Mb civil suit rulings 11/15/2022

[eggbutt]

You would be surprised of her support of Barisone in various ways.

[hut-ho78]

I agree with Judge Sceusi and Judge Taylor. I believe LE did a good job. I believe the jury got it right. I agree with CH who agrees with the judge as well.

Once again, I am not a Kanarek. Outside of this forum I do not know them. I would not know them on the street nor would they know me. I am not employed or have an affiliation with their attorney. I do not know RG nor am I related to him. This could be a Dr Seuss book.

I am a random internet poster. IANAL.

NG not guilty, released
G guilty goes to jail or probation
NGRI not guilty by reason of insanity, an affirmative defense. It means the act was done. It is not a crime because of insanity. Defendant goes for evaluation and possibly committed to an institution.
GBI guilty but insane. Defendant goes to jail or maybe even probation and is mandated treatment.
Not Guilty by reason of self defense, another affirmative defense. Defendant committed the act but is released.

[BigMama1]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Re first bolded sentence. I’m glad you’re going on record along with @Knights_Mom as saying Judge Sceusi made “an error” in the way he described the background of the case.

You think it’s not an error? Are you suggesting the judge deliberately included that false information (ie an incorrect verdict) in the background? That’s quite an accusation. What do you think his purpose in doing that would be?

[eggbutt]

Appropriate Eggbuttism for today. This quote from Henry H. Buckley -

[smoofox]

@eggbutt

@Angela_Freda

@eggbutt

Can you imagine any business willing to sponsor Lauren Kanarek in any way whatsoever?

Dressage Hub?
NP steaks/publishing/security?

Certainly not DH! SW is a hard-core MB supporter.

NP has supported MB and is NOT an LK fan… according to his Facebook posts.

[eggbutt]

It says something when the most vile can’t tolerate LK. Well, there are some snakes that devour other snakes!

[Knights_Mom]

Don’t be silly. Everyone knows two negatives repel!

[eggbutt]

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRQjj12Y/

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@BigMama1

@CurrentlyHorseless

Re first bolded sentence. I’m glad you’re going on record along with @Knights_Mom as saying Judge Sceusi made “an error” in the way he described the background of the case.

You think it’s not an error?
Correct

Are you suggesting the judge deliberately included that false information (ie an incorrect verdict) in the background?
No, I am not suggesting that the judge included false information (I.e. an incorrect verdict).

That’s quite an accusation. What do you think his purpose in doing that would be?
I made no accusation regarding the judge deliberately including false information.

My responses to BigMama in bold.

[BigMama1]

@eggbutt

You would be surprised of her support of Barisone in various ways.

Oh Susan’s been a huge supporter of his since he was accused of shooting LK, but it’s because he was accused of shooting LK that she’s now his number-one fan. She would have been the first to trash him online over a bad photo before this all went down, and she will no doubt turn on him at some point. People don’t change who they are and SW and LK are two peas in a pod. Probably why they hate each other - they are too much alike.

[eggbutt]

How well do you know either? Curious only.

[BigMama1]

@BigMama1

No, I am not suggesting that the judge included false information (I.e. an incorrect verdict).

Let’s break this down so you can finally grasp this. Even HutHo understands they are two different verdicts.

NGRI is not the same as guilty but not criminally responsible.

On the charge of attempting to murder LK, the verdict was NGRI.

The verdict was NOT guilty but not criminally responsible.

In the background, the judge wrote the verdict was guilty but not criminally responsible.

That is incorrect / false information.

So if you don’t believe he stated incorrect information in error, and you don’t believe he stated incorrect information intentionally, how do you explain the fact that his statement about the verdict is incorrect?

[3PonyFarm]

Thousands of U.S. judges who broke laws or oaths remained on the bench

This report describes some serious violations of judges in different states. It seems some judges do get carried away with the power they hold.

[hut-ho78]

@BigMama1

@BigMama1

No, I am not suggesting that the judge included false information (I.e. an incorrect verdict).

Let’s break this down so you can finally grasp this. Even HutHo understands they are two different verdicts.

NGRI is not the same as guilty but not criminally responsible.

On the charge of attempting to murder LK, the verdict was NGRI.

The verdict was NOT guilty but not criminally responsible.

In the background, the judge wrote the verdict was guilty but not criminally responsible.

That is incorrect / false information.

So if you don’t believe he stated incorrect information in error, and you don’t believe he stated incorrect information intentionally, how do you explain the fact that his statement about the verdict is incorrect?

The judge was correct. The only verdict where someone is guilty of committing the act but not guilty of committing a crime is where there is an affirmative defense, insanity or self defense or whatever other listed affirmative defenses are listed in New Jersey Criminal Code. There is no criminal record. There is no crime. There may be institutionalization but there is no jail time.

Guilty but Insane is criminally liable. The defendant goes to jail and will have a criminal record.

The judge was correct.

[Knights_Mom]

@hut-ho78

@BigMama1

@BigMama1

No, I am not suggesting that the judge included false information (I.e. an incorrect verdict).

Let’s break this down so you can finally grasp this. Even HutHo understands they are two different verdicts.

NGRI is not the same as guilty but not criminally responsible.

On the charge of attempting to murder LK, the verdict was NGRI.

The verdict was NOT guilty but not criminally responsible.

In the background, the judge wrote the verdict was guilty but not criminally responsible.

That is incorrect / false information.

So if you don’t believe he stated incorrect information in error, and you don’t believe he stated incorrect information intentionally, how do you explain the fact that his statement about the verdict is incorrect?

The judge was correct. The only verdict where someone is guilty of committing the act but not guilty of committing a crime is where there is an affirmative defense, insanity or self defense or whatever other listed affirmative defenses are listed in New Jersey Criminal Code. There is no criminal record. There is no crime. There may be institutionalization but there is no jail time.

Guilty but Insane is criminally liable. The defendant goes to jail and will have a criminal record.

The judge was correct.

Wrong. The judge was wrong in declaring it guilty but insane.

[Sdel]

@hut-ho78

Guilty but Insane is criminally liable. The defendant goes to jail and will have a criminal record.

Neither of these things happened or will happen. So the judge and Nagel are fundamentally incorrect when they say MB was found guilty but insane. If they were correct, then MB would be in jail and have a criminal record.

ETA: The other fundamental idea contained in any version of the insanity argument is how exactly did Micheal get to be in that condition in the first place? None of the expert testimony alleged MHG had anything to do with it either, and neither really did the prosecution.

[BigMama1]

@eggbutt

How well do you know either? Curious only.

I know nothing about LK other than what I’ve read online and, like most people, had never heard of her until the shooting.

A number of people I know personally have been the targets of SW’s vicious online bullying and smear campaigns. Like many others here I have been the recipient of threatening private messages from her that make her sound unhinged. Not too long ago, simply making a comment like that would be enough to land on her enemy list. Others would advise anyone to say these things only via PM, but bullies don’t scare me.

I don’t know how familiar you are with her history, or if you’ve followed her attempts to publicly humiliate and destroy the careers of multiple dressage professionals, including most of the top Canadians. I don’t know if you’ve read the many DH threads on COTH and learned how people who have disagreed with her on her FB page or YT channel found videos of themselves riding stolen from their personal pages and posted on DH the next day inviting public criticism, or even had threatening emails sent to their employers.

I don’t know if you’re aware that, though she promotes herself now as some champion against abusive riding in dressage, she has several times proudly claimed that the sole purpose of her DH channel is to “eff with dressage b!tch3s.”

There has been so much more on her personal page about revenge, getting even, destroying people…anyone who has ever slighted her in some real or imagined way seems to become a target for her wrath. I subscribe to the theory of “when people show you who they are, believe them.” She has shown everyone who she is, numerous times. Her support of Michael over the past three years serves a bigger purpose - destroying one of her “enemies,” LK, along with making her feel like she’s relevant in the dressage world, something she desperately craves. Sound like anyone else you know?

Just like you warn people to not trust LK because of the experiences people you know have had with her, I offer offer a similar warning to you about SW. She may present as helpful and kind - intelligent even - as long as she is getting something she wants. But if you don’t play along with the fantasies in her head, don’t give her the attention / accolades she believes she’s due, don’t fall for her “I’m the victim of bullies and haters” schtick, don’t tolerate her bullying people and / or stealing content, or otherwise do anything she perceives as an insult or a threat…watch your back.

[BigMama1]

Clearly I was wrong when I said you understand the different between NGRI and guilty but not criminally responsible. You do not.

[3PonyFarm]

What gets my breeches in a bunch is that the defendant will now have to pay an attorney to correct the judge’s error. The county the judge works for should have to pay it!

[eggbutt]

I wonder what makes women behave like these two women behave? They are so similar which is scary to think if these two are so alike, there’s bound to be more like them running amok.