[QUOTE=NOMIOMI1;6003057]
I think MBM means further along… Like FURTHER along in training so yes at that level it will mean something…[/QUOTE]
I’m going to expose my ignorance here and ask for an example.
jointed snaffle are able to address each side of the mouth individually . an unbroken mouthpiece cant do that.
so anytime you touch one side it affects the other. this matters and is why snaffles are used.
[QUOTE=mbm;6003084]
jointed snaffle are able to address each side of the mouth individually . an unbroken mouthpiece cant do that.
so anytime you touch one side it affects the other. this matters and is why snaffles are used.[/QUOTE]
That isn’t what I was asking for.
what are you asking?
Give me specific incidents wherein a jointed bit becomes a deciding factor in the success of the request.
i did. a jointed but can address each side of the horse, individually.
ie: i can ask for flexion on one side and it does not affect the other side. that is the entire point of broken mouthed bits.
solid bits addresses the entire mouth - and why they can be used in single handed riding.
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As I said before, I have encountered no difficulty lifting a shoulder (just one) when I need to with a solid mouthpiece, the flexion follows. I was told that at some esoteric point in the training I would need a jointed bit to perform advanced movements. Now I’m doubly confused because I was under the impression that single handed riding only occurred at an advanced stage in the training.
[QUOTE=kinnip;6003122]
As I said before, I have encountered no difficulty lifting a shoulder (just one) when I need to with a solid mouthpiece, the flexion follows.[/QUOTE]
I’m so curious - how do you go about lifting one of your horses shoulders with the bit? Could you explain the action/aids for that?
i have never heard the term “lifting a shoulder” in a dressage sense, so i am not sure what you mean by that.
the 5 rein aids are of course part of standard theory - but i am not sure how the indirect rein of opposition = lifting a shoulder?
in the most basic sense a non jointed bit will affect the whole mouth - touch the bit on the left and you will also touch the right side - except opposite of what you asked in the left… this does not happen with a jointed bit.
i personally am not sure how you could teach bending, flexion, etc with a solid bit. but hey - that might just be my limitation.
as for one handed riding - yes, by the time the horse is that well trained (aka beyond GP) it should already know how to bend/flex/etc and it should do so “on its own” and via the seat.
horses that are learning need to have clear aids and a linked bit allows that clarity - this is why you use a bridoon with a curb in the upper levels - to address lateral bend, flexion etc.
i am sure someone else will be able to explain this more clearly.
I have heard the term “ride the shoulders up” by Natalie Lamping in an On The Levels video put out by the USDF!!!:yes:
to me the term addresses the wrong part of the horse 
we should be riding the haunches and not the shoulders
So many phrases seem to lose the real intent of what one is trying to accomplish it is wonderous that any horses manage to find their way while packing around your average dressage rider.
The spine of the horse should be parallel to the track of the movement. How you get there is a little tricky, but at least understand what it is you are trying to accomplish.
Riding the shoulders really muddys up the waters for me. Try showing your horse that you want him/her to keep the shoulders inside of the triangle that you should be creating between the bit, the left hip and the right hip.
Either tap him (do not smack him) or reach up with your boot and tap him over. It is so much easier than all that screwing around with the five different rein aids.
Do this after you have asked nicely with your leg on the girth.
Horse just needs to understand what you want.
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Yeah, I don’t know where this whole idea comes from. I guess it’s all in how you ride and train. I have no problems getting the right amount of fexion with my pony for her stage of training. Maybe she’s just smarter than most horses.
I’ll try and explain from my POV. When you use the indirect rein of opposition, which is what happens when you keep your shoulders parallel to the horse’s in lateral movements. It’s quite subtle, and not about pulling or manipulating the rein. It’s just a matter of positioning. This displaces the weight onto the outside lateral pair, and encourages the horse to rotate his spine, which lifts the inside shoulder and back, and causes the inside hip to drop.
the outside lateral pair
You lost me here … the outside pair ? Do you mean the outside fore and the outside hind at the same time? The outside pair is just that, the outside pair. I don’t understsnd how oyu can have an outside lateral pair. Maybe I am missing something.
Update!!
I have to admit that I am liking the way my guy is excepting the Mullen mouth bit…I did add a flash loosely fitted and it was even better yet. I was working on putting him in the outside rein and when I felt the connection, I let go of the inside rein and then as I got to A, I rode a 20m circlewith the ooutside rein only. Later I go to thinking about this thread and comments about not being able to use the reins indepenantly with this bit and wondered how then was it possible to confirm that he was indeed in the ouside rein by dropping the inside rein? Can anyone clearify that for me??? Thanks in advance!
i can steer my horses using one hand (including the baby) , but that doesn’t mean they are working into the outside rein at that moment.
just curious: does you guy work into both reins evenly most of the time?
[QUOTE=EasyStreet;6021840]
Later I go to thinking about this thread and comments about not being able to use the reins indepenantly with this bit and wondered how then was it possible to confirm that he was indeed in the ouside rein by dropping the inside rein? Can anyone clearify that for me??? Thanks in advance!;)[/QUOTE]
Try to take advice from internet strangers with a grain of salt.
If you want to explore the mechanics of using a mullen mouth, hang the bridle around your neck and place the bit in your hands, held together. Ask a friend to take up the reins and use them as they would on a horse. Feel the difference between left rein, right rein, and both reins.
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