Martin to sell Love the Chase......

[Texarkana]

[QUOTE=vineyridge;8819391]
She’s got to at least bring in the Tapit stud fee for this not to be a huge blunder. However it goes, it will be interesting to follow.[/QUOTE]

I’d be surprised if that were a problem. In 2015, both the average and median price for a mare in foal to Tapit was $1.5M!

Even with her weak catalog page, I think there will be enough interest for someone to ante up the money. If nothing else, she is not only in foal to the hottest stallion around, but also bred on a similar cross to Chrome. But heck, I can never predict what the ultra-rich will do at the sales. :lol:

[Laurierace]

I agree. I would be surprised if she brings less than 2 mil.

[SnicklefritzG]

That’s what I find so fascinating about TB breeding.
Looking at Lucky Pulpit and Love the Chase’s records, one wouldn’t think there were much of anything as far as race horses go, but look at what that mating produced!!

Are there any theories as to how they produced such a great runner?

[QUOTE=Texarkana;8818427]
I very much agree, but the way I see it, this moment in time is likely her pinnacle. It’s all down hill from here, monetarily, if she continues producing average quality horses at best when bred to elite Kentucky stallions, as opposed to Lucky Pulpit. I mean, he’s certainly an inconsistent sire even if it’s just because of his mare population. Someone will buy her for a lot of money (unless they set too high of a reserve), even if she’s far from topping the sale.

She has sure upgraded her status from the days she was sold for $8k… Which seemed like the ripoff of the century before she became the dam of California Chrome![/QUOTE]

[Texarkana]

SnicklefritzG, my best guess is “who knows.” Although Love the Chase is inbred to one of the best producers in modern history, so it’s not a complete surprise she is a producer herself.

Horses love to prove people wrong. Just look at the cross between Cee’s Song and Cee’s Tizzy… that shouldn’t have produced diddly squat on paper. Yet it produced four stakes horses (including the only two time BCC winner and a BCC runner up) and some darn good producers.

[Laurierace]

There really is no predicting genetics beyond an educated guess but I would be going with the line of thought that she produced the top horse in the world right now when bred to Joe Blow. Just think what she could produce when bred to a top sire. Of course we all know there is more to it than that but if I was playing with monopoly money I would be willing to put that theory to the test. In fact I think I would be more willing to roll the dice with her than with breeding to CC himself those first few seasons.

[SnicklefritzG]

[QUOTE=Laurierace;8819593]
There really is no predicting genetics beyond an educated guess but I would be going with the line of thought that she produced the top horse in the world right now when bred to Joe Blow. Just think what she could produce when bred to a top sire. Of course we all know there is more too it than that but if I was playing with monopoly money I would be willing to put that theory to the test.[/QUOTE]

I guess somebody did having bred her to Tapit.

[Laurierace]

[QUOTE=SnicklefritzG;8819600]
I guess somebody did having bred her to Tapit. :)[/QUOTE]

That’s totally different, they did that to sweeten the pot with a 2fer knowing they were putting her in the sale. Not saying they wouldn’t want the Tapit themselves but I am sure this wasn’t a spur of the movement decision to list her in the sale.

[Texarkana]

The way money flows through the horses in Kentucky, it might as well be Monopoly money to some… :rolleyes:

[snaffle1987]

what struck me is that Perry wants the Pegasus title with Chrome and in order to do that needs to push the horse to do it and then only give the horse 3 weeks of turnaround time to start the breeding season.

What I see is a group of money hungry lunatics who, at that point, are pushing a horse beyond measure in order to capitalize on every dollar and cent they possibly can; with little regard on the horse’s welfare at the end of it.

I think Sherman has done a stellar job with the horse and keeping the best care on him and always looking out for the horse’s best interest.

Although Perry Martin only owns 10% of the horse now, I am guessing Taylor Made retains majority interest in the horse? But there are apparently 22 other investors with their hand in the cookie jar.

I get it, the horse is at the top of his game and still seems happy doing his thing. This is a business and they are running their “business” to capitalize on every dollar they can. But at what cost? Run the breeders cup and retire the horse happy and healthy and give him the proper down time in order to make it to the breeding shed in proper order.

Say what you want but Perry Martin is a greedy SOB and should not be the spokesperson nor the person calling the shots if he only owns 10%. If any one thinks this man gives a damn about California Chrome; guess again. The only thing he sees and cares about is dollar signs. For all that horse has done for his life; I have never once seen him speak one ounce of compassion towards that stallion. Leave those decisions up to someone like Taylor Made who knows how they want their stallion to start the breeding season; and my guess is they don’t want him 3 weeks rested off his last race going into a book of 100+ mares.

As for his dam, Love the Chase; I personally think she looks better now than she ever has. If Taylor Made is caring for her; they have done a lovely job. I did not care for the mare when she was in California, she was plain jane and looked a bit frumpy. They have definitely done a 180 with her and she looks every bit the dam of Chrome. Being in foal to Tapit; I am sure she is going to find a lovely home; I just hope she stays on this side of the atlantic; which does worry me as the mares tend to fall off the radar once overseas.

[Laurierace]

Don’t be surprised if they go for a repeat of the DWC too. By the way I think it is hilarious that owners are greedy if they continue to race horses yet also greedy when they are whisked away to the shed. Thank God the peanut gallery doesn’t get to vote on these things.

[smoofox]

[QUOTE=Laurierace;8820104]
Don’t be surprised if they go for a repeat of the DWC too. By the way I think it is hilarious that owners are greedy if they continue to race horses yet also greedy when they are whisked away to the shed. Thank God the peanut gallery doesn’t get to vote on these things.[/QUOTE]

… Or the overwrought Chromies who think that Coburn is a saint because he sold his share of Chrome to “save his life” - and that somehow taking endless photos of stuffing horses full of Mrs. Pasture’s cookies demonstrates that you are a great horseman. They even insist that Martin never visits/touches his horses despite evidence to the contrary. But Chromies know best and Martin is the devil.

Certain Chromies even speculated if they could pool their money and buy Chrome to save him - as they always see sadness in his eyes and only they “understand” him and he appreciates that.

[Where_sMyWhite]

I agree with Laurie on the dichotomy of retire them after the BCC or keep racing them. Won’t keep the masses happy no matter what choice is made.

What I really wonder with CC is if they are money hungry or fame and fortune hungry? Yeah, winning these top stakes races does pay well, but overall the shed has the potential to pay better in the long run and with a different set of risks.

I did love the Chromie at the Pacific Classic with the silver sequined jacket :eek:

[Laurierace]

[QUOTE=smoofox;8820154]
… Or the overwrought Chromies who think that Coburn is a saint because he sold his share of Chrome to “save his life” - and that somehow taking endless photos of stuffing horses full of Mrs. Pasture’s cookies demonstrates that you are a great horseman. They even insist that Martin never visits/touches his horses despite evidence to the contrary. But Chromies know best and Martin is the devil.

Certain Chromies even speculated if they could pool their money and buy Chrome to save him - as they always see sadness in his eyes and only they “understand” him and he appreciates that.[/QUOTE]

If forced to pick a side in that debacle I think Coburn proved himself to be an ass on live TV so Martin would have my vote as the lesser of two evils. What a mess, part of me is glad I never had a horse anyone had ever heard of. Although I did have someone recognize my horse at Fair Hill from all the pictures I have shared over the years and said she raced against me with Sylvester Questor.

[Sparrowette]

@snaffle1987;8819906

(…)
What I see is a group of money hungry lunatics who, at that point, are pushing a horse beyond measure in order to capitalize on every dollar and cent they possibly can; with little regard on the horse’s welfare at the end of it.

(…)

I get it, the horse is at the top of his game and still seems happy doing his thing. This is a business and they are running their “business” to capitalize on every dollar they can. But at what cost? Run the breeders cup and retire the horse happy and healthy and give him the proper down time in order to make it to the breeding shed in proper order.

I know that many think that the Martins haven’t always made the best decisions regarding Chrome, but I would never call them “money hungry lunatics”.

In my very small experience in racing, I’ve had my bout with Racing Luck and it was not good.

Racing Luck very seldom smiles on anyone, let alone the rain of happiness the Martins and connections have experienced with Chrome, and I think the Martins know this. And they also know that they have to justify themselves to the IRS. Racing is a business and Yes, the IRS is involved. If they are audited, they have to be able to justify their ~business~ decisions. The Martins KNOW how lucky they are and are trying to be smart with the luck they have been given.

They may or may not have thoughts in the back of their heads about what Chrome would do in stud… There have been instances of a horse coming out of a line that was solid, but not world-beating, and then beating the world, but did not shine in stud. Fees started out high at first, but after some crops, started dropping. (Sorry, names escape me at the moment).

The Martins flunked ESP-101 just like I did. They are doing the best with what they know. If it had happened to me, I only wish I could play the game as well.

[LaurieB]

[QUOTE=snaffle1987;8819906]
what struck me is that Perry wants the Pegasus title with Chrome and in order to do that needs to push the horse to do it and then only give the horse 3 weeks of turnaround time to start the breeding season.

What I see is a group of money hungry lunatics who, at that point, are pushing a horse beyond measure in order to capitalize on every dollar and cent they possibly can; with little regard on the horse’s welfare at the end of it.

I think Sherman has done a stellar job with the horse and keeping the best care on him and always looking out for the horse’s best interest.

Although Perry Martin only owns 10% of the horse now, I am guessing Taylor Made retains majority interest in the horse? But there are apparently 22 other investors with their hand in the cookie jar.

I get it, the horse is at the top of his game and still seems happy doing his thing. This is a business and they are running their “business” to capitalize on every dollar they can. But at what cost? Run the breeders cup and retire the horse happy and healthy and give him the proper down time in order to make it to the breeding shed in proper order.

Say what you want but Perry Martin is a greedy SOB and should not be the spokesperson nor the person calling the shots if he only owns 10%. If any one thinks this man gives a damn about California Chrome; guess again. The only thing he sees and cares about is dollar signs. For all that horse has done for his life; I have never once seen him speak one ounce of compassion towards that stallion. Leave those decisions up to someone like Taylor Made who knows how they want their stallion to start the breeding season; and my guess is they don’t want him 3 weeks rested off his last race going into a book of 100+ mares.

As for his dam, Love the Chase; I personally think she looks better now than she ever has. If Taylor Made is caring for her; they have done a lovely job. I did not care for the mare when she was in California, she was plain jane and looked a bit frumpy. They have definitely done a 180 with her and she looks every bit the dam of Chrome. Being in foal to Tapit; I am sure she is going to find a lovely home; I just hope she stays on this side of the atlantic; which does worry me as the mares tend to fall off the radar once overseas.[/QUOTE]

It seems a tad hysterical to paint Perry Martin as “a greedy SOB” because he wants to run his horse three weeks before the start of breeding season. The fact that stallions usually have a bigger break between racing and breeding is due more to scheduling than preference. It could be that three weeks is just fine–if not, they can delay booking his first mares.

Don’t forget, California Chrome will be the one who has the last vote. If he doesn’t want to breed mares three weeks after coming off the track, he won’t.

[dreamswept]

[QUOTE=Where’sMyWhite;8820231]

I did love the Chromie at the Pacific Classic with the silver sequined jacket :eek:[/QUOTE]

I know her name. Let’s just say it’s not her first rodeo doing stuff like that. She’s a nice person, but somehow, I don’t think it’s something a grown woman should be engaging in.

[Sparrowette]

[QUOTE=dreamswept;8820452]
I know her name. Let’s just say it’s not her first rodeo doing stuff like that. She’s a nice person, but somehow, I don’t think it’s something a grown woman should be engaging in.[/QUOTE]

I haven’t followed the “Chromie” page… Link?

[Where_sMyWhite]

CC et al maybe going with the devil they know (he can still race/win and appears to still enjoy it) vs the devil you don’t (War Emblem who just didn’t like the girls, or the stallion, forgetting his name at the moment, who was basically infertile).

[ASB_Stars]

[QUOTE=Where’sMyWhite;8820463]
CC et al maybe going with the devil they know (he can still race/win and appears to still enjoy it) vs the devil you don’t (War Emblem who just didn’t like the girls, or the stallion, forgetting his name at the moment, who was basically infertile).[/QUOTE]

Cigar?

[PeteyPie]

[QUOTE=SnicklefritzG;8819562]
That’s what I find so fascinating about TB breeding.
Looking at Lucky Pulpit and Love the Chase’s records, one wouldn’t think there were much of anything as far as race horses go, but look at what that mating produced!!

Are there any theories as to how they produced such a great runner?[/QUOTE]

My theory is the two crosses of Numbered Account made magic. I think it is mostly the mare influence and a breeding of Love the Chase to Tapit is brilliant, because Tapit gives the best of Lucky Pulpit plus another magic dose called Ruby Slippers. Just my opinion.