What would it take to eliminate the horse portion of Pentathlon and substitute in something else? Any chance?
3 Likes
It looks like the format for Paris has already been decided since they came up with a new 90-minute formula where all the phases take place in the same space to make it more spectator-friendly, so I think the horse component will need to be there for at least one more Olympic cycle, but I imagine the heights could easily be lowered while respecting the new format devised in the test events.
1 Like
Wow, paid per ride. That is an interesting bit of information. I was wondering why Saint Boy’s owner wasn’t saying, “Enough.” I saw he did not return for the men’s pentathlon the next day, so I guess the officials elected not to use him or the owner said no.
Editing because I just told Mr. IF about this payment scheme. He suggests it might be improved is the OWNER’S name was announced with the horse’s name. So “Next is Rider Z on Saint Boy owned by Jane Doe.” Let the owner get some publicity both good and bad. Also publish what the owners are paid. Be transparent. Unlikely to happen, but easy to do.
13 Likes
I would like to see horses removed from this sport. Perhaps BMX biking? But while it is there, I was considering what might make it safer and kinder to the horses as well as fair to the humans. Certainly these jumps were too high and the rules allowed poor horsemanship.
What if in addition to lowering the jumps, there was an optimum time established. This can be done by timing the pros on the course and creating a fairly generous window of unpenalized time. Horses must canter the course and any trotting or loss of forward motion is penalized. (So someone cant gun the course and then walk the last bit) Circling is penalized. Then penalties for knockdowns and refusals are the same. After a refusal the rider can opt to go to the next jump with no additional penalty unless in a combination. Rider must move on after two refusals at the same jump. More than 3 consecutive smacks of the crop at any time in the arena is elimination. Fall of horse or rider is elimination but reride at judge’s discretion if beyond rider’s control. It would be nice not to have the horses go twice, but maybe not practical. At least have a rule that for any horse that has accumulated X number of penalties in the first round, the second rider has the option of a reserve horse.
Lots of ways to make it more humane and fairer. Will be interesting to see if they do much if anything.
3 Likes
I agree wholeheartedly with this. I’ve DONE shows of this format (drawing a horse and going), at this height, although I think the warmup was a little different because we got a specific number of jumps, not a time limit. But that was all people who actually … ride. And it had its own scary rounds, but not anything like what I saw in the pentathlon videos.
Does anyone know WHY the jumps are 1.20-1.25 in this sport? Why on earth can’t they be 1m or even 1.10 if they want them to be “bigger”? 4’ is a much bigger ask of a horse and rider than even 3’6.
I’d like to see the riding portion removed entirely, as this is a consistent issue each Olympics from what I can tell, but there are numerous ways it could be made safer.
I kind of think they should take the time element out entirely with the horses. Make it faults-only. That’ll get you some better riding because suddenly it’ll matter more if the rider wants to just gun around and play at being in a bowling alley.
12 Likes
If the goal is to test the rider, just use a simple hunter round…outside, angle, outside, angle. Throw in a long approach single or a simple rollback and be done with it. Establishing pace, lead changes, basic riding skills.
17 Likes
For the record, I thought that the sportsmanship and horsemanship of the German woman and her trainer were both appalling. I know it’s high-stakes and high pressure being in the Olympics, but your emotions have to be like a light switch that you switch off the moment you swing a leg over the horse.
20 Likes
The downside of this is the riders who will keep trying and keep trying and keep trying because they know there is no time limit.
They will have to make it so this can not happen.
1 Like
What if they did the same rules as regular jumpers? Give them 2 refusals total and then they’re done.
If they don’t want elimination to be that easy to come by, make it an automatic X number of penalties or something.
8 Likes
I doubt you could get them to go for the two refusals you are out thing. This is a sport where they allow them to get back on after falling off, or the horse falling with the rider.
The second idea is perfect.
They normally show around .90m. It seems to only be championship and big events where the fences are actually max height. Creating more issues.
4 Likes
@Jealoushe, do the competitors get to see the horses being schooled over the fences at some time after they are assigned a horse?
They get to watch the jury ride, then they usually spend the evening before the event watching all the horses on video again to see how they go. They definitely put an emphasis on wanting a horse that will jump no matter what.
Modern Pentathlon was one of the sports considered for elimination along with baseball and softball after Beijing, but it survived. In an article from July, the chair of the UPIM business affairs committee, John Helmick (he’s from Eugene, OR) said “We are very comfortable in our skin.” Later in the same article he said, “In theory, the horses are supposed to be of equal ability, but I don’t think they were ever tested in the rain…Some of the horses don’t like having the mud splatter up against them.” This guy competed in MP in the 1980s. You can read the full article here:
2 Likes
Hu?
Is he trying to prove he is clueless about horses?
Or trying to cement that we all think they consider the horses as equipment and not a living thing?
19 Likes
yeah Im sure none of those jumpers have ever competed in the rain 
5 Likes
From Your article, my bold:
One possible victim of the rain was David Svoboda of Czech Republic, who set an Olympic record for shooting points, then was thrown from his horse, knocking him out of medal contention.
“If you look at his past performances, his ride is not his strongest event,” Helmick says. “When conditions make the course more challenging, the better riders do rise to the top.”
Again, the blaming the horse semantics.
12 Likes
It seems that most of the posters here are either participants in or observers of one of the seven FEI disciplines, of which Modern Pentathlon is not one.
We know that many of the FEI disciplines have had serious issues (e.g., drugging, horse abuse). However, the organization has at least recognized these issues and made attempts at remedy (and maybe should do more, not arguing with that).
Modern Pentathlon seems to think that if it tweaks a few things, all will be well. Perhaps some emails/letters to the national and international organizations are in order.
6 Likes
I am watching some of the London 2012 video that was posted above and I am enjoying the commentator. He is saying what most here are thinking, that the riders do not prepare well enough for this phase and how the horses are trying so hard with out any support from the riders who do not train enough.
17 Likes
