Mare bucking and pinning ears when cantering

[ABAQHA]

Hello!

I bought a 20 y/o QH mare last year that has had extensive WP training in the past (most likely cowboyed and she came from a “rougher” training barn). I bought her to let her retire and do some light riding and trail riding. However, I do try to work her enough to keep her in shape (30 mins walking, trotting, cantering a few days a week). My problems start when I ask her to canter. She speeds up into a fast trot and pins her ears. I collect her and keep driving her forward until she canters. She has always had a very powerful canter, but now, she goes about three strides and starts bucking, with her ears pinned to her neck.

She does not appear to be back sore, but has a longer body than all the other horses I have had and is older (20). Her teeth are floated once a year and her feet are trimmed every 5 weeks. Does this sound like a behavior issue? Or physical? I hate to keep pushing her if she is hurting, but she goes back to normal once we are jogging and walking. For now, I am not asking her to canter until I figure out if it is a physical issue. Thank you for any input!

[4LeafCloverFarm]

Does she do the same thing on a 30’ lunge line, with just a halter on (no tack)? And has she been doing this under saddle since you bought her, or is the running into the canter and the bucking more recent?

[Foxglove]

Good question 4LeafCloverFarm! I have a cutting/sorting/roping horse who now has a job with me as a fox hunter. Although well trained (very well trained) he consistently from the first time I saw him, pinned his ears when asked to canter under saddle and on the lunge line. Sometimes he keeps them that way, but usually after a warm up, he puts his ears in a more neutral position, then when jumping or on a tally-ho, actually has them forward! I asked my granddaughter’s trainer (western trainer with English knowledge) about the ear-pinning. He said, “He’s thinking.” And watching old video of the horse cutting/sorting, his ears are pinned back when he’s working cattle (and when he goes out of the shoot roping). Unlike OPs horse --he does not buck.

For a brief time, after I first got him, he would at times snake his head at the canter (put his nose really low)–again I asked the trainer --he said “if you don’t like it low, let him know it. Jerk him up, but don’t nag him with a tug-tug-tug. That will just piss him off.” So I did that. When he dropped his head too low, I gave a one rein snap up. He kind of said, 'Oh," and quit doing it.

Anyway, your advise was brilliant!

[Wanderosa]

IME, some horses will buck on the upward transition if they have inadequate toplines, and/or SI or hock issues. Trying to carry the rider through the transition to the canter requires strength and balance. Does she do it in both directions on a circle? Is it one buck and then she will canter along, or she just bucks the whole time?

Silly question: do you really have to canter her? Sounds like she was used heavily in the past and I’m guessing she didn’t receive the body maintenance necessary to keep her trucking comfortably as she aged. Definitely have her vetted out for pain and address any issues that impact overall quality of life. But at some point, you bought her to live a nice life in semi-retirement. Most senior humans find it necessary to lay off running at some point, even if they’re very athletic in general.

[findeight]

WP horses don’t trot into a cater so sounds like she’s trained as a push button horse and you don’t know where the buttons are. Be aware some believe any leg at all brings the head up out of frame so never touch them with leg, that includes gripping to stay on a buck or even asking for a lead. She might also have a spur stop installed, you leg her into the canter and try to leg forward to stop the buck.

She thinks you want her to stop and gets pissed when you keep bumping your leg on her to get her to canter. You both are getting frustrated.

You may have a confused horse reacting to you pushing the wrong buttons. Try just bumping the bridle by raising your hand a couple of inches then release. to pick her up and clucking with NO leg at all to canter, she should step off directly into it… Maybe don’t canter until you get her previous training undone but…she’s probably been doing it for 18 years so you may be the one that needs to adapt.

You might also be trying to keep to tight a rein on her, WP horses go on slack, just subtle changes in seat and raising or lowering a hip. If you are trying to ride one of these “ classically correct”, especially if it’s been punished for doing anything else for years? Not going to work. Not your fault, not the horses fault but years of rough or gimmick reliant training do that to any horse.

[Palm_Beach]

@ABAQHA

Hello!

I bought a 20 y/o QH mare last year that has had extensive WP training in the past (most likely cowboyed and she came from a “rougher” training barn). I bought her to let her retire and do some light riding and trail riding. However, I do try to work her enough to keep her in shape (30 mins walking, trotting, cantering a few days a week). My problems start when I ask her to canter. She speeds up into a fast trot and pins her ears. I collect her and keep driving her forward until she canters. She has always had a very powerful canter, but now, she goes about three strides and starts bucking, with her ears pinned to her neck.

She does not appear to be back sore, but has a longer body than all the other horses I have had and is older (20). Her teeth are floated once a year and her feet are trimmed every 5 weeks. Does this sound like a behavior issue? Or physical? I hate to keep pushing her if she is hurting, but she goes back to normal once we are jogging and walking. For now, I am not asking her to canter until I figure out if it is a physical issue. Thank you for any input!

You are teaching this behavior to her, and she is catching on quick. Horses learn from the release of pressure. You are putting a lot of pressure on her by collecting her and driving her forward. I suspect you don’t release all pressure when she canters - meaning you are still using hand and leg - and when she bucks, you THEN release all pressure because you are trying not to fall off. Hence, she learns that bucking is the correct answer to all the pressure you are putting on her.

Most western horses are taught self carriage before collection. So if you are physically collecting her, and physically holding her together when you ask her to lope, you are not ready to lope her collected. Is she totally broke in the face and will soften and lift and collect at the walk and trot? If not, you should not be asking for this at the canter. She doesn’t understand.

[jherold]

If she doesn’t do it on the lunge, check saddle fit.

[findeight]

If she doesn’t do it on the lunge line it could also be because there’s no rider trying to collect and leg her into the canter contrary to everything she’s been taught and doing for 18 years as a WP horse.

[bugsynskeeter]

If she is really WP trained, put your outside leg on and KISS to her.

[beau159]

@ABAQHA

Hello!

I bought a 20 y/o QH mare last year that has had extensive WP training in the past (most likely cowboyed and she came from a “rougher” training barn). I bought her to let her retire and do some light riding and trail riding. However, I do try to work her enough to keep her in shape (30 mins walking, trotting, cantering a few days a week). My problems start when I ask her to canter. She speeds up into a fast trot and pins her ears. I collect her and keep driving her forward until she canters. She has always had a very powerful canter, but now, she goes about three strides and starts bucking, with her ears pinned to her neck.

She does not appear to be back sore, but has a longer body than all the other horses I have had and is older (20). Her teeth are floated once a year and her feet are trimmed every 5 weeks. Does this sound like a behavior issue? Or physical? I hate to keep pushing her if she is hurting, but she goes back to normal once we are jogging and walking. For now, I am not asking her to canter until I figure out if it is a physical issue. Thank you for any input!

I agree with all the other suggestions about how you are riding and/or how she might be trained for cues … but why exactly is she RETIRED? Does she have lameness problems?

If you have not yet taken her in for a baseline lameness examination, that would be my first step. She’s 20. I would be surprised if she doesn’t have at least something that could possibly be addressed and made better.