Mb civil suit rulings 11/15/2022

[Knights_Mom]

@BigMama1

@eggbutt

How well do you know either? Curious only.

I know nothing about LK other than what I’ve read online and, like most people, had never heard of her until the shooting.

A number of people I know personally have been the targets of SW’s vicious online bullying and smear campaigns. Like many others here I have been the recipient of threatening private messages from her that make her sound unhinged. Not too long ago, simply making a comment like that would be enough to land on her enemy list. Others would advise anyone to say these things only via PM, but bullies don’t scare me.

I don’t know how familiar you are with her history, or if you’ve followed her attempts to publicly humiliate and destroy the careers of multiple dressage professionals, including most of the top Canadians. I don’t know if you’ve read the many DH threads on COTH and learned how people who have disagreed with her on her FB page or YT channel found videos of themselves riding stolen from their personal pages and posted on DH the next day inviting public criticism, or even had threatening emails sent to their employers.

I don’t know if you’re aware that, though she promotes herself now as some champion against abusive riding in dressage, she has several times proudly claimed that the sole purpose of her DH channel is to “eff with dressage b!tch3s.”

There has been so much more on her personal page about revenge, getting even, destroying people…anyone who has ever slighted her in some real or imagined way seems to become a target for her wrath. I subscribe to the theory of “when people show you who they are, believe them.” She has shown everyone who she is, numerous times. Her support of Michael over the past three years serves a bigger purpose - destroying one of her “enemies,” LK, along with making her feel like she’s relevant in the dressage world, something she desperately craves. Sound like anyone else you know?

Just like you warn people to not trust LK because of the experiences people you know have had with her, I offer offer a similar warning to you about SW. She may present as helpful and kind - intelligent even - as long as she is getting something she wants. But if you don’t play along with the fantasies in her head, don’t give her the attention / accolades she believes she’s due, don’t fall for her “I’m the victim of bullies and haters” schtick, don’t tolerate her bullying people and / or stealing content, or otherwise do anything she perceives as an insult or a threat…watch your back.

DH is no champion of abusive riding as she worships abusive riders. She was never not for one second involved with fighting rolkur, a practice her favorite rider does.

I myself had a run in with her and can’t comment on her page.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@BigMama1

So if you don’t believe he stated incorrect information in error, and you don’t believe he stated incorrect information intentionally, how do you explain the fact that his statement about the verdict is incorrect?

I do not need to “explain the fact that his statement about the verdict is incorrect” because I don’t believe his statement is incorrect. I think Judge Sceusi is correct, as I stated the first time you asked.

You and @Knights_Mom apparently believe that his statement about the verdict is incorrect. I understand your position. I don’t agree with it, but I understand that you think the judge in the case is incorrect.

[CanteringCarrot]

@BigMama1

Clearly I was wrong when I said you understand the different between NGRI and guilty but not criminally responsible. You do not.

Man, there’s still back and forth about that?

I did what the judge stated read a bit odd, but I’m willing to sit back and see what happens.

[Knights_Mom]

@CurrentlyHorseless

You and @Knights_Mom apparently believe that his statement about the verdict is incorrect. I understand your position. I don’t agree with it, but I understand that you think the judge in the case is incorrect.

I don’t “believe”. I KNOW.

[BigMama1]

@Knights_Mom

DH is no champion of abusive riding as she worships abusive riders. She was never not for one second involved with fighting rolkur, a practice her favorite rider does.

Oh I know lol. She pretends to be calling out “abusive riding” as an excuse to smear riders she personally dislikes - particularly those who helped get her banned from the Global show grounds because of her harassment and inappropriate behaviour. In the few riders who still give her the time of day, she totally ignores any bad moments in time or dubious training practices (or documented history of blue tongues in competitions.) Almost like horse welfare isn’t the real issue at all…

Anyway, sorry for the brief detour. Let’s keep threads about one wacko at a time. This one is about LK. Everything that needs to be said about SW has already been said on COTH a million times and is searchable for those who care to scroll.

[BigMama1]

@CurrentlyHorseless

I do not need to “explain the fact that his statement about the verdict is incorrect” because I don’t believe his statement is incorrect. I think Judge Sceusi is correct, as I stated the first time you asked.

If you think his statement that the verdict was “guilty but not criminally responsible due to insanity,” is correct, then you must believe that “guilty but not criminally responsible due to insanity” is the same as “not guilty by reason of insanity,” which is the actual verdict written on the actual verdict sheet.

Look at the verdict sheet. Does it say “guilty but not criminally responsible?” No.

I believe the judge’s statement is incorrect because I know those are two different verdicts, not interchangeable with each other. The question is why do you believe they are?

[hut-ho78]

The judge said “Defendant went to trial, where he was recently found guilty of attempted murder, but not criminally responsible due to insanity.”

That is correct.

[Knights_Mom]

@hut-ho78

The judge said “Defendant went to trial, where he was recently found guilty of attempted murder, but not criminally responsible due to insanity.”

That is correct.

No, it’s the farthest thing from correct. That verdict doesn’t even exist in NJ.

You did better on a previous post before you realized you differed from CH. You still weren’t correct but you were closer.

[hut-ho78]

2C:4-1. Insanity defense

A person is not criminally responsible for conduct if at the time of such conduct he was laboring under such a defect of reason, from disease of the mind as not to know the nature and quality of the act he was doing, or if he did know it, that he did not know what he was doing was wrong. Insanity is an affirmative defense which must be proved by a preponderance of the evidence.

L.1978, c. 95, s. 2C:4-1, eff. Sept. 1, 1979. Amended by L.1979, c. 178, s. 11A, eff. Sept. 1, 1979.

[BigMama1]

@hut-ho78

The judge said “Defendant went to trial, where he was recently found guilty of attempted murder, but not criminally responsible due to insanity.”

That is correct.

Nope. Please show me anywhere on the verdict sheet or a time stamp in the trial video where it says MB was found guilty of attempted murder but not criminally responsible. You can’t because he wasn’t.

You can keep denying it but that won’t change the fact that NGRI and guilty but not criminally responsible are NOT the same thing. MB WAS NOT FOUND GUILTY OF ATTEMPTED MURDER. For you, CH, the judge, or anyone to state that is categorically false.

This isn’t about the incessant harping you and CH do about the NGRI verdict meaning the defense proved beyond a reasonable doubt that MB shot LK. Guilty but not criminally responsible is a completely separate verdict than NGRI. Words have specific meanings and those two sets of words do not mean the same thing.

[Ambitious_Kate]

I dont think these posters are able to grasp the nuances. I wouldn’t keep trying to sort it out with them.

[Knights_Mom]

[Jenerationx]

So… MB’s amendment gets in, and the issue with the tapes is going to get interesting and subpoenas will be reissued with a narrower scope? Did anything else of note happen?

[hut-ho78]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Knights_Mom

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

But we can end our tiresome back and forth. I’ll just cite the judge’s ruling whenever you assert that MB was found not guilty.

Should I cite the Judgement of Acquittal form? I think it is more legally binding than this document you are puffing your chest about. Or are you just ignoring that?

I am aware and have never disputed that NGRI is an acquittal. It’s an acquittal based on the “not criminally responsible for his conduct due to insanity” part of the NGRI verdict.

@Knights_Mom has asserted that the judge is “wrong”, just like she has asserted Hut-Ho and I’ve been wrong on this. That’s what I’m puffing my chest about.

I have not heard back from @Ekat and @lazaret on whether they are still sure the issue of whether Barisone shot her will be relitigated, given what the judge has stipulated as the background of the civil case. .

I continue to assert that you and the judge are wrong as Guilty but Insane is not allowed or no longer allowed in NJ.

We all know what the verdict was. Well most of us do.

I am honored to be deemed by you to be wrong in the company of Hut-Ho and Judge Sceusi.

Thank you dear. You are so gracious. However, the honor is mine.

[Knights_Mom]

@Jenerationx

So… MB’s amendment gets in, and the issue with the tapes is going to get interesting and subpoenas will be reissued with a narrower scope? Did anything else of note happen?

The Judges Order came with some errors in the recap of what happened previously. This is being disputed by us now.

[Jenerationx]

Yeah… I saw that and wondered what verdict he read.

[Knights_Mom]

@Jenerationx

Yeah… I saw that and wondered what verdict he read.

The one listed under “Desperate for a guilty verdict”?

[Ambitious_Kate]

No, the one listed under Nagle’s motions. Looks like ge just copied Nagel.

[FitzE]

@Warmblood1

I also think he would have hired a better lawyer than Nagel if he had more personal resources.

100+ posts behind, but just wanted to give this an ‘amen, sister’!

[Joanne]

Hi Kirby! How is the vacation going?

@Seeker1