chance that your pet will not be accepted in your destination country. A saavy pet traveler will know the law beforehand so they will have no disappointments at the customs desk.

Here is a list of common breeds that are banned in many countries worldwide:

  • American Staffordshire Terrier
  • Staffordshire Terrier
  • Pit Bull Terrier
  • American Pit Bull Terrier
  • Doberman Pinscher
  • Bullmastiff
  • Dogo Argentino
  • Dogo de Burdeos
  • Fila Brasileiro
  • Mastin Napolitano
  • De Presa Canario
  • Rottweiler
#794

Hit by lightening is an “act of god”, being torn to shreds by an aggressive dog is akin to murder. Putting equal value on murders by people vs killed by dogs is… odd to me.

Dogs should be mans best friend. :frowning:

6 Likes
#795

Maybe 5 of the deaths by lighting strikes could have been avoided; there were probably a few idiots in the 38 who were out in a thunderstorm standing in the middle of a field with big, metal umbrella.

OTH, maybe 5 of the dog deaths were truly unexpected and unavoidable. The vast majority of dogs show aggression before fatally attacking someone. These deaths, and also the at least equal number of similar attacks where the victim survived, were avoidable if there weren’t people who put dog life on the same level as human life. They could have been avoided if owners acknowledged they had problem dogs and took appropriate measures (to include putting the dog down.)

Much is made of “responsible” dog ownership. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone self-identify as an “irresponsible dog owner.” Very few think they are part of the problem.

5 Likes
#796

This is very true, unfortunately. I’ve seen quite a few people try to rehome their dog because they can’t afford it, apartment is kicking them out, etc etc – but the kicker on some is that they EXPLICITLY say the dog has to go to a good home because it is aggressive. Dog has attacked another dog so can’t be around dogs, he has bit kids but really doesn’t mean it, he is “trained” to attack but only if the owner says so, ad nauseam. There are plenty of individuals (including rescues) who tell the owners that dog should go to a rescue/trainer/etc who can properly work with the dog. Some who tell them that the dog needs to be put down and it will hurt someone. But then a ton of individuals will “bark” back and start a damn go-fund-me to save the dog and keep it at the owners home and it just makes me sick. How can someone acknowledge that fluffy is an attack dog who has attacked other animals and bit children and a whole community comes together to keep that dog at a home that believes this is appropriate behavior. THOSE are the people who are the problem. Unfortunately, it can be difficult to report these individuals or give AC & LEO a heads up… especially if you aren’t sure where they live or if they are using their correct name.

2 Likes
#797

CT: 'Please stop denigrating a member with an opinion different from yours, you’re lowering the tone again. " Excuse me? But it is ok for skyon to call me an extremist and I cannot point out she/he needs to use critical thinking in the cites she/he posts? Sorry but that street goes both ways.

CT as for you keeping a KNOWN human aggressive dog alive, that is your choice, just not one I would have made because as viney said previously sh*t happens.

As for train out human or dog aggression, it can be done. I personally know a GSD that was going to be euthanized because he had a bite history of both humans and dogs, yet now he can be around many many other dogs and people (no muzzle needed and off leash) and is in fact a dog trainer’s I know, right hand in her training business. http://www.serenityk9.org/ratesandservices/ He is the long haired GSD in this picture. I am not keen on her training practices and techniques, but she has rehabbed quite a few aggressive dogs. Here is another local to me trainer that also rehabs aggressive dogs : http://www.graysk9academyllc.com/about-us Here is another trainer that focuses on aggressive dogs: https://thegooddog.net Again, I am not so keen on any of these trainers methods but apparently they have very satisfied clients.

I prefer true behavior modification training like this: http://careforreactivedogs.com/start-here/

CT: “Dogs are profiled because of their looks because the standard personality for each breed runs true.” Really? You can look at a dog, especially a block headed dog and know what breed it is? Yeah, don’t think so and has been proven over and over again you cannot look at a dog and determine parentage especially in mix breed dogs. http://article.sapub.org/10.5923.j.sociology.20130302.02.html
http://stories.barkpost.com/study-proves-difficult-visually-identify-pit-bulls/
http://btoellner.typepad.com/kcdogblog/2013/05/a-new-study-discussing-the-reliability-of-visual-breed-identification.html

Take the test: http://btoellner.typepad.com/kcdogblog/2012/05/identifying-mixed-breed-dogs-is-easy.html

So for all those dog bite statistics that mention the breed of dog, take it with a large grain of salt.

#798

CT: 'Please stop denigrating a member with an opinion different from yours, you’re lowering the tone again. " Excuse me? But it is ok for skyon to call me an extremist and I cannot point out she/he needs to use critical thinking in the cites she/he posts? Sorry but that street goes both ways.

CT as for you keeping a KNOWN human aggressive dog alive, that is your choice, just not one I would have made because as viney said previously sh*t happens.

As for train out human or dog aggression, it can be done. I personally know a GSD that was going to be euthanized because he had a bite history of both humans and dogs, yet now he can be around many many other dogs and people (no muzzle needed and off leash) and is in fact a dog trainer’s I know, right hand in her training business. http://www.serenityk9.org/ratesandservices/ He is the long haired GSD in this picture. I am not keen on her training practices and techniques, but she has rehabbed quite a few aggressive dogs. Here is another local to me trainer that also rehabs aggressive dogs : http://www.graysk9academyllc.com/about-us Here is another trainer that focuses on aggressive dogs: https://thegooddog.net Again, I am not so keen on any of these trainers methods but apparently they have very satisfied clients.

I prefer true behavior modification training like this: http://careforreactivedogs.com/start-here/

CT: “Dogs are profiled because of their looks because the standard personality for each breed runs true.” Really? You can look at a dog, especially a block headed dog and know what breed it is? Yeah, don’t think so and has been proven over and over again you cannot look at a dog and determine parentage especially in mix breed dogs. http://article.sapub.org/10.5923.j.sociology.20130302.02.html
http://stories.barkpost.com/study-proves-difficult-visually-identify-pit-bulls/
http://btoellner.typepad.com/kcdogblog/2013/05/a-new-study-discussing-the-reliability-of-visual-breed-identification.html

Take the test: http://btoellner.typepad.com/kcdogblog/2012/05/identifying-mixed-breed-dogs-is-easy.html

So for all those dog bite statistics that mention the breed of dog, take it with a large grain of salt.

#799

In some jurisdictions, the owner has to admit it’s their dog, or they can’t be charged with cruelty, or any other offense. I remember this from watching Detroit Animal Cops (or whatever the title for that part of the series was), and Miami Animal Cops shows. I stopped wtaching the SF version after they allowed an animal that had mangled passersby on two separate occasions, and had been determined to be a vicious and dangerous animal to be rehomed to San Diego with the owner’s relative. SF also couldn’t do anything about an animal that broke through a privacy fence, and slaughtered the neighbors small animals in their cages, since their vicious rules only apply to attacks on humans. That did it for me.

1 Like
#800

CT: “Please stop denigrating a member with an opinion different from yours, you’re lowering the tone again.” Excuse me? But it is ok for skyon to accuse me of being an extremist? I’m sorry but that street goes both ways.

CT it is your right to choose to own a human aggressive dog, it is not a choice I would make because as viney said just up thread sh*t happens.

As for whether or not a dog can be rehabbed that is dog or human aggressive, yes it can. I personally know of a GSD that was going to be euthanized for human and dog aggression, he had a bite history. He ended up with a trainer and is now her right hand in training the dogs that come to her. He is around both dogs and humans off leash without a muzzle on often. http://www.serenityk9.org/ratesandservices/ It is the long haired sable GSD in this picture. Lauren is known for rehabbing aggressive dogs. Another trainer also known for rehabbing aggressive dogs: http://www.graysk9academyllc.com and another very well know trainer that specializes in aggressive dogs: https://thegooddog.net I don’t necessarily agree with their tools and methods but they are successful.

CT: “Dogs are profiled because of their looks because the standard personality for each breed runs true.” Again you are equating a dogs look with a certain breed profile and that is just not true. You cannot with good accuracy look at a mixed breed dog or sometimes even pure bred dog (often cane corso or dogo argentina as well as some mastiffs are mistaken for a bully breed)
http://stories.barkpost.com/study-proves-difficult-visually-identify-pit-bulls/
http://btoellner.typepad.com/kcdogblog/2013/05/a-new-study-discussing-the-reliability-of-visual-breed-identification.html
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S109002331500310X

Especially read this! https://www.animalsheltering.org/sites/default/files/Removing%20Breed%20Labels-Quinn-Caitlin.pdf

This is why you CANNOT predict a dogs possible behavior based on his or her appearance, ONLY their prior behavior is a reliable indicator of future behavior. YOU CANNOT PROFILE BASED ON LOOKS OF A DOG.

This is why I totally agree with red mare: ’ it’s not the breeds, but the fact that red flags are ignored and previous attacks aren’t reported, because people don’t want to get the animal in trouble with animal control, or it’s a family member, and nothing is done about earlier, progressive aggressive behavior.’ This IMO is criminal behavior if the dog then attacks, mauls or kills someone they should serve jail time. Because it is a people problem, being stupid about the potential risk of the dog regardless of the breed.

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