More questions about barn building - plumbing & electricity

[HeyYouNags]

First, a mini-vent. The new barn is going up where the old barn was. The old barn has been halfway demolished, the nags are packed into the puny, crappy second barn for the time being, and it rained 1.5 inches yesterday, so everything is a disgusting, muddy mess. The beasties are not loving me right now.

Next questions for barn experts:
-Did you use a regular electrician to do your wiring, or did you find someone who knew something about horse barns? Did you have to plan it all out for them? And if so, do you have any words of wisdom?

-Same questions on plumbing. Did your plumber understand what you needed? And any words of wisom? The new barn will have a wash stall and hot water, plus 6 stalls and tackroom. How many water pumps will we need? I’m thinking just 1, plus the wash stall fixtures.

-Last question - what flooring do you use on your aisle and wash stall floor? I would looove to get rubber pavers, but they’re danged expensive. Considering that I’ve spent all my money before even getting plumbing and electricity, we may be living with a dirt aisle for a few months.

Thanks for any words of wisdom you can offer!

[HeyYouNags]

Good news at Nagville: The Amish are here! The Amish are here! Site prep was completed Friday, and Reuben and his sons were putting in posts when I left for work. He says we may at least have a frame with a roof by the end of the week.

I’d like to hear more about what type of light fixtures people are using, too. I like the idea of side-mounted light fixtures to minimize shadows. Ritzy, do you have the ceramic/glass dome/metal housing kind just in the center of stalls, or off-center?

And a mini book review… I got the barn building book mentioned earlier in this thread. It’s got some good info in it, but it’s short on details about lights and plumbing. It just covers general ideas similar to what posters have already said.

It is a good, thorough book overall, with lots of ideas. However, I think it would be a better resource for people who are early in the barn-planning process. Much of the good stuff in it is barn designs and layouts. It has ideas for setting up small (like 2 acre) farms, where to put paddocks, where to put the barn, etc. The book has ideas suitable for all kinds of climate/terrain across the country, as well. It was about $24 from amazon.

[Pat]

Dont have much time, couldn’t read the whole thing, forgive me if I repeat anyone…

Wires: run through conduit if possible. Mice love the coating on wires. Otherwise, try wire that’s rated to go under ground, we used it to rewire/replace a light under the advice of the home depot guy. He said it is often called “barn wire”

Floors: pavement is great!! doesn’t get slippery and seems to hold up well. My barn is only about 15 years old, but very badly maintained (I rent). Floor looks good tho… No poop stains, either.

Water: frost free hydrants where you can, heat tape where you cant. Or route faucets through the wall of a heated room Frozen pipes suck and are expensive. I once worked at a place who built an apartment over the barn. (uh, yah, for me) They failed to heat tape the septic line which froze and overflowed into some pony’s stall my first day. I went home the next morning. It was Vermont, and I figured that if they couldn’t get that right, I didn’t need to work for stupid people.

Outlets: Wet location boxes/covers for all, and put in twice as many as you think you need. GFI outlets ANYWHERE in the vacinity of water. Seriously, you never know. Also, one for each stall for fans if practical and if you use them. My boss did this eliminating the need for dangerous extention cords. You can also get these cool light switch covers that are water tight. They go right over the normal indoor kind and have big red switches that are easy to flick, even with fat gloves on.

And this may seem to be a no-brainer, but make sure the circuit panel is properly labled before the guy leaves. The barn I rent is a minor disaster, but it was built right in the first place, except for the circuit box. Had LOTS of fun trying to figure out which switch was which. URGH, for sure aleast once we were screwing around with that light we replaced while current was going through it. Very scary.

[buryinghill1]

Friends of mine gutted their huge old barn. Under all the cement aisle floors they laid tube heating ( http://www.wirsbo.com/main.php?pm=1&mm=1&sm=5&pc=homeowner/ho_mm1sm5.php ). Very expensive, but it is the most comfortable barn to work in - on any winter day. The stalls are asphalt with rubber mats. The heat in the floor (and grooming/washing areas) is fabulous.
Each stall has a bucket, and it’s own faucet (good).
Because it’s an old barn, you can’t get a tractor/spreader in it (bad).

[ladybug01]

I second putting the electrical into the conduit pipe and using barn wire.(rats like to chew wires) I just watched an electrical line short out in the barn,my horse was in the aisle at the time, throwing his head up because this was going on in front of him.I thought he threw his head up and hit the light bulb, he didn’t. The flashing was the wire shorting out, noisy too. Having lights at the side are much safer then in the middle of the aisle. Having fire extinguishers in the barn is another good thing.(there was not one there) luckily I did know where to shut off the power.
It is not my barn, and I have now been there long, and luckily the fire did go out quickly, it was only small. I am still shaking, posting emergency numbers and the address by the phone, even outside the building would help. To use my cell phone I have to stand outside the barn, having an address to look at while your brain goes numb helps. Unfortunatly there was no fire extinguisher there. I am going to carry one in my vehicle from now on. At least I will have one and know where it is. Go over safety procedures with staff and boarders,for fire, electrical panels, water shut off and check first aid kits. If anything someone else will not be in the same situation.

[Sparky_Boy]

How about Aisle lighting? Florescent? Where do you place the lights? How much is enough?

[cbv]

We also light aisle from sides, as well as into each stall…the aisle lights and stall lights are on different circuits so do not have to turn both on at same time. Outside lights also on separate circuit, as are outlets for fans.

My barn aisles and wash stall are asphalt. Less expensive than concrete. We have been relatively pleased with it. It is rough enough that slipping has not been a problem. I had worried that the heat here in VA might be an issue…that the asphalt might melt…but that has not occurred.

[kfildes]

I bought all my barn lights from Orion Lighting. They were highly recommended to me by my barn contractor. They have a round “stall light” and then the long flourescent ones that I have for the aisle and the wash stall.

My foundation is finally complete and we are adding the piping for faucets, drains, etc. and getting the backfilling completed this week. The barn is being delivered on Tuesday, the 22nd, so we are finally seeing light at the end of the tunnel!

Thanks for all the wonderful thoughts! I had my concrete in the wash stall recessed and the drain put in the rear (rather than the center) because of the wonderful advice from this thread.

I am still torn about concrete in the aisle vs. asphalt.

Sincerely:

Karen A. Fildes
Caer Avallach Farm - Breeders of Quality Hunter & Sport Ponies
www.cafarm.com
www.ponyworld.net

[Awkremmit]

Electrician-we used a contractor type to install the ‘box’ - we ran everything else ourselves.

Just a suggestion - if you can, it is really worth your while to put drains in at the base of your foundation. - we layed in pipe with holes, in a bed of gravel stone at the base of the foundation. Water coming off the roof or from where ever, drains in it and we never (touch wood) have a problem with water/damp in the stalls.

[buryinghill1]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HeyYouNags:
Good news at Nagville: The Amish are here! The Amish are here! .<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yeah, vell, by Friday they’ll be REALLY ripe and in need of their Saturday night baths! Good thing it’s vinter, ja?
Dome Lights on both sides of the aisle. Separate circuits so if you blow a breaker you still have lights. Dome light IN each stall so as to disturb sleep of only one…

[race_run_jump]

A quick second to the fly system - LOVE mine!! Also like the idea of a recessed wash stall - my stalls are about 5 inches lower than the aisle to keep bedding in - nevet thought of that for the wash stall - great idea! I have ceiling fans in each stall and frankly think that they are not worth the expense and hassle of keeping them clean - I still put up fans on the front of each stall in the summer. I now wish I had a nice ridge vent and a huge exhaust fan or a cupola or both… Next time, right?

[Pat]

HEY, LAURIE !!!

Where in Stockton are you? I take care of polo ponies in Stockton. (not Hisham and Barbie but nearby)

divagroom@juno.com

[Janet]

Erin,

Nancy was actually in Virginia before she moved west- she was the first editor of the CDCTA newsletter- so you and she made sort of mirror image migration.

I second the recommendation for her book.

[kfildes]

I was just out talking to the guys who are installing the well pump and water lines into my barn, and they offered another really great suggestion. When they installed the water lines, we put water into the tack room (into a water heater so we would have hot/cold water in the wash stall) but also wanted hydrants on either end of the barn just outside the aisle doors. We also want to add hydrants out to the pastures in the spring (as someone mentioned earlier) so we don’t need to run hoses everywhere.

Well … he installed the lines with switches (valves?) to turn off the separate areas of water line. So for example, if the hydrant on one end of the barn breaks, we can shut it down and still have water going to other areas of the barn. So we don’t loose the entire water system if anything starts to leak or break. In terms of cost addition it’s minimal since it is just a minor addition, but a great way to protect ourselves in the future.

Sincerely:

Karen A. Fildes
Caer Avallach Farm - Breeders of Quality Hunter & Sport Ponies
www.cafarm.com
www.ponyworld.net

[LCR]

Have you considered the Nelson heated waterers? I rehabbed an older barn, took everything down to the wood. It was a 12 stall barn, but in the first stall we brought in a small overhead bin, cut a hole in the haymow floor, and this hold 1 1/2 tons of grain. You can then buy in bulk, have it delivered etc. Rodent proof too!

In the stall on the other side, I completely insulated and drywalled this room, mainly for tack. It stays dry in summer and in winter we used one of the infared heaters on low & it keeps water from freezing. We put in four Nelson waterers, set between stalls, so they share. The plumber dug down 6 feet, ran water lines to all of the stalls and to outside hydrants. This comes up in the tack room and can be shut off individually. He also ran electricity outside, six feet under, to Nelson waterers in the paddocks. This is such a time saver and worth more then anything else, especially if you go through a bad winter–then it makes you a believer. We set the waterers in Bell flared sewer tile. They fit right in the top bell and horses are protected from the bottom part.

We used concrete for the aisle, packed limestone with rubber mats for the stalls. Our stalls have no bars or wire, but are open at the top. Horses visit across the wall and they love it. The walls are five & six inch oak boards set in a track and can be completely pulled out if need be. We have had absolutely no problem with this. Each stall has a dutch door and on one side the stalls have 30 foot runouts. If you can put on overhangs, do so, as it keeps your stalls dry.

We placed all of the electricity in conduit and used the florescent lights used in hog confinement buildings. They are very bright, have lexan covers and are reasonabale in price.

One other thing, we used regular shingles on the roof instead of metal. Its looks nice and keeps down on noise. You can see the building on our website. Good luck!

www.shagya-arabian.com

[mmaurer]

I would like to say that EVERY outlet should be GFI. Ask the electrian , if the first one from the pannel box is GFI then you can run the rest from it and they will all be GFI as well. Summer condinsation can cause a short clipping,plugging in a vacumn to do a damp horse, well the list goes on and on. (hubby is a journeyman electrian) outlets need to be out of reach of horses, far out of reach. Definately run it in conduit, and moisture proof boxes. Outside lights that come on at dusk and off at dawn…those are SOOO nice at night, and a three way switch at each end of the barn so you don’t have to walk the lenght of the barn in the dark because the switch is at the other end.

Leslie Maurer
Jump The Moon Sporthorses
Home of Echo Shea (arab sporthorse) and Outrageous Fortune(overo Pinto RPSI)
http://www.jtmsporthorses.com

[Wicky]

Haven’t built a barn, but I do have a comment. I am in a wonderful barn now, but there is an electrical outlet right in front of the mounting block, and something is plugged into it - it is SO tempting for my horse as I am teaching him to stand there patiently - he just wants to reach out to that dangling electrical wire and take a chomp!

So, make sure that whichever kind of electrician you get, he/she understands that there should be nothing chewable within reach of a horse!

[Sparky_Boy]

www.equinelighting.com

[Alagirl]

I think a regular electrician should be able to work a barn - building codes count, regardless.
Make sure to tell him though about the chewing habbits of the equines - run all the wire through conduit!

Water - same here, if the plummer has installed pipes in outside conditions, he should be fine - remember the deal about the frost! Busted pipes are a PITA, same as ripped off wateres and faucets, have plenty of shut-off valves through the intire barn! How many pumps you will need would depend (I would guess) where your water comes from, pressure and such, hash it over, but one ought to be fine - to much water preassure kills your gasgets in your appliences.

Floors…Wash stall would have to have concret, I would think it would be best for the aisle, too, but not as important. You can always upgrate to rubbermats and add more concrete as time goes on.

[kfildes]

Wasilida

That tumbled concrete sounds really interesting … I’ve never seen it though. Do you have any photos of what it looks like that you could share?

Thanks!

Sincerely:

Karen A. Fildes
Caer Avallach Farm - Breeders of Quality Hunter & Sport Ponies
www.cafarm.com
www.ponyworld.net