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Might FeedXL still be able to give me useful information as a boarder? How appropriate have you found their forage averages?

Horse Care
#1

I have probably created a macronutrient problem for my horse, somewhat deliberately. An increase in his pergolide dose put him off his grain over the summer, and I switched him from 2lb/day of TC Lite to 2lb/day of TC Senior to get the medicine to go down. This is about 1/3 of the recommended serving by weight- he meets his calorie needs with forage alone- and my intention was that if I couldn’t get him back to eating the Lite, I would monitor his condition by bloodwork and supplement as required. And lo, now that he knows the joy of a really delicious food, he is not interested in eating celery again, because he is not stupid. :slight_smile:

As I’m considering his condition, his bloodwork to date, and the need to further monitor and adjust, I’m wondering if a FeedXL subscription might be a good tool- or if I don’t have complete enough data to allow it to work for me. Here are the constraints I’m working in:

  • I board. I am not involved in pasture management, and I’m not readily able to get the grass tested.
  • Our hay vendor is consistent but the suppliers who sell to them are not, so a hay analysis would not be of benefit.
  • The major problem I need to solve for is that my horse’s summer condition is good, but in winter I observe changes that I attribute to his nutrition. (I suspect that I know where he’s deficient based on his physical condition and what’s dead in his field- omega 3’s, magnesium- and both of these are a bit hard to prove by bloodwork.)

So: if I went with a FeedXL premium plan, would I be getting enough data to help me address his nutritional needs even with my constraints? From the site, it looks like I’ll be able to access average forage analyses for my area. Do these averages include seasonal variations? (The best pasture in the world won’t help if the grass is dead.) If you’re a FeedXL client already, would you suggest using this tool in addition to regular bloodwork, or have you found that it has obviated bloodwork and other monitoring?

#2

Is all your hay at least from the same county? If so, see if the Extension Agency has an average analysis for that type of hay. Otherwise, I’m not sure I’d bother with a subscription for just a national average unless you really can access an average for a small enough area.

Have you tried a ration balancer? 1lb plus maybe 1/2-1lb of TC Sr would be great nutrition

Blood work beyond selenium and vit E won’t tell you what to add

I would add flax to his Winter diet, 1c or so, and more Vit E. 1000IU extra should cover him as there’s an effective dose of 875 IIRC in 1lb of TC 30 (because half of the stated 1000IU is synthetic)

#3

I board and have been a FeedXL user for several years – although I only use it a few times a year when I consider changing feed.

I find it invaluable just comparing different feeds and supplements, independent of hay.

You can create a fake diet of all the hays and forages listed in their database and compare them to see what is the difference between first cut, etc.

I recently moved to a barn that offers meadow grass instead of orchard. I was surprised to learn how much iron is in meadow grass! It meant that I had to rebalance the Fe:Cu:Zn:Mn.

So no, I don’t know exactly, but if you are interested in nutrition, I think it is worth a one year subscription for one horse.

3 Likes
#4

I have no idea, but thanks for the tip- that’s a resource I wouldn’t have thought of.

Not lately. I previously had him on TC 30% (he didn’t care for it) and Tribute Essential K- which he wasn’t really amused to find in his dish, but would eat. He’s gotten more particular about texture in his old age (he doesn’t have a dental reason, this has been a lifelong preference.) I’ve been thinking about trying the Essential K again and seeing if it’s more palatable when fed 50-50 with TC Senior. He thinks Senior is a great treat, after a life on TC Lite. :slight_smile:

Those were my two original primary concerns to monitor and knock on wood we’re doing fine so far; his October bloodwork was within normal range for both.

Check and half a check- he’s on Platinum Performance in the winter (two different vets said “you can make yourself nuts mixing up all kinds of supplements or you can start with this.”) It’s definitely not the most cost-effective way to supplement omega 3’s and vitamin E alone but it does give me a starting point.

Today my vet and I discussed not mixing things up further until we get his Cushings bloodwork back, since he was due for a recheck, so I have some more time to think about it.

#5

If he gets all the calories he needs from hay, you could maybe do a forage balancer like Vermont Blend mixed in some soaked orchard grass or timothy pellets.

I’ve had FeedXL in the past and it gave me a general idea where the holes were, even though I didn’t have a forage analysis. You can also check out DairyOne’s data base to see if they might have a profile for your region. Since they raised their prices I’m not sure I would go there again.

2 Likes
#6

Tribute has a new Wholesome Blends line, and the ration balancer is soy-free but retains the 28% protein. It costs a few $ more, at least as long as you’re close enough to Ohio, but its cost does go up the further away you get. He might find that yummy.

Definitely not cost-effective LOL I’d for sure drop that if you get a good balancer/feed, and add E separately as it’s really cheap. Whole flax is cheap too

Good plan :slight_smile:

**edited because my fingers typed NSC instead of protein up at the 28%.

#7

I think it’s a sign of insanity that I knew you meant 28% protein, not NSC, even though I haven’t read a Tribute grain label in about 4 years! :wink: I think he will definitely find a textured ration balancer interesting and if I can find it anywhere other than Chewy and the barn won’t kill me for bringing another container into the feed room, that might be a good option.

I will put in a plug for it being easy to manage. I’d do things differently if I had him at home, but this is a horse who gets up to 8 different feed additives depending on the time of year given his list of medical conditions. (Apparently, getting old is complicated. Who knew?) That is a ridiculous amount of stuff for a boarding barn to manage, so I pre-pack all of it. The Platinum is easy to work with- it’s one scoop of one thing that fits into the containers I use, and all the barn has to do is feed + container + soak = done. There’s something to be said for the convenience factor there. I’ve worked for farms that did a more customized nutrition plan for their horses, beet pulp, whole grains, whole flax, a particular localized vitamin/mineral blend, and whatever top dress the individual horse needed. It works great but there are definitely economies of scale to doing that for every horse versus having a supplement packing assembly line set up in your pantry at home…

#8

omg YES! Why did my fingers type NSC when my brain was saying protein? Now for something interesting - I’m going to edit my comment so I don’t give anyone a heart attack, and see if your quote here stays the same, like the old forum, or changes to match. I assume it will stay the same…

I totally understand the convenience aspect.

#9

Ok, your quoted text has the original NSC, I edited mine to say protein.

#10

You just wanted to set yourself up for an opportunity to do a little QA. You’re welcome! :slight_smile:

1 Like
#11

I use FeedXL, even tho I’m a boarder. I do buy my own hay, but I don’t test it as I don’t have a need to, not really. I find it useful (as another poster pointed out) to compare feeds if I think I’m going to switch something. For hay, I find whatever is closest to my area and the type of hay I feed.
I also feed TC Sr, well below label amounts, and I make it up with Uckele Equi VM, vitamin e, flax. (I also use a hoof supplement, but those are my basics).
I think the cheapest bulk magnesium I ever found was MVP-5000.

#12

Thanks for this- it sounds like you’ve still been able to get value out of the product even though you don’t have perfect data. Are you putting in average hay data that you’ve found yourself, or is there data in the tool that you can select? Do you put in any pasture data, or does it have area averages for that also?

#13

Pasture, it will ask you a series of questions. So for that what you’ll get is rather generic. Since I have no way of managing that as a boarder, I just take the results with a grain of salt. Basically I know that in my area iron is high and selenium is very low.
For hay, there is a tab for forages. I input, for example, ‘orchard grass’. It will pull up all choices they have in the database and you can choose from that.
It does have the option for you to put in your own feed values if it is something not listed that you’d like to add.

I do find I’ve gotten value out of it. If nothing else I have peace of mind that I’m on the right track.

#14

Thanks. Is there anything in there about seasonal variation in pasture quality? I think that’s going to be my main issue.

#15

Nope, sorry.

You could run the values both ways and see where the differences are.

#16

that’s the main issue with pasture in general, and makes it really not worth testing. You could get the perfect sample size, but the horse prefers to eat most of the time on a sub-set of that. Best thing is to use averages of that type of hay for that area, and know that’s even more of a guesstimate for your own pasture, than the average for hay.

#17

Oh yes, I see you’ve met my horse, who eats clover and dandelions, and a specific patch under the far fence, and pine needles off the tree, and bark… :wink: Thanks to you and @Obsidian_Fire- that answers my question!

#18

Yep!

“But horse, LOOKIT all that lovely grass here, and here, and here!”

“I like seeing how close I can get my face to the hot tape and grab tiny mouthfuls of the lawn” (which isn’t sprayed, so that’s fine)

#19

At least he hasn’t opened the gate and gone down to the dining hall lately.

The farm is on the campus of a girls’ school. This is a thing that has happened.

#20

I board, and I run a FeedXL report on each of my horses once a year.

I get our hay tested - I just go over to the hay barn and take the core samples myself, then send them to a lab.

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