MB Civil Trial: JK/KK Contempt of Court?

[Warmblood1]

@Sdel

@Warmblood1

@Sdel

Then they would have worked it up in the three years he was in jail. They didn’t. Probably because “attempted murder” was by far and away going to wind up with more time than anything they could work up. Besides, I’m pretty sure that allegation had to do with the gun being missing….which was covered in the criminal trial, so why would CPS use their resources investigating it?

Because there was supposedly allegations of misconduct towards children, made by LK in the SS document. Obviously I don’t know for certain without seeing the SS complaint. I agree that if there was evidence of these allegations that charges would have already been filed. They wouldn’t just drop them because MB was already in jail.

Her response to RC was the the missing gun endangered children and to brag about having recorded that conversation. CPS said it was a neglect issue not a misconduct issue. Unsecured guns around kids is “neglect” not misconduct. She made other claims about MB and adults, on this forum, that would fall under misconduct.

Makes sense. I think I’m getting what LK has claimed, the actual CPS claim and what was said in testimony confused. However, the same still stands with neglect. This is copied from a legal website:

What CPS Can and Cannot Do:

What CPS Can Legally Do

CPS has the right to do the following:

• Investigate reports, even if they are false.
  • Mandated reporters must report any suspected child abuse. If they don’t, they can be held legally responsible for neglecting to share what they know. Mandated reporters include:
    • Doctors
    • Lawyers
    • Therapists
  • CPS must investigate every substantial report. However, not all reports are substantial or significant enough to warrant investigation.
  • CPS has the right to legally remove your kids from your home under particular circumstances. They must have a court order or be able to prove that your child is in imminent danger in order to take your child from you. Imminent danger includes things like:
    • Physical harm
    • Sexual conduct
    • Neglect
    • Firearms left out in the open
  • Terminate your parental rights.

CPS would have an obligation to investigate (which they did) and if evidence was presented that the children were in imminent danger, they would be authorized to pursue further action versus just dropping the case.

[Sdel]

CPS showing up to talk to MHG was essentially “an investigation”. They could do more, maybe they did, but that was the least action they could take. I have a stepson that made more than 1 “report” happen when he was mad at his parents for not getting his way. Once I even came home to the police banging on the door because he’d called in a false report to 911.

[Warmblood1]

If they don’t have a evidence, it can’t be legally pursued further.

ETA: in some states, you can take civil action against false reports to CPS. Not sure how that would work with SS in this case. Reminds me of what @ekat was saying in regards to getting transcripts of the recordings to verify what was submitted in the SS claim.

[Sdel]

@Angela_Freda

@Sdel

I personally think the CPS thing was a surprise to LK. Based on the searches testimony, I think she was still toying with the idea of getting them involved some way, or at last thought there would be a more swift reaction….or that CPS would follow up with her first based on her report

It may have been a surprise to her, because she didn’t get them involved, iirc, safe sport did?

Maybe I’m misremembering.
I’m tired

She had the hotline number searches on her phone. That wasn’t an accident. She was always demanding to know how CPS knew to go to the barn directly instead of stopping at the the house first, not wondering about why CPS showed up in the first place.

I guess at some point we’ll hear more directly about what exactly that recorded conversation that prompted SS/CPS was. I just can’t think of too much that would have prompted such a referral and swift reaction time……

[StB.YM]

@CurrentlyHorseless

But the CPS person testified that she was there to investigate MHG for child neglect, and was not there to investigate child abuse.

That’s a fair point, but that’s just what CPS testified to. I’m not sure if any of us know what was told to SS and what SS then told CPS.

[Sdel]

@StB.YM

That’s a fair point, but that’s just what CPS testified to. I’m not sure if any of us know what was told to SS and what SS then told CPS.

Good point. Along with everything else they were not allowed to talk about.

[cutter99]

@Angela_Freda

But the gun wasn’t missing.
So it was a false claim.
And having access to the office, LK likely, could have known full well it was false, that all guns on site were secured in a safe.

I am not sure that we know for a fact that the gun was not missing.

We do know for a fact that LK taunted RC about the gun being missing. She did it on Facebook and there are screenshots of the post.

We do know LK had access to MB’s office where the gun safe was and that she had bugged his office. This was testified to in court.

We also know that MB would verbally give the combination to the gun safe to others, while in the office, if they needed it.

If you take these facts and string them together, and then add the fact that the only people who testified that they saw MB with the gun that day were LK and RG, where does that logically lead you?

There is a likelihood the gun was not in the safe, and not because it was removed by MB.

REMEMBER, 3D chess and all that!

[Sdel]

@cutter99

There is a likelihood the gun was not in the safe, and not because it was removed by MB.

REMEMBER, 3D chess and all that!

Add in, if you think about it, the report to SS was meant to destroy his and MHG’s careers. If your intent is to do that, do you report Mickey Mouse stuff that is easily refuted or likely to be dealt with by a slap on the wrist? Of the things LK or associates have publicly discussed about the kids, not much would have warranted a huge career ending action from SS or a big reaction from CPS. The only thing that would had come close is that taunt about the gun.

Now, if you were seeking a big reaction/consequences…with these facts, would you allow MB to be able to pull the gun out of the safe and show CPS/SS, see, here it is, nice and responsibly safe in the safe. Or would you want him to open that safe and have him desperate about there not being a gun where he’d told them it would be? There were searches for MHG’s kids location….there was obviously more about to go on. LK was very upset that the kids were not at the farm when CPS showed up…

[ekat]

@cutter99

We do know LK had access to MB’s office where the gun safe was and that she had bugged his office. This was testified to in court.

We also know that MB would verbally give the combination to the gun safe to others, while in the office, if they needed it

These are the parts of the recordings I hope we some day get to hear.

I’m also secretly holding out hope that someone has video of the ninja.

[hut-ho78]

@Knights_Mom

@CurrentlyHorseless

@ekat

@eggbutt

Wait, am I understanding correctly that the party who brought the suit is now not cooperating with requests for information? Subpoenas have been ignored?? Wow!!!

@cutter99

So the self proclaimed “bad ass” plaintiff cannot show up for an in person deposition in the case she brought against Michael Barisone???

Stunning, isn’t it?

Meanwhile, still doesn’t appear that SGF looks like they are interested in settling with the “trespasser”. (SGF’s word, not mine).

The filing also explained the basis for the cross claim against Barisone: that he made a verbal barter agreement with LK and RG agreeing to let them live in the house and board 5 horses in exchange for $5,000 per month and the renovation work, which, according to SGF, was in violation of their lease agreement with MB.

They’re saying they, SGF, never agreed to let her live there and never agreed to the “verbal barter agreement”, and that Barisone’s doing so violated his lease of the facility.

No. They are saying that they are not liable because they didn’t agree to parties living there.

You said “no” and then restated the same thing CH said in slightly different words, same meaning.

Agreement.

[Knights_Mom]

@hut-ho78

@Knights_Mom

@CurrentlyHorseless

@ekat

@eggbutt

Wait, am I understanding correctly that the party who brought the suit is now not cooperating with requests for information? Subpoenas have been ignored?? Wow!!!

@cutter99

So the self proclaimed “bad ass” plaintiff cannot show up for an in person deposition in the case she brought against Michael Barisone???

Stunning, isn’t it?

Meanwhile, still doesn’t appear that SGF looks like they are interested in settling with the “trespasser”. (SGF’s word, not mine).

The filing also explained the basis for the cross claim against Barisone: that he made a verbal barter agreement with LK and RG agreeing to let them live in the house and board 5 horses in exchange for $5,000 per month and the renovation work, which, according to SGF, was in violation of their lease agreement with MB.

They’re saying they, SGF, never agreed to let her live there and never agreed to the “verbal barter agreement”, and that Barisone’s doing so violated his lease of the facility.

No. They are saying that they are not liable because they didn’t agree to parties living there.

You said “no” and then restated the same thing CH said in slightly different words, same meaning.

Agreement.

Actually no. The nuance is the emphasis of the point of the statement. The meaning is not the same.

[Ambitious_Kate]

@CurrentlyHorseless

But the CPS person testified that she was there to investigate MHG for child neglect, and was not there to investigate child abuse.

Testified when? The judge ruled that he wouldn’t hear anything about CPS, that it was a separate entity, and had no bearing on this matter. What are you talking about?

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@StB.YM

@CurrentlyHorseless

But the CPS person testified that she was there to investigate MHG for child neglect, and was not there to investigate child abuse.

That’s a fair point, but that’s just what CPS testified to. I’m not sure if any of us know what was told to SS and what SS then told CPS.

The woman from CPS testified under oath that her visit was prompted by a referral from SS and that she was investigating MHG for child neglect and not investigating MB for child abuse.

Despite that direct sworn testimony from the CPS representative, you insist on continuing to blame LK for falsely reporting MB to CPS for child abuse.

[Ambitious_Kate]

@Warmblood1

If they don’t have a evidence, it can’t be legally pursued further.

ETA: in some states, you can take civil action against false reports to CPS. Not sure how that would work with SS in this case. Reminds me of what @ekat was saying in regards to getting transcripts of the recordings to verify what was submitted in the SS claim.

And come to find out the children weren’t even on the property, either because they have been sent away (hooray for a safety conscious parent, no need to pursue further) or because they weren’t there (hooray, the children aren’t in danger after all). CPS investigates reports, and makes decisions based on what it sees. If the children’s welfare is taken care of by a responsible parent, they have bigger fish to fry than a responsible parent.

[Ambitious_Kate]

@CurrentlyHorseless

The woman from SS testified under oath that her visit was prompted by a referral from SS and that she was investigating MHG for child neglect and not investigating MB for child abuse.

Despite that direct sworn testimony from the CPS representative, you insist on continuing to blame LK for falsely reporting MB to CPS for child abuse.

SS is not CPS. When did CPS representative testify?

[Ambitious_Kate]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Despite that direct sworn testimony from the CPS representative, you insist on continuing to blame LK for falsely reporting MB to CPS for child abuse.

What are you trying to say? LK DID falsely report MB to CPS for child abuse. I’m not “blaming” her. I’m calling her out for lying and making false reports.

However, CPS hasn’t testified to anything. I don’t think you are paying attention. Talking to you is like herding cats. Done with this one.

[DownYonder]

@iridedressage

What’s interesting to me is that the children weren’t even there, yet the worker came out the day after the complaint was filed. Usually if a child is not in direct danger there is a 72 hour timeframe to investigate. And since she left the state so quickly, if she was considered the only AP there is no way the could have completed the investigation. They could have reached out to Florida to open a case there, but apparently decided that was not necessary.

What is interesting to me is that the CPS worker interviewed RC while she was there. Do we know why? Was it because they were “pointed” toward her? IOW, did someone give CPS her name, perhaps in connection with being the person who brought a firearm onto the property?

Also - was the CPS worker asked during the trial if she had noticed if the safe in the office was open? If closed, did she try to open it to verify that it was locked (or have MHG try to do it)?

[LexInVA]

Judge Taylor didn’t let the CPS report be used, though it was present and documented as available evidence in the testimony of the case worker, when the case worker was on the stand. I think had that report been made “open”, there would have been some unsettling things revealed about why the worker was there, what they were told beforehand, and what was found. He and the prosecutor also minimized and contained the testimony of the case worker in such a way that it looked prejudicial.

[trubandloki]

I am not sure why we are discussing the CPS call instead of the fact that LK, KK, and JK are ignoring their subpoenas (that is not an easy word to spell, darn it).

On the topic of CPS, I can say that it is not an uncommon technique by those who like to use governing bodies to get their way (general) to make a complaint about someone who matters to the person they want to torture, not against that person directly.
In other words, I want to make You miserable so I am going to make the life of your girlfriend torture.

[DownYonder]

Questions for the legal folks here:

Page 9 of the order to compel LK to appear for a deposition states as shown below. Does the highlighted part indicate that her civil suit actually has an incorrect date for the shooting? And is also inaccurate in that it alleges that RG was shot?

Why aren’t those types of inaccuracies be a valid reason to request a summary judgement to have the complaint dismissed?