Natural Horsemanship... grrr! *Rant, sorry*

Ugh, I have these boarders at my barn. They’re very nice and very willing to help out and do things and such. Anyway, they’re HUGE Parelli/Clinton Anderson fans and they run their horses around the ring with their sticks with plastic bags tied to the ends. I’m all for using plastic bags and tarps and scary things when training but this just tops it all…

I was at the farm yesterday about to teach a riding lesson to a beginner on a horse who is half arab. Now, my half arab is NOT dangerous in any sense, takes the word ‘Whoa’ absolutely literally and is a saint, however… he’s still half arab and can get excited. My boarders show up with their Clinton Anderson sticks and start waiving them around while walking to the pasture to get their horses. My half arab FREAKS and takes off running circles around his paddock while my student is standing there watching. She was on her way to catching him to tack him up for lesson. Anyway, he’s running, bucking, farting everywhere and the boarders and just beboping across the farm with their stinkin sticks!! Arg!

Well, the Arab calms down and she catches him and tacks him up. She rides, all is well with him and her.

After lesson I decide to catch my young gelding whom I have been working with for the last 4 months trying to put weight on (he was a rescue) and in the process of breaking. He lives with the boarders two horses in the big pasture. They’ve already caught their horses and are “playing” with them in the ring. All that Clinton Anderson stuff with the sticks, long ropes, games and such.

As a side note, I totally understand that the “Natural Horsemanship” stuff kinda makes sense. I understand the concepts behind it, but I have a different way of achieving the same results without the sticks.

Anyway, they’re swinging their ropes and bags and such and my horse who had come up to me at that point takes off. I stood patiently til he ran it out for a minute and he came back. But by then he’d figured out that I was going to work him and he stood within 5 feet of me, but wouldn’t let me get close enough to catch him.

The boarder came out into the field with me and said “Horse Catching One oh One” and I snapped back “I know how to catch horses, thanks.” That’s where I dropped the attitude and just sort of ignored his “I’ve seen Clinton Anderson catch a wild horse in a 35 acre field in 15 minutes” comments. GRRR!!!

Then he makes comments about Dressage as that’s what I’m going to be training my gelding to do. “Oh, you don’t want to put saddles on them until you can walk trot and canter bareback with a rope halter” “Dressage is so unnatural, you force the horse into that shape, force him to do tricks”

Where do Clinton Anderson, Chris Cox and Pat Parelli followers get off thinking that they know everything?? Just because you WATCH VIDEOS of people training doesn’t mean you know it!! You have to do it, nothing replaces time in the saddle! Two years of video watching versus 17 years of riding and training…

Oh and the boarder comments on how my horse hasn’t been put through the seven games so I shouldn’t be sitting on him at all! Oh, and my horse is a paint and has that traditional “crazy eye” due to the white scelera (sp?) around his eye and the guy says “Clinton Anderson would tell you to sell this horse immediately, he’s got the wild eye, he’ll never be a good horse.”

Wow, this is longer than I thought it’d be. Sorry! Thanks to those of you who continued to the end…

I definately feel better now.

I sympathize. People can be obnoxious idiots.

Fortunately, I don’t get people coming up to me to try to tell me how to do my business:
I have one of ‘those’ demeanors that tells anyone to “back on up outta my face, unless you want whatever you’re trying to sell me inserted where the sun doesn’t shine” :winkgrin:

[QUOTE=Equestryn;4214748]
Oh, and my horse is a paint and has that traditional “crazy eye” due to the white scelera (sp?) around his eye and the guy says “Clinton Anderson would tell you to sell this horse immediately, he’s got the wild eye, he’ll never be a good horse.”[/QUOTE]

Got a chuckle out of this one… I also have a Paint. I guess I know why she can be such a PITA now. :lol:

I know people that have been very successful with Natural Horsemanship, but it is not the ONLY way. I did a 2-day clinic with a Natural Horsemanship trainer and my mare really gave him a run for his money. They got into battles both days. My mare just doesn’t respond well to most Natural Horsemanship methods. She’s not a bad horse by any means either. It’s just that one size doesn’t fit all.

anybody that takes “others things” to the extreme…

has a problem. I have watched Anderson and Cox and have learned from them, BUT I don’t worship their concepts. I don’t like Parelli, he’s kinda a goof. And as a paint horse breeder I would have noticed if Anderson has something negative about paint horses, I have never heard him say anything similiar. Heck he prides himself with working with difficult horses and I have not seen one of them be a paint. He had a grulla mustang stud one time that made him work for his dollar, that was kinda fun BUT HE NEVER SAID A WORD about the stallion in a negative way, sounds like your boarder is just full of HIMSELF. One reason I have a sign in the tack up area of my barn that reads "MY BARN, MY RULES, NO EXCEPTIONS, GET OVER IT!!!. Maybe you should make one of your own!!

From the sounds of it, they are more into the Parelli cult then anything. With the 7 games and all.:lol: I don’t think Anderson has anything like that.
While there are some things that are useful from the NH, I don’t think it is the be all, end all. I take some things I have learned from Dennis Reis and used it with my own training technique.
I agree, some people take the NH way too far. Esp the Parelli crap. I have owned 2 Parelli trained horses. ALL of them were the most disrespectful horses I have ever owned. I have another Parelli trained horse here for training. I’m having to undo the Parelli, “I don’t have to” and " you are not suppose to make me" Parelli crap this horse knows.
So I feel for you!

Any training method can cause problems in the hands of inconsiderate people. “Desensitizing” one’s own horse should not be done with other horses around. :no:

Horselips, I need to take a class or something to get that kind of demeanor as well.

I don’t mind listening to other peoples methods and ideas, I feel it makes one more rounded to know of other methods. But to have a guy come out into my pasture while I’m catching MY horse and say “Horse Catching 101”… it was all I could do to keep my mouth shut.

I’ve noticed that Parelli and “Naturally” trained horses are the most disrespectful. They’re not very confident under saddle, they run you over on the ground. Arg…

When I see people advertise their horses as being “Parelli Level 2” or whatever, it means nothing to me. I know people who’ve tried promoting their horses “Oh! He’s Level 2 Parelli Trained!” I’m sorry… that’ means nothing…

erm, some of them are homegrown, no videos required. Had a guy out yesterday to try a gaited pony I’m selling. It was an impromptu visit, so he wasn’t dressed to ride, which is fine…but I’m not letting him on a saddled horse in river-shoes (some weird webbed looking Teva type shoes). Can he be ridden bareback? Yes, sure he can…so I ride the pony first bb, then hand him off to him. He proceeds to Take His Shoes Off. To ride BAREBACK? His wife asked him why he was barefoot on the mounting block. Something about having a better feel, really getting to use his body. WTH? So off he goes on this sainted pony, barefoot, bareback, with reins in a wad and held like driving reins. That pony dealt with it better than I ever guessed he would :lol: I think he was as confused as I was. Ended with him trying to coax this gaited saint into a canter, it wasn’t happening, LOL, just a hard pace and a confused little pony.

No video I’ve seen recommends barefeet to bond with ponies :lol::confused:

Is this your farm and this person boards at your house? Whata bummer. PIA people high maintenance people. Sounds like some rules need to be put in place. Your farm, your rules.

How about a rule like “no hocus-pocus, no presto-chango” in pastures or other common areas where non-majical horses are present’?

Also, maybe instruction in courtesy and manners? Like don’t bite the hand that feeds you; don’t bash my riding/training preference, and I won’t bash yours?

I don’t know what Level 2 Parelli Trained means either, but it translates to me as, “can’t be ridden under saddle. handler too scared to get on”.

Katarine, that is just plain funny!

he was barefoot on the mounting block. Something about having a better feel, really getting to use his body.

Me thinks he needed to intertwine the pony’s hair between his toes so he could stay on!

[QUOTE=Fantastic;4215166]
Is this your farm and this person boards at your house? Whata bummer. PIA people high maintenance people. Sounds like some rules need to be put in place. Your farm, your rules.

Also, maybe instruction in courtesy and manners? Like don’t bite the hand that feeds you; don’t bash my riding/training preference, and I won’t bash yours?

I don’t know what Level 2 Parelli Trained means either, but it translates to me as, “can’t be ridden under saddle. handler to scared to get on”.[/QUOTE]

It’s a farm I’m leasing and running.

No Presto-changeo in areas where non-magical horses are present. I almost died!!

LOL
You’re exactly right as to what Level 2 parelli trained translates to.

LOL

[QUOTE=Fantastic;4215166]

I don’t know what Level 2 Parelli Trained means either, but it translates to me as, “can’t be ridden under saddle. handler too scared to get on”.[/QUOTE]

:lol::lol::lol:

Love it!!

you should have told him

that he rides best with a rider that is buck naked…can’t get more NATURAL than that!!!
And then run and hide!!!

he was barefoot on the mounting block. Something about having a better feel, really getting to use his body.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE]that he rides best with a rider that is buck naked…can’t get more NATURAL than that!!!
And then run and hide!!!

Bwha-ha-ha! Buck naked, or butt naked? The butt naked suction cup effect! The only way to really be natural and one with your horse!

I’m sure you MUST realize that even racing TBs are started via Parelli, because otherwise they won’t run. They have a big carrot stick on a truck, and the truck is driven very fast,a head of the horses, outside the camera view, which is why you don’t see it on TV.

back in the day noobs were difficult to spot from a distance, now they carry bright orange indicators that they are noobs… i kinda appreciate the alert symbol so i know who to avoid :lol:

don’t bash my riding/training preference, and I won’t bash yours?

They really should adopt this attitude. The Parelli people at my barn were very vocal with their opinions about how others train. They hated dressage with a passion. They never said anything much to me, fortunately for them, they generally just ignored me. They did make a few comments to another boarder. It made for a very tense atmosphere on occasion. I don’t understand why they can’t just keep their carrot training to themselves.

It was a very happy day when they moved out. You can’t believe how peaceful our barn is now. :yes:

[QUOTE=FancyFree;4215427]
They really should adopt this attitude. The Parelli people at my barn were very vocal with their opinions about how others train. They hated dressage with a passion. They never said anything much to me, fortunately for them, they generally just ignored me. They did make a few comments to another boarder. It made for a very tense atmosphere on occasion. I don’t understand why they can’t just keep their carrot training to themselves.

It was a very happy day when they moved out. You can’t believe how peaceful our barn is now. :yes:[/QUOTE]

I wonder how the Parelli people who left your barn feel about dressage now that Linda Parelli is a “dressage rider?”:winkgrin:

I think we can all agree that there are some natural horsemanship concepts that translate well to all disciplines… but I’m not about to make my training regime all parelli all the time (i really dislike him most of the natural horsemanship movement), and let’s face it, there are plenty of legitimate training methods out there, you can use individual techniques to get desired results. But really I feel the whole bally-hoo is overrated.

Love watching some of those “Weekend Wanna-beTrainer Wonders” doing their routines. Kinda-sorta fits in the mode of “Ye Ole Drugstore Cowboys.” Takes more knowledge, and longer than a short term expensive course, and props, to develop a good Trainer.