Michael/ Lauren civil trial update February 9

[Sdel]

@Omgitsme

I forgot how wild those threads used to get.

Complete with initials and memes…and QFPs.

[Sdel]

My guess is it gets ignored unless someone tries to file contempt/compel motions. As much as one might want to make the point, it is probably a waste of money to address things when the status conference is just a few days away.

Late is late. Nothing will change the fact that IM/KK have essentially refused to answer yet another subpoena through lack of proper procedure, this time in defiance of a judge’s order.

[MHM]

@Sdel

Nothing will change the fact that IM/KK have essentially refused to answer yet another subpoena through lack of proper procedure, this time in defiance of a judge’s order.

What would be the typical consequences for that action, or lack of action?

[Knights_Mom]

@MHM

@Sdel

Nothing will change the fact that IM/KK have essentially refused to answer yet another subpoena through lack of proper procedure, this time in defiance of a judge’s order.

What would be the typical consequences for that action, or lack of action?

I don’t think there will be any until after service is shown, the subpoena is deemed sufficient and the judge specifically orders compliance via court order.

[MHM]

Interesting, thanks.

[Ambitious_Kate]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Courts don’t make awards in the form of the transfer of ownership of dressage horses, particularly dressage horses only half owned by a defendant. If RC ends up with some liability, it will be a monetary award.

Lk apparently thinks horses are an asset, since she specifically named MBs horses as assets she wanted the judge to freeze in court documents, and was laughed at for asking. So I have no doubt Lauren anticipated getting horse ownership awarded from RC. Or dont ypu read the court documents?

[jvanrens]

Might be a comprehension problem.

[clipper]

@eggbutt

Why are Jonathan and Kirby even involved in the conference? As far as official filings, mom and dad aren’t represented by anyone.

I am wondering if JK and KK are involved because LK is under a conservatorship due to issues. This would explain thinking/saying the money comes from the bank etc.

Of course this is just a guess about why a 40 year old’s parents would not have someone other than LKs lawyer respond on their behalf.

What do you think?

[MorganSercu]

Deliberate or incidental, that is the question (with apologies to the bard).

[eggbutt]

I honestly don’t know. That family is an anomaly to me.

[Ambitious_Kate]

@clipper

am wondering if JK and KK are involved because LK is under a conservatorship due to issues. This would explain thinking/saying the money comes from the bank etc.

I wonder if attorneys are so hesitant to separate the parents from LK in these representations is because they are conservators for her.

But is she was in a conservatorship, wouldn’t MB be suing “The Estate of Lauren Kanarek” or the like?

[LexInVA]

Without the required legal paperwork and court documentation - from the state of NC or NJ - that would clearly define the relationship and status between the daughter and parents, there is no way to ascertain if Lauren is in a conservatorship or guardianship or both.

[DownYonder]

What kind of circumstances would result in an adult being placed under a conservatorship? Wasn’t there a recent big deal made about an entertainer (Brittany Spears?) being under the long-time conservatorship of her father?

I am really just curious as I don’t know anything about WHY these types of situations arise except in obvious cases where the individual is so severely compromised mentally or physically that they absolutely cannot manage their own affairs. But why are adults who are capable of living on their own and carrying on reasonably “normal” lives placed in a conservatorship? Is it always something that is forced on them legally (i.e., by court order)? Or do they sometimes willingly agree to place themselves in those situations?

[Knights_Mom]

@DownYonder

What kind of circumstances would result in an adult being placed under a conservatorship? Wasn’t there a recent big deal made about an entertainer (Brittany Spears?) being under the long-time conservatorship of her father?

I am really just curious as I don’t know anything about WHY these types of situations arise except in obvious cases where the individual is so severely compromised mentally or physically that they absolutely cannot manage their own affairs. But why are adults who are capable of living on their own and carrying on reasonably “normal” lives placed in a conservatorship? Is it always something that is forced on them legally (i.e., by court order)? Or do they sometimes willingly agree to place themselves in those situations?

IF there was conservatorship for LK my first guess is that it was because of drug use. If you’re an addict (for instance) and all of a sudden have access to unlimited funds you may succumb to the impulse to go on quite the bender which could potentially kill you, devour your funds and find you waking up next to Gary Busey.

And no one needs to wake up next to Gary Busey.

[MorganSercu]

@Knights_Mom

no one needs to wake up next to Gary Busey.

I’d make an exception for a few people.

[LexInVA]

@DownYonder

What kind of circumstances would result in an adult being placed under a conservatorship? Wasn’t there a recent big deal made about an entertainer (Brittany Spears?) being under the long-time conservatorship of her father?

I am really just curious as I don’t know anything about WHY these types of situations arise except in obvious cases where the individual is so severely compromised mentally or physically that they absolutely cannot manage their own affairs. But why are adults who are capable of living on their own and carrying on reasonably “normal” lives placed in a conservatorship? Is it always something that is forced on them legally (i.e., by court order)? Or do they sometimes willingly agree to place themselves in those situations?

Based on what we know of her personal history, Lauren Kanarek is the textbook example of someone who could be placed under conservatorship or guardianship or both.

Example where conservator is needed, but guardian is not: Lauren K. was in a serious auto accident, where she sustained head injuries. After the accident, Lauren lived in her parents’ basement, went to Temple, played 3D-chess with homeless people, and walked around the town all on her own. She has no ability to do math or handle personal finances and expenses, however, and had a conservator handle the Disability payments, invest it, pay her rent, and send her a small amount of spending money each month.

Example where guardian is needed, but conservator is not: Lauren K. had a massive stroke and brain damage from a narcotics overdose and was rendered incapable of rational thought or actions. As a result, she was placed in a supervised care facility. Because Lauren had no assets or income beyond Disability payments and no personal expenses or finances, she did not need a conservator to make her financial decisions, but she did need a guardian to make her medical decisions.

[cheval_convert]

Off topic, but the group, Gaelic Storm, has a song where the chorus is, “The night I punched Russell Crowe, the Gladiator in the head.” It’s quite funny. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpjG3MIf5zY

[rosinante]

@DownYonder

What kind of circumstances would result in an adult being placed under a conservatorship? Wasn’t there a recent big deal made about an entertainer (Brittany Spears?) being under the long-time conservatorship of her father?

Google “Guardianship Abuse”…and you will get more than you wanted to know.

[jaj]

I am deliriously happy, and my life has meaning once again. That was fantastic.

[rothmpp]

@DownYonder

What kind of circumstances would result in an adult being placed under a conservatorship?

It is often put into place for someone who has demonstrated over the years that they are not capable of managing their finances, particularly in the case of someone with decent financial resources. Like an adult that has inherited money, or substantial settlement, but has issues that don’t stop them from looking like they function in society on daily basis. Like a long term drug or alcohol addiction. They may be currently sober, but if they have relapsed from time to time, a conservator can make sure their finances remain intact. Or a person who has fallen victim to con artists or scams over and over again - if they cannot just write a check or initiate a bank transfer without approval, it protects their assets.

I think it is more common to see a trust that is managed by an appointed trustee. My friend’s sister passed away with two older teenage kids. A property of substantial value was sold after her death, and the proceeds are being held in a trust for the kids to be used for things like education until they are 29.

We are encouraging my MIL to utilize a trust since FIL passed away last fall. They have a decent amount of assets, and BIL is angling to “take over” her finances and life (in a creepy Oedipal kind of way but that’s it’s own separate thread). We aren’t trying to limit what she spends, she’s very reasonable, but we have watched BIL already try to get her to sign assets over to him and want to make sure her financial support stays in place for the remainder of her life.