Need Advice - Marriage & Horses...can it be done?

[Czar]

It’s been a while since I’ve been here but I need advice from people who get it aka…horse people.

My sister & her husband have been married for 4 years and have struggled basically the entire time.

A bit of back story:

My family is in the horse business - hunter/jumpers…my mother started when she was a young twenty-something and all of my sisters and I have been involved over the years, some more than others. I did a brief stint as a pro before I realized it wasn’t for me. My hubby and I also decided to start a family and once I started having children, I realized how difficult it was to balance family life and horses - at the level we were involved in…not just riding.

Anyway, now my younger sister is manager of the barn and her marriage, which has never been great, is on the rocks…again. I just don’t know what to say anymore. My brother-in-law is a great, great guy…my sister is a loving, generous person but something is just not working.

My sister works insane hours - she owns 3 or 4 horses (plus shows about 3 or 4 more) and to keep them showing and cared for, she not only does all her riding, showing, coaching, show set-up, mucking stalls, farm chores etc…she also braids/clips etc… The show season starts in April and continues until the end of November and that doesn’t include away trips in the winter or winter schooling series. She gets up at 3:30 in the morning probably 5 days a week for at least 6 months of the year and works like a dog until after feeding time when she stumbles home and falls asleep on the couch at 7:30. So needless to say, she doesn’t really have time to go out and do stuff like “normal” couples would do.

The business does alright. We are in an area with not a ton of big money clients, but steady mid-income families (though we are seeing a decrease in this bracket at the shows). However, this is with her working as she does. They still struggle to make ends meet (the business) so when she has the opportunity to teach an extra lesson or clip another horse, she takes it.

She loves what she does though she does get burnt out by about Sept. of every year. She was already working in this role when she met and married her husband though the family did recently buy property and build a new facility which has increased the workload and expenses. My brother-in-law has always been supportive but the years are taking a toll on him. He barely ever sees his wife and basically lives like a bachelor. My sister is more at home mucking stalls than cooking a dinner so even when she is home, she doesn’t do any “wifey” type things. For the first couple of years, he would go to the farm to spend time with her but as he was asked to do more and more (there is always more work than there are hours of the day), he stopped doing that. He explained that he had just spent a long day at work and didn’t want to spend the hours of his evening doing more and more. He is a person that needs downtime whereas my sister has so much energy it’s uncanny!

He is starting to think of having a family and I think he is realizing that it would be impossible with my sister working the way she does. I’ve asked her - she does want kids; I don’t think she knows how to slow down though, especially when my parents are counting on her as well (which is a whole 'nother can of worms that I will not open right now).

She loves her husband and he is crazy over her but they’re just tired out I guess. Tired of trying to live two different lives that don’t match up. I don’t think either of them deceived the other - they were young when they got married and didn’t realize that they wanted different things. I think my sister started to suspect they were incompatible shortly after they married and she has struggled with that and maybe she is using the workload as an excuse not to have to deal with that?? I don’t know. I’m trying to remember what it was like for me when I was in her shoes but I don’t think the business was as big then and my husband didn’t want to spend time with me :lol: What I mean is, he was fine on his own which actually wasn’t healthy for us and it did take time to learn again how to do life together after doing our own thing for many years.

Oh gosh…this is really long but I just don’t know what to say to either of them anymore. I understand his feelings but I also know how much it takes to make it in this business. On one hand, I feel like he knew what he was marrying into and on the other, I just feel so bad for him :no:

[kdow]

I don’t know how much you can do, really. It is up to them to sort things out. Possibly you could take on some of the business responsibilities if that is an option for you, to give her more choice in how she spends her time, but even then if she wants to stay busy she will.

What they really need to do is talk to each other about desires and expectations and then see if they can come up with a compromise plan that works for both of them. For example, re wifey things - I get that he works and doesn’t want to come work at the barn when he is done, but perhaps he could take on cooking dinner for both of them? That way they could at least have time together sitting down for a meal most nights before she crashes from exhaustion. Those kinds of things that are perhaps not traditional, but would give them time together.

(I do think that if you can, arranging for at least some business help might provide more options for them - it is easier to deal with a partner being crazy busy most of the time if you know every two weeks you will have a day just the two of you, or can look forward to a week “vacation” in the slow season even if you just stay home because of the cost of actually going somewhere. It just gives you times when you know you will be able to reconnect and spend time together.)

[jetsmom]

Encourage them both to go to marriage counselling. It can help clarify things for them, and help them set priorities, and decide whether they want to do what they need to do to be happy in their marriage.

[IronwoodFarm]

^This.

The issues really are not about horses; any job that requires 16 hours of work a day would be a problem.

[fordtraktor]

Ditto the above. And this is one of the problems with family businesses. However, here I think your family needs to seriously think about how they can step in and ramp some of the workload off your sister because she is going to burnout and then who is going to be the future of the business? That your parents can actually probably do something about.

The workflow can’t look like that if she has kids, that is for certain. Your family is dooming this marriage in some ways, because what man could envision bringing kids into that situation? That CAN be worked on. If she wants it.

But make sure first; they might have just grown apart and be done. Maybe she doesn’t want it to be fixed. It happens in 50%+ of marriages, especially young marriages, and it doesn’t mean they are bad people or did anything wrong. It just happens.

[Czar]

We’ve recently moved overseas so I cannot physically help; just be a listening ear and shoulder <figuratively> to cry on.

It’s really down to her and my parents. My other sister also had a family and couldn’t keep up with the demands of the profession and raising a family. My brother hates horses b/c of how it ruled our lives growing up.

They’ve done the counselling thing and it did help. I was actually completely blown away when she told me this week that they had been living apart for almost a week now. I thought they were past this - they had been doing so well.

My first reaction was to tell her that she needs to take a step back from the whole thing but the reality is, she can’t. She basically runs the whole shebang with my mom doing the bookwork and occasional lesson and my dad doing the grunt work i.e.:fiddling around on the tractor after he gets home from his “real” job. The only clear option I can see is to re-evaluate what she really wants in life. If this is truly it, I just don’t see how she can be married…to anyone. She’s married to her work.

[JCS]

Well, for her own sanity she needs to find a way to cut back. No one can be expected to work so much. You said she has 3 or 4 horses of her own–are these sale horses, lesson horses, or some other type of income-producing animals? If not, she should cut back to 1 or 2 personal horses at most. Save those stalls for boarders or training clients. Hire a $10-an-hour person to clean stalls so she has more time for the big money work–training and showing–rather than the grunt work. She needs to find a way to make the business more profitable while allowing herself to work less–that is, she needs to work smarter, not harder. If she is running herself into the ground and the business is barely hanging on, it may be time to let it go altogether.

[HungarianHippo]

The phrase “but she can’t” made me twitchy. Yes she can-- she’s choosing to run the family business. Maybe you guys wind it down-- you don’t owe it to your mother to run her business at the expense of your happiness if life.
If your sister wants to make a different choice, like you did, she can and should.

Bottom line, I would tell her that everything she’s doing is a choice. Make different choices if you want a different outcome.

[Kwill]

If they have been to counseling, and it didn’t really work (obviously), then it may be time to just say goodbye. No one can do it all – especially on that schedule.

It really does seem like the business is in trouble, and perhaps it’s time to let that go and find another source of income. Or restructure the business, as others have suggested.

Small business is inherently stressful and takes up all of your time. Each thing you do is critical to your income. It doesn’t leave much time for relationships, or at least you have to work fairly hard at maintaining one.

I wish your sister the best, and hope it works out for your family.

[Coanteen]

[QUOTE=IronwoodFarm;7728289]

The issues really are not about horses; any job that requires 16 hours of work a day would be a problem.[/QUOTE]

@Czar;7728357

She basically runs the whole shebang with my mom doing the bookwork and occasional lesson and my dad doing the grunt work i.e.:fiddling around on the tractor after he gets home from his “real” job. The only clear option I can see is to re-evaluate what she really wants in life. If this is truly it, I just don’t see how she can be married…to anyone. She’s married to her work.

Is this business profitable enough to hire help? To allow her to only ride/teach? It’s a bit much calling it a “family business” when mom does some book-keeping and dad tools around on his tractor a bit, while sis works 16-hour days.

She “wants” children…ok. How? She knows she won’t be able to work 16-hour days with children, she won’t be able to work at all, probably, for a while during the days. Or only minimally.
So is the business profitable enough to hire help during…however long it’ll take? Is it profitable enough for daycare, or a daytime nanny? What of the clients, does sis have an assistant trainer or working students who can take over riding/showing duties, or will she essentially have to shut down her business and hope to get new clients when she restarts it again?

Is there any active planning for any of the above?

There are marriages where one partner works a lot. But for that to work out when baby-planning they need to make enough that the other partner either stays home, or there’s money for a nanny, or something like that. Does her business make enough that she, after a brief recovery from birth, can afford all household bills so hubby can be the SAHP, or is the business merely supporting itself and hubby is supporting the household?

[Zuri]

Is there any way she can hire help? She simply can’t do it all without something suffering or being neglected. Is the reason why she wants to or does it all to escape, or control or avoid?

It must be hard being so far away from her and the rest of your family. I hope everything works out for the best.

[danceronice]

[QUOTE=HungarianHippo;7728495]
The phrase “but she can’t” made me twitchy. Yes she can-- she’s choosing to run the family business. Maybe you guys wind it down-- you don’t owe it to your mother to run her business at the expense of your happiness if life.
If your sister wants to make a different choice, like you did, she can and should.

Bottom line, I would tell her that everything she’s doing is a choice. Make different choices if you want a different outcome.[/QUOTE]

Yep. I think the husband’s probably in the more reasonable position here, frankly-I don’t think it’s out of line or it means that horses and marriage don’t mix to want his wife to not be working twelve+ hours a day and gone to winter shows and off every weekend. Presumably he wanted to see her occasionally when they were married. And I don’t think it’s really fair to say “Well, he can cook dinner at night so they have time together”–for a start, is that going to work if he gets home at six and she’s passed out by seven-thirty? And how long could anyone keep that up? I had a schedule working 50-70 hour weeks for about a year and even with them being mostly desk jobs to varying degrees, I was physically and mentally burnt out after a year. But I don’t see how you can really do much more than point that sort of thing out.

[Cindyg]

Such a sad thread. No real advice, just, I’m sorry. It’s not easy for horse husbands. I have one of my own.

[kdow]

[QUOTE=danceronice;7728981]
And I don’t think it’s really fair to say “Well, he can cook dinner at night so they have time together”–for a start, is that going to work if he gets home at six and she’s passed out by seven-thirty? And how long could anyone keep that up?[/QUOTE]

I wasn’t saying he had to do that, I was using it as example of a less “traditional” division of household labor that, depending on exact situations in the family, might work out better. Sometimes people get a bit caught up in what the husband and wife are “supposed” to do and don’t think outside the box. If his schedule didn’t mesh with making dinner or he’s awful at cooking, obviously that might not be a workable idea. But it might. With the time thing - if he got home at six and was preparing dinner and did something quick (~30 min to get it on the table, there’s tons of cookbooks full of those sorts of things even if they aren’t super tasty) then they’d at least have from whenever she got home (if she gets home while he is cooking she can help or at least hang out in the kitchen and be social, potentially) and during dinner to spend some time together. If she only got home when dinner hit the table then that’d still be an hour every day before she crashed at 7:30, which is not ideal but may still be better than what they have going on now.

That said, I think all OP can actively change is possibly stuff to do with the family business. If it is a family business then even though she is not actively working there, presumably she can have some input or suggestions into how things are going and being up topics like hiring help or scaling back, etc.

The relationship is between the two of them and they have to sort it out or not on their own. If a specific problem is mentioned, then OP can offer suggestions to solve it that they may not have thought of, but you can’t live anyone else’s life for them.

(I do think it sounds like the husband is not unreasonable in being unhappy with how things are. You usually marry someone because you want to spend time with them. I wonder how much things have changed since they were dating - as it sounds now I can’t imagine her having time or energy to date let alone develop a serious relationship.)

[Czar]

[QUOTE=Zuri;7728964]
Is there any way she can hire help? She simply can’t do it all without something suffering or being neglected. Is the reason why she wants to or does it all to escape, or control or avoid?

It must be hard being so far away from her and the rest of your family. I hope everything works out for the best.[/QUOTE]

Thank you; that is very kind.

Thanks to all for the suggestions - the business does fine I guess. Every horse person I know that runs a show barn works extremely hard. Come to think of it, I don’t know too many that are even married…let alone to someone outside of the industry.

They do have hired help but for the size of the operation, they should have an assistant trainer which I don’t think they can afford. They make some dumb business moves based more on want and less on need. It’s no one’s fault but their own but trying to point that out just makes the pointer look like the bad guy sometimes sigh

The more I think about what’s happening though - the more I believe that she is using the horses as an escape & not so much that they are causing the problem. The thing is that no man would be willing to be in a marriage like that so I’m afraid for her that she will let this marriage fall apart only to realize that her own lifestyle is a part of why marriage has been so hard for her. I suspect she believes that she simply married the wrong person b/c she was young & they are different. But maybe with someone else she would be willing to give up more - I don’t know. The only thing I know for sure is that she can not have a family with a schedule like she has.

Anyway, I do wish there was more I could do but I know it’s her choice to make. Thanks again.

[IronwoodFarm]

The only person who can change her situation is your sister. I know horse professionals and they manage to work hard and have a life.

[PiedPiper]

It comes down to prioritizing. Marriages take commitment, prioritizing and compromising. Is she doing any of that? She needs to nurture the marriage or it will pass her by.

The horse industry is a hard one, definitely but it can be done. She really needs to figure out what she wants for her life and how she sees it unfolding.

[babecakes]

That endless energy -she’s using herself up physically during her prime. THAT will come back to smack her, hard, later in life. Everyone in life needs to learn and choose to work smart. At this point as much as she is carrying she is giving it away. None of it will matter later after all these people have come and gone. And when you give up your life for this it can end up becoming lonely later.

She needs to hire help and ‘run a business.’

[Coanteen]

So is sis does all her own mucking and barn chores…what does the hired help do exactly?

And I wouldn’t say a business is doing ok if sis jumps at the chance to do an extra clip or braining job. Taking on an extra horse to train/sell, or being busy enough to hire an assistant trainer - that’s doing well. Running herself ragged to clip one more horse is just treading water.

[Trakehner]

They don’t have a marriage and really should get a divorce.

“That’s so mean etc. etc. etc.”

So, how is she a wife? How is she a partner in this relationship? It doesn’t sound like she really wants to be married and to include a spouse in her life. Why should he want to hang around at a barn being her unpaid assistant? He’s got a full time job, commutes, works etc…he doesn’t want to be a stall mucker or groom.

“But if he loved her he’d be happy to spend any time with her” the mewing goes. “He used to come to the barn”…yep, he did, maybe he hoped if he helped her finish earlier she might come home and be a partner…sounds like that didn’t happen, so why feed the behaviour?

Sorry, but he deserves a partner and wife, she needs to be on her own with no responsibility to anyone else. Once she’s older, alone and wondering who will be there for her…she may realize what she gave up. He’s already sacrificed and needs to find someone to be happy with.

A very sad situation, but she is being selfish.