Moore's Equine Rescues-what happened to bail outs?

[ASB_Stars]

You folks do know, at this point, Moore’s has a Facebook presence, and offers a bunch of these horses with the sword of Damocles hanging over them. He has “gone mainstream” at this point. But then, we always knew that he was as slick and shrewd as he is morally and ethically bankrupt.

[Angela_Freda]

[QUOTE=ASB Stars;9004835]
You folks do know, at this point, Moore’s has a Facebook presence, and offers a bunch of these horses with the sword of Damocles hanging over them. He has “gone mainstream” at this point. But then, we always knew that he was as slick and shrewd as he is morally and ethically bankrupt.[/QUOTE]

And is not averse to making a buck.

[ASB_Stars]

[QUOTE=Angela Freda;9005308]
And is not averse to making a buck.[/QUOTE]

I don’t fault anyone for wanting to make money. It’s HOW he does it that is so reprehensible.

[1118]

I was told about this site, Jennifer Hamilton is Jen Hartranft her and her husband BARRY have been flipping horses they have been buying from Brian Moore since maybe as far back as 2006. Hartranft horse sales, Barry Hartranft horse sales, Tiny hooves big heart then this with Brain then they went to walnut hill pleasure horses, now Walnut hill stables. They have lied,cheated,stolen and scammed money. He doesn’t have 30yrs experience, never rode in a rodeo. I know a lot, I am ashamed to say i am or was her mother. She and Barry physically assulted me 5yrs ago. I disowned her. Barry is scamming the gov. On disability and dealing horses. Puts everything in jens name now maybe their sucker of a son in law with good credit. Shain Bourassa. How they get away with fraud is beyond me. Heard she was signing vet name to coggins papers. BEWARE they cheat family they will cheat you.

[Laurierace]

:eek::eek::eek::eek:

[SonnysMom]

@&

I was told about this site, Jennifer Hamilton is Jen Hartranft her and her husband BARRY have been flipping horses they have been buying from Brian Moore since maybe as far back as 2006. Hartranft horse sales, Barry Hartranft horse sales, Tiny hooves big heart then this with Brain then they went to walnut hill pleasure horses, now Walnut hill stables. They have lied,cheated,stolen and scammed money. He doesn’t have 30yrs experience, never rode in a rodeo. I know a lot, I am ashamed to say i am or was her mother. She and Barry physically assulted me 5yrs ago. I disowned her. Barry is scamming the gov. On disability and dealing horses. Puts everything in jens name now maybe their sucker of a son in law with good credit. Shain Bourassa. How they get away with fraud is beyond me. Heard she was signing vet name to coggins papers. BEWARE they cheat family they will cheat you.

Quoted just in case it gets poofed.

[Tabby]

 I Agree Completely with what Greenie Horselove 91 said. I have personally bailed 2 Moores horses and one of the horses were fundraised for! I agree with everything she says. I would rather give money to those buyers hands then let those horses ships. It is not about the money its about the horses. Its about saving a life. Its about giving the horses that would normally not get any chance at all a chance. 

I will continue to stand up for the Auction Horses and Kill Pen Horses. I will not forget the faces of those horses. Its the life not about the fact of who these people are. Do people think that kill buyers are going to give their horses away for free? Its a business, and we complain about supporting these kill buyers by saving a life, but we support it every single day through the millions of media ads of horse owners selling their horses, every single day people are supporting it. Yes help the ad horses, sell horses, but What about the auction horses who have No Voice?

Every horse person is so anti Auction horses, its not like any of those people would help them. Horses that never get a chance to be seen on ads or by horse owners who get dumped at the auctions. The stolen horses at the auctions and kill pens. Almost all the horse auctions in the United States are ruined and owned by kill buyers. These horses are in the biggest of danger! And No One to Defend them, to see them. So we just would rather the kill buyers to ship them silently and push it under the rug and hind it. Atleast they give horses a chance and who else  has the rights to those horses besides them? People say yes bids, but what about the private Kill buyer auction sells, who gets to bid those horses?? 

For the Death of a horse sitting in front of our eyes, no I will not fail them, the way so many others have. To atleast give them a chance. I have so many horses people practically all of them tell me growing up Dont Buy a Thoroughbred, An Off track Horse, A Gaited Horse, A Arabian, A Hotbreed, A Mare, and Most of All Never Buy an Auction horse! I Have broke all those Horse Human Rules, I have 2 auctions mares a Saddlebred and a Hackney. I got them from Moores, this was after I have read millions of articles about Moores or previous Brokers, Kill Pens, Auctions, Slaughters, Horse Problems, Animal Problems, people go around in circles about stuff that deosnt matter but at the end of the day the only ones left are the horses. I thought horse lovers love all horses not just some.

I Believe in Helping auction, kill pen horses as They Are the Forgotten, The Silent, They have no Voice, They are the So called old, sick, unwanted, Crazy, Mean, Injuried, and every other label we place on them. The minute someone mentions an auction horse equestrains turn their head. Yes ad horses, sell horses are at risk and wiind up at kill pens but they Have Owners to Be their Voice for Them. Because if People watched where their horses were going there Would be No Horse Slaughters and there would be No Moores. Horses arent free, a life is not free, Once a life is gone it can Never be given back. If They are sitting in the hands of those buyers, I will not sit back and let them secretly sneak them off.

We Fight so hard for Horse Drugs, Dog Fighting, Animals Abuse, Animal Neglect, Child Abuse, Drug Addicts, the Homeless, Potching! Yet We Still dont fight for Horse Slaughtering, well that is a Holocaust for horses and no justifying in it. People would give any money to save a child, if someones kid was in their they would do anything thing they could to get them out and people complain for the money they spend on a horses life. Even Media keeps it hidden under a rug you see commerials on tv and online articles publicly promoting all of these issues bot Not one publicily mentions Horse Slaughtering because its either they are sluaghter supporters or they dont want to hear about it because its a Painful subject. Nothing Changes if its left a Big Happy secret so we can continue to have our rich horse dinners at fancy horse resturants in another country and eventually bring it here so all horses and people can finally be happy right. Because all horses want to die that way. I know about it and I still want to fight for the horses.. I will always buy from the auctions for now on, because I want to make sure those horses are not forgotten the way that I was when I was a child.

[Tabby]

Yes, I and I am sure alot of the other people helping on the page know that he ships horses not on the rescue and the fact that the horses arent slaughter fit! Is not true of any sort, as kill buyers often break rules as grey horses are often shipped to slaughter anyways, horses in foal are often still shipped, and yes they like the fat healthy horses probably why the fat ones are worth more on moores. The ponies, of course. Its a chance to give people an oppurtinity to give them a chance. Horse rescues arent just filled up with because of bailing horses out of kill pens, because you dont just fix one horse problem you fix many. Horse rescues help more then just kill pen and auction horses, they also help the horses outside of the auction, kill pen area, such as the starved, neglected, abused horses, etc. They are often the last option before selling to auctions. They take in the Thoroughbreds, Standardbreds, and tons of other equine issues besides just horse slaughtering. There are rescues that help out with Moores horses.

I find horse people to be the most prejudice, close minded animal people. It is really sad. All this debating about kill pens, stop letting horses shipp to kill pens in the first place, start caring about where your horses end up. We Support it Every Day EVery time We Sell a Horse! Think of all the reasons horses are sold because their too old, they want something younger, they out grew their pony, their poor horse was sitting in the pasture wasting his life away so a slaughter should be a better way to use up his life on our plates. So lets let all the auction horses continue to run under kill buyers and let the kill buyers think its okay to go secretly as the biggest Percentage of horses all come from Auctions. Why is this such a debate, why does there have to be one way to help this world out, rescues can only help out so much.

I think people often forget about how many regulations horse slaughtering doesnt follow and will never follow. A million procedures means nothing to those people. Nothing good about horse slaughtering, nothing healthy about horse meat, and nothing humane about it. Until someone puts a law up against it, fighting will never end. Yet we all know that anti slaughtering will never win due to people, we are the ones who create the business we are the only ones who can end it and there isnt just one way of doing it. To get a dead horse or an injuried horse? Dont get a auction horse or a kill pen horse if thats what your worried about. Anyone buying auction horses should no theres risks, but when you go to save someones life its usually not based on such conditional standards.

If you see the trauma these horses go throw, its worth it. The horrible pain and suffering, fear they go through. One slaughter horse was so scared it tried climbing out of the wall at the plant, they just knocked the horse down. That horse was actually a Grey Horse too Just Remembered that. The fear in their eyes, good majority of horses are not dead at the time that they are cut, and are just unconctious as everyone knows the stuff they use is not ment for horses. Injuries and things they do to get those horses their such as jabbing a horses eye out in order to stop the horse from fighting with other horses. Or a horses running out of a trailer only to have a chunk of flesh torn off and hanging by skin because of how proper their methods are.

I have grown up with animals all my life, I have seen the pain in their eyes and unless I find a reason not too, a life will always be my first choice. If I could help more I would.

I remember a lady telling me and a barn about how bad this horse was, evil, wicked

Actually one particularly incorrect fact is that most people buy kill pen horses over rescues. I know tons of people who adopt rescue horses from rescues all of the time, the kill pen bailers are usually the smaller percent because NO One Wants Auctions Horses. I think of all the horse people I know probably 4 of them in each stable would ever take the chance on an auction horse let alone a kill pen horse. Most of those people wont even buy a Saddlebred let alone buy an auction horse. For all the gaited and hot mare prejudices out their. About 75 percent of horse ads are looking for geldings, maybe about half willing to take an thoroughbred, about 45 percent will get a rescue horse and 25 percent will possibly ever take a kill pen horse. Most of the horses I share only about 2 people will comment on it and most of it is extremely negative, the first thing usually being about that they are either hot gaited or auction horses.

I have seen videos of animals skinned alive and seeing their pain, their faces of fear, and suffering, in other countries, simply because they are considered a Nausiance to the Earth or is it Actually an Inconvienence to Humanity? That for example was the Racoon Dog. Or the Turkoman the Real Creator of the Thoroughbred often not mentioned because it was too Skinny or Sick Looking so they only mentioned the Arabian bloodline. So they put the Turkoman through extinct by the very first horse slaughters opened up because We Didnt Need horses. No the only surviving part of the Turk is the Akhel Teke. Or The Zebra and other African animals hunted to extinction because they messed up our happy lives. All the Deer we kill and leave all over the roads, which is gross other countries have more respect then this. We say theres too many deer that they need hunted but we continue to add to the population Intentionally So We Can Continue to Have Game and Reason to Hunt. We run wolves to extinction and our modern coyote which is actually an eastern coyote and a canadian timber wolf, we now all of the sudden think animals are evolving for the first time a Coywolf, this has existed for thousands of years and our Eastern Coyote is Infact a Coywolf.

The only ones suffering is the horses, but as long as people always win things are all good. So let them ship the horses away, let people dump their horses off and feel sorry for all the horse sellers who couldnt help but give their loved horse to a kill pen.

[Tabby]

Luckly I am not the only person with 2 moores horses , we went to pick up both of our horses and one was at Moores place where they video the horses etc.

[Tabby]

@2graymares

---

I am the original poster. The “women” verbiage was taken directly from the Moore’s site as they identified your group as those who gave donations toward their horses. They stated your group was taking a break and there would be no assistance from you for the current advertised horses. I also noticed that the rescue, now identified as Hooves-claws and misfits, was not offering homes as they had for horses purchased with donations. I wondered why this had happened and if the “women” and the rescue were one and the same entity which it appears not to be based on responses. Why did both cease at the same time?

My problem is after watching about 10 years of drama and scams propagated by those taking advantage of good hearted people such as yourself I want to ask questions when I see similar stories as those in the past that acted in such a manner. First as you say, you have never met them, just conversed via email and phone. I consider myself a tough cookie, yet I did the same thing and sent $2500 to someone in KY for a down payment on a horse trailer. I had numerous conversations with the lady and heard her children in the background. She was gracious and offered to change the loading ramp to 2 separate doors. She even called me with updates on the progress of the trailer. Then the excuses started. It wasn’t until she gave me the story of the tornado that had caused a tree to destroy the building the trailer was in and they had to start over that I became suspicious. Then the phone was disconnected. I checked the weather in the city and found there was no tornado anywhere in KY that day. Long story short a police report was filed and my credit card company became involved. Luckily I have a habit of hard copies of emails and other documentation that I provided to the cc company and offered to participate in any court action. They refunded my down payment and sent out bulletins that hopefully prevented others from making the same mistake. Southern Diamond Trailers.

I also followed horse rescues on Alex Brown Racing and was appalled by the same types of scams by horse rescues. Turns out many did not even exist at all, but were created by copying and pasting real peoples barns and horses and constructing a fantasy. Then they had collaborators who posed as members of ABR but instead perpetrated the scam by stating they had visited the rescue and what a wonderful place it was blah blah. It was sick. Heck, one head of a rescue supposedly died and people sent in money to bury her after a begathon by her spouse. Then, money was needed to feed the horses, pay the rent and on and on. It was all fake, someone became suspicious, the woman was using an assumed name, she fled and the “death” was the last ditch attempt to bleed the followers of money before the “spouse” also bailed. There were many other horse rescue scams but this was the most memorable. Every few weeks a new one was exposed and I kept wondering why people kept donating. A group of people were exiled by ABR for any question that was “negative” about a rescue and began a site dedicated to exposing faux rescues. So that’s where I come from and that’s why I cut to the chase when I see problematic behaviors.

Here are my questions/and observations to horselove 91

1. Again, thank you for trying to help horses.
2. How do you know who is real on a board and who is coached to cheerlead for a scammer or part of the scam? People generate multiple personalities on line and have them talk back and forth every day of the week. They troll the internet for generous people like yourself and befriend you for the cause.
3. Jennifer Hamilton is not her real name according to one of the Exposing Scams groups, who put up a link to a Rip off report filed by her own mother accusing she and “Barry” her husband, of fleecing her out of money to buy horses for resale and never repaid.
4. Jennifer Hamilton is shown in photos in the company of Brian Moore purchasing horses at New Holland for very minute amounts compared to the “bail” listed for their price on his site.
5. All week long the hysteria mounts and people beg for someone, anyone to “bail” the horses and if you notice only a few are bailed outright. Then, at the 11th hour a message goes up that all theremaining horses have been saved with no accounting of further monies or who purchased them.
6. The previous info on the horses and the donations is removed when the supposed bailment occurs just before the truck deadline, so no one sees how these miracle donations came about–it’s a blank slate until the next group of horses is posted. How about this possibility–they bank the donations, the horses who were actually purchased are delivered, and the remainder either dispersed to other dealers or sent to slaughter. Now that’s how you maximize profits.
7. How do you know a truck comes except that’s what you are told?
8. Where’s any proof you are “getting horses out of danger” other than what you are told? Have you seen the horses? How do you know the horse is really at a Quarantine facility? That time frame plus removing the data needed to follow the horse is key. As I said-some of them are fully paid for and may be used as examples, but very doubtful is the report of last minute miracles consistently happening. Of course you are told they are all saved because if you were told most weren’t, and were sent to slaughter, wouldn’t you be sickened enough to stop donating?
9. Of course you get attached to the horses-they count on it and send out fb messages all the time to make you feel guilty and empty your checking account.
10. You take the word of a kill buyer and the person who is in his company at New Holland that horses didn’t ship with no other evidence or ability to track the transactions? Prove to me that they didn’t ship.
11. You use the list of quarantine facilities provided on their site and can’t see that they form a net to back each other up?
12. You stated you donated to the horses, paid for quarantine and found new homes. Did you ever see the horses, the facility or the new owners or was this all accomplished via social media?
13. Of course fb posts pop up on End of the Line that they were saved–its part of the hype and encourages further donations due to one’s desire to help and guilt by failing to repeat the behavior.
    Lastly, any facility that denies you access to see the operation personally and provide you with definitive proof of donations and disposition of the animal is not worthy of your support.

Yes Responding to this! I have 2 moores horses and I agree with everything greenie is saying. First not all horses make it every week, I mark and save all the horses who dont make it. Two weeks ago 5 horses shipped but its been more. I have been to the facility and the quarantine place, I remember what it looks like. I am one of the owners horse posted photos of the horses, there is a website for people who bailed horses on moores to share about their horses and alot of them do share. I shared Ginger and Haviah on their.

We Had one mare picked up at Moores and the other was quarantined at one of their listed facilities which was Wild Angels. We went and picked both of them up. We dont have prove of every owner but I keep a photo of each horse to keep an eye out incase people were to resell them or place them back in a lot. Which I have not seen, however some people have resold their horses and even purchased them just too dump them at a lot which is one reason the bail prices went up much more as well as half bail which was available.

I have seen their trucks but never seen them ship. However they are large trucks. They dont send out facebook messages to everyone, but update their page to let you know how the horse is doing if they have a home offer, the home offers name is up and whether they are full bailing or how much bail is left. I got haviah for 300 as they raised just enough on her but had no home. Most of these arent just miracles but give the people a chance to full bail or half bail but once it gets to the last night often the people who share, fundraise, and facilitate with rescues will often help pitch in for the horses, sometimes Moores will give us an extention. I have donated, they also set up pages with artwork and other stuff too help get funds, then they use those funds for a horse.

Moores also has a General fund, the general fund is just a basic fund for any horse, at the end of the week will be put towards a horse that needs it most. If a horse is not bailed the people get refunded. Which has happened before. Alot of people such as potiental buyers will wait until the last minute hoping someone else will bail them out first and the people who really want the horses will bail at the last Minute. Both Ginger and Haviah were last minute bails, it sometimes takes awhile to get in contact with people during the week as it gets pushed towards the last minute trying to get transportation into place and get in contact with all the people we need before bailing them out. Alot of people arent coached alot of them are just dedicated horse people who share, horse owners, horse rescues, and other horse organizations who help pitch in on the page. it is a mutual effort, not just one person or a couple of people.

The Horses are higher then auction prices and I think its cause they double the price of the horses they purchase. The one with more weight always have the higher prices, such as the quarter horses and appaloosas. Its also based on transportation, as this is a little different the Aucrtion Auction Horses. I think not positive but it is a kill pen, a holding pen before shipping not just purchased horses. The kill pen horses are brought to Moores and shared. As Far as not being slaughter material, lot of the horses deffinately are and slaughters often dont follow procedures ever. Haviah when she came was in very good weight and deffinately would be a kill buyer pocket, she was smaller of course, but she deffinately was healthy. Ginger was an amish horse. A Saddlebred and a Hackney they are together and happy. Haviah is certianly a silly girl. She never ceases to make me laugh, shes so sweet and wildfire is a good song for her. Ginger on the other hand, she was 200 pounds underweight but had a large like pot belly from worms. Shes gained much weight now, shes just a hard keeper anyways. She has a been there done that personality, she can be grumpy sometimes but she has a sweet soft side to her.

We come over to pick Ginger up. We got her at the last minute as Brokers went under for a very long time and they split. We were originally going to get a different horse from another kill pen but ended running into her almost accidentially. We got her and I wasnt sure if it would be a scam or trustworthy but we bailed her. Got a trailer and went up to pick her up, the place she stayed is where they do they hold the horses and do photos, ship them etc, deffinately auction horses. Really large trailer, they were taking out a dirty load of bailed horses when we picked up ginger and petted some of the horses that were right out in the one small barn, they brought Ginger out for us. She was nervious and snorting, took her back four hour drive to our place. Haviah we couldnt get her right away so took her took quarantine for about 3 weeks and went to pick her up. 2 hours so only half the trip, haviah had a video posted on the wild angels website of how she was doing. We went to pick her up, the lady helped us load her in and had several other moores horses being quarantined and some which she was keeping their.

Besides the general fund , there are atleast 5 or more different groups of people who collab for donating to these horses so they do whats called a 10 dollar challange to help motivate people. Alot of these people also help find horses homes on rescues as well as other lots and other kill pens and auctions.

They also will try to contact previous owners to those with papers and there has been a few owners who bailed their horses out. It has happened quite abit accept the recent one someone bailed a horse they thought was theirs and found out it wasnt their horse so refunded trhe whole bail the the horse had to be put back up on the page.’

They will often also do a simple check up as well as getting papers or whatever those things are called for taking horses out of state, but since I live in the state didnt need them. Haviah had been vet check I believe she was wormed as well. Ginger had a basic check but not as haviah would have. Ginger had a couple of marks and scratches on her when we got her. She had only one shoe on as her others fell off. Haviah on the other hand had all four road shoes, was super healthy.

[Angela_Freda]

Uh, @Tabby look at the first post on this thread, look at the date at the top… this is an old, old, OLD thread and everyone here has been around the block with Moores at least a time or two… do a search, there are thread after thread about this… activity ad this dealer who doesn’t even, last I checked, even had a slaughter contract anymore.

[luvmytbs]

Hilarious. Someone is still claiming Moore ships to slaughter when “his” plant (LPN in Quebec) has been shut down for some time and he doesn’t have a contract with anyone else.
And Canadian plants now require a six months hold on all U.S. horses.

Someone must have “popped a bottle” in the middle of the night from the looks of the posts. LOL

[Charanga2011]

I think people who want to rescue should focus on saving horses BEFORE they get to these places. Craigslist for one always has cheap horses who are very likely to end up in the slaughter and auction pipeline. Where they are at high risk for getting communicable diseases. A lot of people who rescue these auction and slaughter horses are NOT prepared for the thousands in vet bills that they inevitably will have if the horse gets strangles or EHV etc. Then what? Are they any better off?