I have a draft cross mare, she has been riding in a French Link 6". She gets pinch marks on the inside of her mouth where her cheeks meet her lips. I debating on trying a straight bar (unjointed snaffle). Has anyone had this problem with their horses?
Horses can rub from a number of different things. Could be her mouth conformation (for example, smaller mouth that means the lips have to pull up more for the bit to hang where it should, which may cause more pinching/rubbing). Could be the bit–too wide, too narrow, too thick, too thin for her mouth. If it’s a loose ring, they can pinch if they don’t have guards of some type. Could be the rider–rough or unsteady hands. Mare just might not produce enough saliva, so the bit is constantly rubbing against dry skin and more prone to causing issues because of it.
Do you have a trainer or someone who could look at the mare and the bit and help evaluate why it is pinching? Otherwise, you could change bits all you want, but unless you stumble on the right solution by accident, you won’t necessarily solve the problem.
Sorry–I know this is not very specific advice, and maybe someone more experienced will be able to suggest things that tend to work for horses who rub. It’s just the times where I have seen it happen, it’s always been a different reason specific to that horse and that bit, and every solution has been different as well.
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If I’m understanding correctly, the rubs are inside her mouth, on the teeth side, not the outside where “normal” bit rubs/pinch marks would be seen?
If that’s the case, my guess would be something’s off about her teeth, and the bit is pushing her lips/cheeks against sharp edges and getting cut that way.
Two thoughts for why that might be:
- the bit is too narrow and pushing the cheeks/lips into the teeth simply by being in the mouth at all
or
- rider is not even/steady in their hands and “see sawing” (I’m assuming accidentally/unknowingly) and the sides of the bit are rubbing the horse’s face against their teeth
I know that for my pony, going from double jointed to unjointed didn’t go over well - too extreme of a change going from lots of movement to no movement. This created tension and actually caused rubbing to happen. Went back to a double jointed with a different cheekpiece (eggbutt to a baucher) and he’s much happier. I’m not saying to NOT try an unjointed bit, just saying it might be too much of a jump in action/feel. Try wrapping the joints in sealtex first to make it a bit less flexible and see if that makes any difference, would be my thought.
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What type of cheek is on the bit? Was it a fairly cheap bit or one of finer quality? Is there a little space between her lips and the cheeks or do they press into them? Being a cross I doubt that her mouth is wider than 6" but I guess it depends on what with and how big she is.
Basically, we need more information to give you more helpful advise.
I’d first check her teeth out. If that doesn’t help, I would try a fixed cheek piece, like an eggbutt or D-ring. If she seems to prefer the loosering, you can add rubber bit guards, though I’m not sure if you’re allowed to show in them…don’t know if that matters to you.
Reading Ceylon’s response…if the rubs are on the inside, I’d definitely look to teeth first, and if that’s ruled out, maybe try a different mouth piece…though I’ve never seen sores on the inside not related to teeth.
Sounds like a dental issue - she may need bit seats. A bit seat isn’t actually a place for the bit to rest on the teeth. It is a basically a curve placed on the first premolars that keep the cheek from being pinched when the bit has contact. Some horses have more flesh in their mouths than others. Drafts usually have quite a bit. Call a certified Dentist or a Veterinarian that is certified in Equine Dentistry. Being certified through the IAED or EDPA is one of the best ways to know the practitioner performs quality work. Veterinarians get on average 17 hours of equine dentistry (if that) during their program. Some states allow anyone to call themselves an equine dentist. Many horse owners have regular dental care performed on their horse, yet it isn’t quality work and they continue to have issues. Using a certified professional is the safest way to go.
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Check that the bit is not too large for her mouth. The fact that she is a draft cross does not mean that she automatically takes a 6" bit.
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Loose ring snaffles are well-known to be prone to pinching the cheeks and causing rubs/sores on the edge of the cheeks because the skin gets caught in the hole in the bit where the ring passes thru.
Sores INSIDE the mouth relate to dental issues and sharp points.
I’m having this same issue. He’s getting pinched inside his mouth on the both sides. I’ve tried multiple cheek pieces, mouthpieces and thicknesses. It only happens when he’s bitted and a thinner mouthpiece seems to be more comfortable. It’s worse in a flash when he can’t open his mouth enough. He’s been checked by 3 different dentists who say he’s completely balanced and they don’t see any abnormal. He does have bit seats. Any ideas??
I’d also add check the flash tension, if you ride with one. Too tight and it can squish the soft tissues in the mouth against the bit and any sharp spots on the teeth.
This is early damage. If I continue to ride her in a bit that pinches, this bruising turns into blisters.
When she is tranquilized for dental work, her inner cheeks hang down like a sheet. Most of the damage is self inflicted. She doesn’t like the bit on her tongue and sucks it back in her teeth then every time she gnashes or chews, she is pinching that redundant tissue between the bit and her teeth. I could not figure out why she was so fussy when she was younger. I first assumed it was me but my instructor didn’t think so and when she rode her, the behavior continued. Finally, after one particularly contentious lesson where she was really fussy and on the muscle I pried her lips back and was horrified. This had been going on for nearly a year. It took me over another year to find a bit that was more comfortable for her. She cannot wear a jointed bit. Anything jointed is that much easier for her to suck back to her teeth.
Double jointed is worse than single jointed.
I currently ride her in a PeeWee bit which unfortunately is not a legal bit but I am not showing at the moment and what works for her is what we go in. I can get away with a single jointed bit for a ride or two, then she is sore and the fussiness and tension return. She goes OK in a Myler mullen mouth but not nearly as softly as with the PeeWee but it gives me options if I get back to showing (I am on the shelf at the moment but am long reining or doing in-hand work in the bridle). Definitely a thinner bit. Thicker bits = more tongue pressure which she definitely doesn’t like. I train her with no noseband. Any snugness of the cavesson just pushes that fleshy tissue into her teeth. I have tried a Micklem bridle but she is kind of between sizes and they don’t fit right. I would like to try a PS of Sweden or an Antares cavesson but since I am not currently riding, haven’t bothered to spend the $$.
I have spent years trying to undo the damage. I am not sure “I” am a good enough rider that I can ever totally fix it. She is much better but very sensitive about her mouth. Straightness is key to getting the bit centered and her even in the connection. When she is straight, she is pretty quiet with her mouth.
Susan
Sent you a P the bit will be lower in the horse’s mouth and it may stop irritating the already sensitive skin. As a side bonus this will automatically make the bit feel like a wider bit in the horse’s mouth.
I have tried wider and smaller mouth pieces, with the same results. I have also tried the bit lower or higher also. She has a tiny tiny mouth, and very fleshy lips. I have tried D ring, full cheek, and snaffle in 12mm, 14mm and 16mm sizes.
I have tried all kinds of nosebands and bridles too, micklem, schockemohle, PS of sweden.
She is a strong mare, so regardless of how soft I try to be with my hand she requires a strong half halt every now and then.
I cant really figure out how she is pinching. My guess is the inner lip pulls back over her teeth, even with the bit spot and the teeth well filed down there.
Wondering if there is a bit that doesn’t give such a pull back action.
Hi Jealoushe.
I am still riding Kyra most of the time in the PeeWee. I did try a Neue Schule Turtle Tactio and that bit seems OK for her. She gets some pink in the fat spots but not much bruising and most of all, her behavior under saddle doesn’t deteriorate (tension, distraction then spooking). I have the TT on a PS of Sweden Nirak bridle and that combo seems acceptable to her. My friend rode her for the better part of 4 months last summer and she made a lot of improvement.
The TT is fairly thin over the tongue and it does “lock” when pressure is put on the reins. Out at the rings, I think it is 16mm. As I said, she seems pretty happy in it from what I saw when Nika rode her last summer.
I am just getting back into riding this Spring after months off due to foot surgery. I threw the PeeWee back on her (with no cavesson) as there is no showing in anytime in our future and I know it does not do any damage to her fat inner cheeks–especially as I am getting my riding mojo back. I will certainly keep the TT in our tool box so if I can get back to lessons and showing, I have something legal and most importantly…acceptable to her.
Susan
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We also did xrays and thought…maybe…there was an infection. Treated it and he kept somehow biting/pinching the insides. I put him in a soft Nathe loose ring on the flat and a Trust soft eggbutt for jumping and I haven’t had any issues since. Regular noseband, no flash or figure8. The mouthpieces are wide enough in the corners that the flesh doesn’t get caught. Good luck! It was so frustrating!!
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Thank you for chiming in ladies!! Appreciate it.
I found this thread as I am having the same issue with my draftcross mare. I started her in dressage as a six year old in a Boucher but then realized she loved jumping so we did a few fox hunts and jumped for about two years. She went fine in a full cheek Waterford but then due to some pedal osteosis on her right front we had to go back to dressage. The hoof is now healed, zero lameness thankfully!
The first year building her top line was fine with the Waterford. not legal so we went with a legal bomber happy tongue. She moved better for awhile in a Micklem bridle with a loose ring Herm Sprenger kk ultra but can’t use bit guards with the Micklem and the inside of the corner of her lip would get a tiny cut inside. I thought it was maybe due to her grazing muzzle, equine dentist couldn’t find anything. I have now tried every bit under the sun, had a bit fitter come she recommended a Stubben gold wing, she cut her lip on it, she cuts her lip now in every bit I have tried except this 6” pelham with a copper lozenge and curb chain but I can’t get her in consistent contact in it. I use bit butter and calmoseptine on her lips it will heal in three days. I went three months in a hackamore and she loved it. But not legal. Started her back in a 5 3/4” d-ring happy tongue and she cut her lip again. Went back to the Pelham with reins at the snaffle so it’s basically like a Boucher double joint with a curb chain and no cuts! But also not legal to show in. And also not ideal for collection and bending.
Tried the loose ring kk ultra again with bit guards and she got a cut again. Thinking she goes better in something with fixed cheek pieces. Next step is dentist again and going in the hackamore until I have an answer. She chews the bit and has teeth marks even close to the lozenge so I’m also thinking she hates the tongue pressure? She also pulls the bit up into her molars even a Mullen mouth. I have never had a horse with this issue. Her lips are very very fleshy. She is a Belgian draft x Dutch Harness cross. Don’t even get me started on getting a saddle to fit! At this point it’s all trial and error even with hiring bit fitter and vet and dental…no one has any answers. It’s been extremely frustrating. Thanks for any advice. You’re the only one I’ve found that explains what might be happening.
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