New "L" Graduate Continuing Education Requrements

[Beentheredonethat]

I just got this. I don’t know if I agree with this. Yes, it is good to always continue education, but eight hours a year? If not, what are they going to do?

For me, really? I graduated with honors over 20 years ago. I continue to ride, show and bring horses up the levels. I also work full time. I really don’t judge much, and don’t like to. I like to do it for fun once in awhile. Maybe I’ll do it more when I retire. I think my feedback as a person bringing up horses continually and showing continually is a lot more worthwhile than someone just doing this. I like to scribe and do this when I can, but I can’t see mr having the time and money to do this.

Dear L Graduate,

For many years, the L Program Committee has felt that continuing education for L graduates is very important and would like to ensure that L Graduates, including L Graduates with distinction, stay up to date with current judging criteria. Since L graduates are used to judge schooling shows, it is important that they stay current in order to give proper comments to riders competing at the grass-root level.

During the L Program Committee meeting at the 2016 Adequan®/USDF Annual Convention, the committee voted to require L Graduates to complete eight hours of judge-specific continuing education per year. The USDF Executive Board approved the proposal, which will go into effect starting April 2017. Graduates, who meet the continuing education requirements, will be listed on the USDF website.

Any continuing education that falls into the category below, and was completed after January 1, 2017, should be reported to lprogram@usdf.org. When reporting, please make sure to use the L Program Education Continuing Education report form, which is attached and available on the USDF website (for scribing please use the USDF Scribing form).

The types of continuing education listed below will meet the criteria:

Scribing with R or S judges as required in the L Program
USDF CE program
USEF Judges Program
Convention L Education sessions
Convention meetings (L Open Meeting, Judge Closed and Open, and Freestyle Open Meeting)
Auditing or participating in Part 1 of L program
Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Kindest Regards,

Sharon Vander Ziel
USDF Senior Education Coordinator
United States Dressage Federation
4051 Iron Works Parkway,
Lexington, KY 40511
859. 971. 7039
svanderziel@usdf.org

[MysticOakRanch]

I got this too. Another L who passed with distinction about 12 years ago, and am considering just giving up the USDF listing :o The way they list, the non-distinction people show up first anyway, unless a person knows to re-sort the listing different from the default. No one ever finds me through USDF website!

AND we have to take a “Safety course” and pass a test. I am going to try to pass the test without reading the 8 hours of materials. Pretty sure I’ve been through enough safety training to last a few lifetimes…

I figure I scribe enough to meet my hours there - but that means I have to remember to drag a piece of paper around and get it signed. AND it means other Ls in the area will want to scribe -not because they enjoy and are good at scribing, but because they need their hours.

Especially annoying for those of us on the West Coast, because (here I go again), USDF doesn’t offer many educational programs on this side of the country.

All in all, it is a minor annoyance. Fa la la la la…

[TwoRoads]

I think the course you are talking about is not really about safety so much as its about inappropriate coach/student interactions, bullying, that kind of thing.

[netg]

I started just thinking in general terms and it seems silly if you’re not specifically talking about people who are working to become actual judges.

Then I started thinking about local L grads, and it seems even more silly. One example is a trainer who took the training to learn and use it in her instruction. She will judge one or two schooling shows a year, but is teaching when scribing could be an option. Her students are at most shows. She shouldn’t be scribing at those times.

Other people did the L program just for themselves and their own knowledge - they won’t care about being on the site anyway.

Theoretically, the idea of continuing education is great… but it should be through an educational program available to all, not just those in Wellington. Dressage in this country will be better if there is more education everywhere.

[Libby2563]

Hmm. I recently completed Part 1 of the L program and have been thinking hard about whether to continue to Part 2. I’m glad to know this now before I commit to Part 2, as I do think it’s a significant time commitment. For horse professionals, the least onerous option (scribing) is still likely to conflict with their showing or their students’, or at the least cost a full day of income. For amateurs like me, it’s yet another CE burden to add to our day jobs. Training at my full-time job is during work hours but for my part-time job (attorney), I have to pay for 12 hours a year, and that usually also requires taking time off from my full-time job. So I already feel tapped out on the CE front. And many of us ammy grads are unlikely to ever judge enough to make it worthwhile anyway.

During the L program, several of the instructors aired concerns about “older” judges not conforming to the current standards and criteria. However, that seems like something that could be addressed less onerously with quality online training. They have an excellent library of video clips to demonstrate what they are looking for at different scores, for movements and collectives alike. Annual online training would be palatable to me.

Finally, I very much doubt that any of the CE options listed would truly change how a person judges, especially if they’ve been doing it for a long time.

[MissAriel]

While I get and appreciate the desire to keep judges current and trained to maintain the quality of judging at shows, it is like anything else - the devil is in the details. Too many training requirements, and you lose capable people with limited time, but too little training and you run the risk of chaotic judging.

I feel like the on-line option would be a great choice. It makes a more level playing field for candidates/grads with geographical/time/money limitations. There is also the benefit that all the candidates/grads would have access to the same information and the same rides so there could potentially be more consistency.

I am no where near to being a judge, and I show in a limited way (but I hope to do more as my horse and I get more time together) but I do go to shows primarily for the feedback from the judges, so it is important to me that those score sheets have some relevant, constructive and accurate comments that can help me assess our work.

To all of you who put the time, effort and money into graduating from the programs and judging - Thank you, we couldn’t do it without you!!

[SendenHorse]

I like the idea of an “updates” webanair or online video series.

[yaya]

I wonder if they also sent this letter to those currently in the L program? (Doubt it, since it is addressed to graduates.)

Those in the program now need to know of the new expectations after they finish. As with the poster above, it may change whether they go on to Part 2.

[ktedressage]

I’ve approached those in USDF about online programs and they immediately shot it down saying that the faculty believes that participants won’t get the same experience as they would in real life. During Part 1 (which I just finished and WAS about to start Part 2) we watched tons of video clips and the faculty read from a powerpoint. Why oh why could that not be done via Skype?? Why can’t continuing education be done in the same way??

Unfortunately, I will have to drop out. As a professional running her own (full) training facility, I cannot possibly afford to leave any more than I already am. I had already nixed plans for Wellington and cut the show schedule in order to make the scribing and sitting requirements, as well as flying out three times a year for the sessions (for myself and a student to scribe for me since the local GMO will not help us find scribes and we are not allowed to “poach”). The amount of money they expect is insane.

[ktedressage]

[QUOTE=yaya;8983144]
I wonder if they also sent this letter to those currently in the L program? (Doubt it, since it is addressed to graduates.)

Those in the program now need to know of the new expectations after they finish. As with the poster above, it may change whether they go on to Part 2.[/QUOTE]

I didn’t get it. If my student hadn’t sent me the link to this thread, I wouldn’t have known. The cut off date to drop out and still get your deposit back is January 1st…

[poltroon]

I think the idea of having people complete continuing education regularly is worthy. I might be satisfied with 8 hours every two years.

That it can be satisfied with a day of scribing is fairly “reasonable,” in that most people who really would need to keep current could do this, and there are benefits throughout the system to this kind of scribing. A professional trainer would certainly benefit from this day as well - and can I say to all of you, IME, professional trainers who do not make time and resources to do some kind of continuing professional education cheat both themselves and their students.

But, I also think that the organization should invest in an online program of some sort that will satisfy the need. It can be set up to be fairly interactive, if there’s worry that people will cheat it, and if what you’re trying to convey is changes to rules and practices, it will be much more uniform and effective at that than a day of scribing.

People in remote/rural areas are the people most in need of the most qualified L program graduates and instructors they can get, and they are the people who will have the most trouble finding time and money to attend faraway sessions. The online systems are a significant benefit.

I urge the decisionmakers at USDF to try out some online training - just try a class or two and see how it works. Coursera offers many free classes, including a good one on Equine Nutrition.

Another option could be that you could do the online training maybe only every other or every third year, that the others would have to be one of the in-person options. That would still create more options for everyone.

[netg]

As a resident of a region which goes from Mexico to Canada, I agree about the benefits of online training.

I say that as an area which currently has an L program ongoing.

I absolutely agree that instructors should have continuing education. However, I consider riding with and auditing clinicians to be FAR more important than scribing. My trainer hosts clinics and spends as much of the time as he can watching when he isn’t riding in it, and asks us about what we were taught to try to incorporate it into our lessons as appropriate. He also has gone to see me at two other clinics he didn’t host, and used ideas from those clinics in our work. So he is always growing and listens to/respects others whose training methods mesh with his. He’s had clients go to clinics where the lesson was what not to do as well, unfortunately, but even that can be learning experiences. The point being - for instructors, the requirements are different than for a judge.

To me, ongoing L grad education should be only for a certain status for judging schooling shows or for eligibility for training to be an actual judge, which it appears this is really intended for. However, if you’re going to go there - scribing doesn’t seem nearly as effective as an online training in which you are actually watching a video and give comments/score does. Scribing you frequently don’t even get to look up, and there is no control over what horses you see. Many times a pre-made video can be more valuable if you want to refresh specific ideas in training.

Of course, there is still the problem of many dressage riders around the country being in rural areas which don’t get high speed internet - and I still believe USDF/USEF need to get a program of CDs by mail going for those of us who can’t get high speed at home. I do so very much on my phone, but using the online resources/videos is limited for me.

[MysticOakRanch]

[QUOTE=ktedressage;8983170]
I’ve approached those in USDF about online programs and they immediately shot it down saying that the faculty believes that participants won’t get the same experience as they would in real life. During Part 1 (which I just finished and WAS about to start Part 2) we watched tons of video clips and the faculty read from a powerpoint. Why oh why could that not be done via Skype?? Why can’t continuing education be done in the same way??

Unfortunately, I will have to drop out. As a professional running her own (full) training facility, I cannot possibly afford to leave any more than I already am. I had already nixed plans for Wellington and cut the show schedule in order to make the scribing and sitting requirements, as well as flying out three times a year for the sessions (for myself and a student to scribe for me since the local GMO will not help us find scribes and we are not allowed to “poach”). The amount of money they expect is insane.[/QUOTE]

I’m sorry you had a bad experience with the L Program - I have to say, I thought the program was a wonderful educational program. I went through it (Parts 1 and 2) many years ago, and just recently organized and hosted a Part 1 and 2 because I really was impressed with the quality of the teaching! In both the program I went through, and the more recent one I organized, there was TONS of discussion - the videos really just inspired the discussion. We also used a lot of real horses and real riders (and as an organizer, let me tell you, that makes it a MONSTER to organize). I only had 2 people drop out of the program (out of 28), and had a few come from other L Programs to make up sessions they had missed.

I understand the time commitment - but that isn’t the “fault” of the program - it is outlined pretty well on USDF’s website. Not only is it 3 weekends of education, and 3 weekends of testing, there is homework and LOTS of reading, as well as sitting and scribing required to go through the program. It is a huge commitment. But everyone I know who has gone through it really felt it was one of USDF’s better programs. OTOH, since it is locally organized and hosted, the quality partly depends on how much the organizer puts into it.

I think this added requirement is a little bit silly, but not a huge issue (because we CAN just scribe one day/year and make the requirement), but I don’t want to distract from the quality of the overall program!

And I think the discussion and real life scenarios really make this a program that needs to be experienced in a group setting. I believe MANY of USDF’s educational programs could be done by video, but I think L and Trainer Certification really need to occur “live and in person” to maintain the quality of the program. There is SO much interaction and group discussion, and this really doesn’t work well with on-line workshops.

I teach workshops as a professional, and have a pretty good idea of what does, and doesn’t work this way. A competitor tried to do one of “my” workshops as an online workshop - at half the price (easy to do when you record it once, no travel, no materials to print), and it was a failure. There is something to say for interaction and instructor/student contact.

Now, I just started going through the newly required “Safe Sport” program which is on-line and it is AWFUL. Totally unrelated to equestrian sports, and especially to anything we (who sit in the judge’s box) will be involved in. Ugh. I’m not sure I will survive that course:lol: 10 minutes into it, I changed focus back to my (rather boring) research project!

[evenstar]

My thinking is rather like Poltroon’s in that I think that 8 hours every two years would be more reasonable and still meet the stated aim of keeping the L graduates current.

And I can sort of see that, since so many schooling shows use L graduates almost exclusively, it would have some value.

But I looked at the list of acceptable CE and I think it’s far too narrow. They need to revisit allowing for on line training. And perhaps also develop some seminars specifically for CE purposes that can be held in various locations, so that people don’t have to travel too far to get to them.

And the CE training needs to not be ridiculously expensive!

I have a feeling that a few years down the road the USDF is going to be lamenting the decrease in L program participants and wondering where the next generation of judges is going to come from.

[poltroon]

I think MysticOakRanch is right in terms of the initial program - the L certification itself is best done in person. I have been fortunate to audit some of these sessions and I did appreciate them. If you’re going to start up the L training, travel and interacting with others both in the sessions and out is a valuable part of the process. (Recording them, and making them available for audit online, though, I think would be valuable to the rest of the membership, especially those who don’t happen to live 15 minutes from LAEC, as I did then.)

However, for the continuing education, I think we could make a quality online system that is either solo or that creates and facilitates group discussion. An online webinar does not need to be just a lecture - people can ask questions with voice or via text, and discussions can happen this way - ie you could have live online seminars. The tools are getting better all the time, and even if someone in a rural area doesn’t have high speed internet at home, most areas have a place you can get to (like a coworking space, or if you don’t need to talk, Starbucks ) that does have internet. This is a landscape that is changing month by month in terms of options.

I work remotely; our team has a practice of group-learning skillshares that someone in the group gives once a week on a topic of interest. We conduct these via Google Hangouts, which is a free tool up to a certain number of participants, and still affordable past that. I also regularly view webinars in my technical area, where you can participate live and be part of the Q&A, or recorded, where you listen to both the presenter and the Q&A. There is a learning curve to working with them, but I find them substantially rewarding. It gives me so much more access to specialized topics that as a motivated self-learner, I really appreciate them. And people who have listened to my presentations seem to retain the information and appreciate them too.

[mjhco]

Our GMO has required L program graduates to keep up with continuing education in order to judge our GMO shows. Our GMO offers continuing education usually during January. And it is usually very well attended by L Program grads and others who are interested in this education.

As a competitor I appreciate it when those judging, TD’ing, and managing keep up with their education and remain up to date with all the changes that occur year after year.

[mjhco]

duplicate

[joiedevie99]

As a lawyer, I’m used to Continuing Ed requirements. NY requires us to do our required hours in person for the first cycle (2 years). After that, all hours can be done online. It’s really quite an easy thing to do. The systems already exist - and USDF already runs the programs. They simply video tape them and place them on the site. You log in to the site, play the video, and the video asks you to verify that you are still watching every 10 minutes or so until it’s over. Alternatively, you can have a short quiz at the end.

[Beentheredonethat]

Interesting discussion. I like the idea of webinar options. It’s not a huge issue for me, but I can see depending on where you are in the country, it could be a major issue.

I scribe when I have a chance usually a few times a year, so I can get the hours in that way, but I can see where this could be a huge issue for some people. If you are showing and teaching and don’t live where there are a lot of shows, there are no opportunities to do that.

I think they should also include showing experience. I think a great tool for being a better judge is to be judged all of the time. We really want to encourage riders who are regularly doing it to be judges. (You can always tell judges who don’t ride much.)

Perhaps we should email Sharon with our ideas and concerns, or link this thread? They should really be getting feedback from the people this is affecting.

What’s the safety thing? Is that a new L program thing? I’m sure we probably did something 20 years ago, but it certainly wasn’t big and dramatic.

[yaya]

Our area has two recognized shows a year. Otherwise, the closest shows are 4,5, or 6 hours away. So a professional having done the L program would either have to give up a day of showing and coaching students (who don’t travel to shows) in one of only two “home shows”, or give up a couple of days of training/lessons to travel to/from an “away show” to scribe, plus pay travel/hotel to boot.

We are not like the east or west coasts that have shows every weekend, so it would be hard to “just go scribe for a day”. Every other year would make it easier to take, but online would be better still.

Or it could be a combo - say one out of three years has to be something “live”.