The German Hanoverian Society website has an announcement about the merging of the Hanoverian and Rhinelander studbooks effective January 1st. For those of you experienced breeders out there, what do you think this means for warm blood breeding? Look forward to your thoughts.
We can hope this means that people who have purchased RPSI-registered horses will stop mistakenly calling them Rhinelanders. :lol:
Does the US RPSI actually have reciprocity with the German Verband? For example, the Canadian Hanoverians are actually part of the German Verband so their papers are distributed by them. Versus the AHS is it’s own association, but more like a “sister” branch to the German Verband and they issue their own registration papers. Or does the US RPSI have no association with the German counterpart?
Blume, RPSI is not Rhinelander referred to by the Hanoverian Verband news.
Also, AHS has full reciprocity.
One of my German breedings of my Hanoverian mare to the Rhineland stallion Escolar was effected this year in an unexpected way (I had assumed that foal would be able to receive German Hanoverian registry and learned that he was to be registered Rhinelander, despite the prior “agreement” between registries). It will be interesting to see if this later development changes that sort of situation.
As I understand it, RPSI here in the states is run by RPSI in Germany, but do not quote me on that. :winkgrin:
[QUOTE=Home Again Farm;7900456]
Blume, RPSI is not Rhinelander referred to by the Hanoverian Verband news.
Also, AHS has full reciprocity.
One of my German breedings of my Hanoverian mare to the Rhineland stallion Escolar was effected this year in an unexpected way (I had assumed that foal would be able to receive German Hanoverian registry and learned that he was to be registered Rhinelander, despite the prior “agreement” between registries). It will be interesting to see if this later development changes that sort of situation.
As I understand it, RPSI here in the states is run by RPSI in Germany, but do not quote me on that. :winkgrin:[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the clarification! Yes, AHS has full reciprocity with the Verband, but they issue their own papers (versus how the Canadian structure was established). I think poorly explained that:) I was curious how other US/ German registries work…do they get “German” papers or US Registry papers?
I believe that GOV and RPSI papers are issued directly from Germany. I am very curious to hear details of how the Verband news will actually effect us as breeders.
I’ll be interested to see if Rheinlander stallions will be considered Hanoverian with regards to the 50% rule (I’m not sure if that’s only an AHS thing?).
[QUOTE=Peaches;7900727]
I’ll be interested to see if Rheinlander stallions will be considered Hanoverian with regards to the 50% rule (I’m not sure if that’s only an AHS thing?).[/QUOTE]
There is no 50% rule any longer. Breeding rules were changed in a membership vote in May of 2013.
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[QUOTE=ahf;7900763]
There is no 50% rule any longer. Breeding rules were changed in a membership vote in May of 2013.[/QUOTE]
Oh! I’m not a breeder, but I thought it was still a thing since it’s mentioned on the AHS’s website under HV-approved Non-Hano stallions and “Breeding a Mare”.
Rhinelander (Rheinisches Pferdestammbuch e.V) and Rheinland Pfalz-Saar (Pferdezuchterverband Rheinland-Pfalz-Saar e.V) are different registries. Their “territories” are located next to each other in western Germany (this image is really small, but the two areas are located along the western/southwestern border).
Neither are as big or powerful or financially successful as the Hanoverian Verband, and like most of the smaller registries in Germany, they have struggled somewhat to stay afloat. RPS in particular has been through some very rough times (was on the verge of bankruptcy for a while), but thanks to the success of its international branch (RPSI, headquartered in California), it is on better financial footing than it was some 15-20 years ago.
The Rhinelander registry has had a cooperation with the Westfalen studbook for quite some years (holding a joint stallion licensing, joint auctions, etc.), but apparently that partnership was not fulfilling all the needs of the breeders in the Rhinelander area. Last year, the studbook entered into a cooperation with Hannover – http://www.eurodressage.com/equestrian/2013/06/12/rhinelander-and-hanoverian-breed-society-join-forces
So it is not surprising that the cooperation announced last summer has resulted in the merger of the two registries. Eurodressage article is here:
http://www.eurodressage.com/equestrian/2014/12/10/rhinelander-and-hanoverian-society-merge-officially-1-january-2015
It will be interesting to see what happens with the Rhinelander brand.
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[QUOTE=Blume Farm;7900557]
I was curious how other US/ German registries work…do they get “German” papers or US Registry papers?[/QUOTE]
OHBS/GOV is an official arm of the Oldenburg Verband (not a daughter registry). Registration passports are issued from the Verband office in Vechta, Germany. There is full reciprocity between the two departments (mares/stallions approved here are also considered approved in Germany, and vice-versa).
I believe that is also the case for RPS/RPSI, but am not 100% certain.
I don’t know how the merger that is the subject of this thread will work, but in 2010 the Hessen stud merged with the Hannoverian stud in Germany. Hessen mares and stallions had to go through the process of being approved in order to get Hannoverian papers Just like getting a horse in one German registry approved for breeding in another registry, etc. Since there was no Hessen registry here in the USA, there was no issue about any Hessens other than those who were presented in Germany. (Downyonger is right about the economic reasons for mergers of smaller studs into the German Hanoverian stud.) Since my Hessen was branded premium in Germany and is supposed to be gelded, I didn’t worry about the merger.
If RPSI is not the same as the Rhinelander, do we even have that registry in the US? If not it probably won’t effect anyone here. And if the merger is done similar to the Hessen example listed above then I assume the horses will be presented to the Hannoveraner Verband for approval.
[QUOTE=Blume Farm;7901888]
If RPSI is not the same as the Rhinelander, do we even have that registry in the US? If not it probably won’t effect anyone here. And if the merger is done similar to the Hessen example listed above then I assume the horses will be presented to the Hannoveraner Verband for approval.[/QUOTE]
No, the Reinlander registry does not have a presence in the U.S. Only RPSI.
[QUOTE=Sonesta;7902366]
No, the Reinlander registry does not have a presence in the U.S. Only RPSI.[/QUOTE]
And my understanding is that the RPSI’s presence in the U.S. far exceeds its presence in Germany.
As already mentioned, RPS/RPSI has nothing to do w/ Rhinelander - the RPS/I horses are called Zweibrucker (or Zweibruger, or to go really Americanized, Zweiburger, like Hamburger from Zwei). They are not involved in any of the mergers, although I always thought they should merge w/ Old NA since they are very similar in their breeding policies.
Can I double check what the changes made in 2013 to the 50% rule were. What happens if you have a Hanoverian approved mare and a Hanoverian approved stallion, but they both have foal papers from other registries
[QUOTE=Sacha;7904089]
Can I double check what the changes made in 2013 to the 50% rule were. What happens if you have a Hanoverian approved mare and a Hanoverian approved stallion, but they both have foal papers from other registries[/QUOTE]
Any Hanoverian approved stallion can be bred to any Hanoverian approved mare to produce a Hanoverian foal. For example, a Hanoverian approved TB stallion may now be bred to a Hanoverian approved TB mare to produce a full papered Hanoverian foal. Feel free to substitute “TB” for your registry of choice.
Thank you. Perfect news for me. I have a homebred Trakehner mare that is a premium graded mare in the Trakehner studbook but also highly graded and performance tested in the Hanoverian studbook. I have seen two stallions I think will really work with her but they are Westfalen stallions that are approved Hanoverian.
I had assumed I couldn’t get Hanoverian papers for such a cross so that is great news
[QUOTE=Bent Hickory;7902391]
And my understanding is that the RPSI’s presence in the U.S. far exceeds its presence in Germany.[/QUOTE]
Yes their presendes in Germany goes to zeor and the acceptance in the germany horse community overall is not really the sam as for registries like Old Han, Westfalen, Holst.
RPSI found out, how to overcome there almost bankruptcy in Germany …
