hey er’body!!
question: is there a danger in feeding a mare currently not in foal, “mare and foal” feed?
are there benefits?
i have searched the internet with no results. i have called the feed company and talked to someone who said, “it should be fed to pregnant or nursing mares… i don’t know what else to tell you.”
somebody, anybody…:o
It is not going to do any damage, but most mare and foal products are higher in
protein (14-16%). Excess protein is excreted through the urine so it might make your barn smell like ammonia. Some are also higher in fat, which would not necessarily be the best for a horse that is overweight or not currently in work.
As a feed salesperson, many times we recommend mare and foal or growth product if a customer can’t get a senior feed. There is no majikcal foo foo dust that makes mare and foal feed any different, other than it is formulated to help a mare through the hardest work her body will do, lactation.
[QUOTE=cutter99;8961267]
It is not going to do any damage, but most mare and foal products are higher in
protein (14-16%). Excess protein is excreted through the urine so it might make your barn smell like ammonia. Some are also higher in fat, which would not necessarily be the best for a horse that is overweight or not currently in work.
As a feed salesperson, many times we recommend mare and foal or growth product if a customer can’t get a senior feed. There is no majikcal foo foo dust that makes mare and foal feed any different, other than it is formulated to help a mare through the hardest work her body will do, lactation.[/QUOTE]
:lol::lol:magical foo foo dust!!! awesome and very helpful! thank you!!
Mare and Foal feed is usually higher in calories and sugar so there is a danger of laminitis if you are feeding it inappropriately.
Senior feeds usually get their calories from safe fats and safer carbs
That’s a category of feed, and they are most definitely not all created equal.
TC Growth is appreciably better than, say, Nutrena Mare & Foal, and Purina Jr. TC Sr is nearly identical to the old TC Growth formula, and is significantly, IMHO, better than TC Growth and the other 2 by default.
Yes, it’s fine, if the product meets that horse’s needs. Some simply require more protein. 5lb of a 16% feed is 363gm. 5lb of a 10% feed is 227. An extra 136gm of protein is not going to make a horse hot, or cause kidney issues, or founder him, and very unlikely to cause an increase in ammonia output unless the horse was already at a bit of a tipping point from, say, a large % of alfalfa in his diet.
So the real question is - what are the stats/details on the horse? Is it a 10yo in no work and is an easy keeper? Then no.
But if it’s a 10yo in pretty good work and tends to be a harder keeper, then absolutely, the lower sugar “growth” or “mare and foal” feed is fine. Maybe it’s not the best for that horse, maybe a low sugar performance feed (which, btw, also tends to be on the higher side of protein 
) is more appropriate.
I have been speaking with a Purina nutritionist, and while I know Purina is not fantastic feed let’s be real here… I have a budget to feed horses. So I am looking at doing the best for the money. They seem to think the Strategy GX would do better than a mare and foal feed. Unless we’re talking last 30 days of pregnancy through lactation. But for a mixed herd, that none are currently nursing a foal; Strategy is our best bet. Also, we feed an orchard grass hay mixed about 50/50 with alfalfa, so they are getting a good bit of energy and protein from that. Obvs, nutritional complications are something I want to steer away from… anything from dropping weight to laminitis and everything in between.
[QUOTE=ChromeBadger;8963118]
I have been speaking with a Purina nutritionist, and while I know Purina is not fantastic feed let’s be real here… I have a budget to feed horses. So I am looking at doing the best for the money. They seem to think the Strategy GX would do better than a mare and foal feed. Unless we’re talking last 30 days of pregnancy through lactation. But for a mixed herd, that none are currently nursing a foal; Strategy is our best bet. Also, we feed an orchard grass hay mixed about 50/50 with alfalfa, so they are getting a good bit of energy and protein from that. Obvs, nutritional complications are something I want to steer away from… anything from dropping weight to laminitis and everything in between.[/QUOTE]
.:to clarify the first horse feed company i spoke with from the OP was Nutrena, I have now just finished speaking with someone from Purina and they were much more knowledgeable:.
[QUOTE=JB;8963060]
That’s a category of feed, and they are most definitely not all created equal.
TC Growth is appreciably better than, say, Nutrena Mare & Foal, and Purina Jr. TC Sr is nearly identical to the old TC Growth formula, and is significantly, IMHO, better than TC Growth and the other 2 by default.
Yes, it’s fine, if the product meets that horse’s needs. Some simply require more protein. 5lb of a 16% feed is 363gm. 5lb of a 10% feed is 227. An extra 136gm of protein is not going to make a horse hot, or cause kidney issues, or founder him, and very unlikely to cause an increase in ammonia output unless the horse was already at a bit of a tipping point from, say, a large % of alfalfa in his diet.
So the real question is - what are the stats/details on the horse? Is it a 10yo in no work and is an easy keeper? Then no.
But if it’s a 10yo in pretty good work and tends to be a harder keeper, then absolutely, the lower sugar “growth” or “mare and foal” feed is fine. Maybe it’s not the best for that horse, maybe a low sugar performance feed (which, btw, also tends to be on the higher side of protein ) is more appropriate.[/QUOTE]
that is what i believe i am looking at here, this particular mare seems to require higher protein than the rest of my bunch. So while it may not bother her, I have one I would not feed it to, as she struggles with too much weight as it is.
But what are the stats on the horses?
It sounds like you’re trying to feed multiple horses with a single feed? That rarely works.
A horse who struggles to keep weight down is not going to be able to eat any variance of Strategy (and really, any regular feed anyway, it’s just all too many calories at even the minimal feeding levels). So right off the bat, you’re looking at 2 feeds - perhaps a regular feed, and then a ration balancer, for example.
What are you feeding now? What brands do you have access to?
I’m feeding nutrena senior to my 2 thin horses ones a 4 year & a 7 yr old. I only have access to purina and nutrena feeds.
[QUOTE=JB;8963166]
But what are the stats on the horses?
It sounds like you’re trying to feed multiple horses with a single feed? That rarely works.
A horse who struggles to keep weight down is not going to be able to eat any variance of Strategy (and really, any regular feed anyway, it’s just all too many calories at even the minimal feeding levels). So right off the bat, you’re looking at 2 feeds - perhaps a regular feed, and then a ration balancer, for example.
What are you feeding now? What brands do you have access to?[/QUOTE]
Yes i am. I’m looking at Strategy and Enrich+, which is a ration balancer.
I am currently feeding a locally milled feed. Hammered grain mix. 14% protein, 3% fat, and 25% (max) fiber. I am especially happy how with how they look on it and it is fresh. However, I originally started the post because I am scheduled to breed the 1st (in the following list) mare in Spring and I want to make sure she has adequate reproductive nutrition pre-baby. For instance, some doctors say women should take pre-natal vitamins prior to conception. I just want to be sure she has everything she needs vitamin and protein-wise.
The mare in question is typically a bit of a harder keeper, requiring a bit more than my others do. They still do not eat a lot by any means.
She eats 5 lbs a day of the grain mix, soaked. 15 lbs of high alfalfa/orchard mix hay a day. I add in 1 cup of calf manna and 1/2 cup of oil. She is 950lbs.
Gelding eats 5 lbs a day of the grain mix, soaked. 15 lbs of high alfalfa/orchard mix hay a day. I add in 1 cup of calf manna and 1/2 cup of oil. He is 925 lbs.
Fatty BoomBoom eats 5 lbs a day of the grain mix, soaked. 15 lbs of high alfalfa/orchard mix hay a day. She is 1,200 lbs.
I have access to Nutrena, Purina, Triple Crown, and Seminole Feeds.
950lb mare - can she get 20lb of hay? I’d rather see her getting that, than the calf manna and the oil. There’s nothing inherently wrong with those supplements, but the first goal should be more forage, and you definitely have room to expand that.
925lb gelding - same
1200lb mare - if she’s a fatty, why is she on 5lb of any concentrate? I’d FAR rather see her get insignificant calories from supplemental feeding, and more hay. 15lb of forage for a 1200lb horse (what should she weigh?) is pretty light. If that’s 2% of her ideal weight, that’s fine (but I’m guessing she shouldn’t weigh 750lb LOL). Even 1.5% of her ideal weight, that’s fine, but unless she should drop 200lb down to 1000lb, 15lb of forage is not enough for her, especially given she’s getting 5lb of what I assume is probably a fairly high sugar feed.
Do you know the ingredients of that feed?
Triple Crown and Seminole are, as a whole, better quality than Purina. You would probably put the first 2 on TC Sr, at an amount appropriate for their weight. The mare can go on TC 30. Honestly, that’s where I’d start. And more hay for the first 2, and hopefully a bit more for the fatty.
Okay! Thank you! I have had them on TC Senior before and it really just seemed like I was pouring buckets and buckets down them to no affect. The “fatty” is only a fatty because she will gain quick if fed a little too much she’s pretty hardy (she has some draft in her). I would love to feed as much hay as they want. Unfortunately we have to have hay trucked in so we have to ration. I will up the big girl’s hay. And we’ll try to work it so the other 2 can have more as well.
For sure, not every horse does well on TC Sr. If that didn’t work for them, then I probably wouldn’t try again. If they were “different” horses then - significantly younger, or harder work, etc - it would be worth trying again, but if they are more or less the same as they were then, then no.
What about TC Complete?
TC Lite might be a good option for Ms Fatty. You can feed 1-2lb per 500lb, so you have room to play with. It’s a nice mid-feed between a regular feed (ie Sr or Complete) and a ration balancer. If 5lb of Complete (for example) is too much, but 4lb of TC Lite isn’t enough, you could add 1lb or so of alfalfa pellets to 4lb of the Lite, just as an example of more options for calories for her.
[QUOTE=JB;8965136]
For sure, not every horse does well on TC Sr. If that didn’t work for them, then I probably wouldn’t try again. If they were “different” horses then - significantly younger, or harder work, etc - it would be worth trying again, but if they are more or less the same as they were then, then no.
What about TC Complete?
TC Lite might be a good option for Ms Fatty. You can feed 1-2lb per 500lb, so you have room to play with. It’s a nice mid-feed between a regular feed (ie Sr or Complete) and a ration balancer. If 5lb of Complete (for example) is too much, but 4lb of TC Lite isn’t enough, you could add 1lb or so of alfalfa pellets to 4lb of the Lite, just as an example of more options for calories for her.[/QUOTE]
I will look into those for sure! I’m assuming come breeding time, TC would be fine for a mare in foal as well? From the website it seems to be suited for pretty much every lifestage.
TC Sr is nearly identical to the old TC Growth formula, so would be just fine for a pregnant mare. The Complete has a bit of a different composition, and its suitability would depend more on your forage.
What is an average feeding range for the TC senior? I’m seeing start with 6 lbs and adjust from there on their website. Is that average? Or is that a below average amount daily for that feed?
What is “average”? You start with the 6lb and adjust from there. If you’re feeding less than 4lb for a 1000lb horse then the recommendation is you topdress with 1/2lb or so of TC 30.
