next step up bit for barrel racing

[kbdb32]

I currently ride my mare at home in a French link copper roller eggbutt snaffle and she goes fine in it (sometimes a little heavy but not often)

she is being started on the barrel pattern soon and im trying to decide if I want to use a different bit for patterning.

ive tried a single jointed jr cowhorse and she rides sorta decent in it but she does through her head and gape her mouth at it sometimes (I have soft hands but she does this whenever I take up the slightest contact) I really like the lift and bend that this bit offers when turning the barrel but she just doesn’t like it so I need to find something else.

Do I really need to use a different bit? I like the idea of having a competition bit and a schooling bit but all other bits seem to harsh for her. I could try using her snaffle for both but to me it seems like the snaffle wouldn’t provide as much lift and shoulder control as a shanked or gag bit would.

so basically im asking:

1. would a snaffle work just as well to provide the same lift and shoulder and hip control/
2. does having a “competition bit” and a “schooling bit” really matter?
3. what would be a good step up from her current snaffle but isnt as harsh or isnt similar to the jr cowhorse?

[paulaedwina]

My trainer runs 1D in a snaffle.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2811/9032536975_56f96d659d_b.jpg

https://media.licdn.com/mpr/mpr/shrinknp_400_400/p/1/005/0a7/31c/3753d80.jpg

Paula

[beau159]

[QUOTE=kbdb32;8275500]

1. would a snaffle work just as well to provide the same lift and shoulder and hip control[/QUOTE]

Sure. Just depends on the individual horse. For some it will; for others it won’t.

It’s all about using the best bit for the job. Doesn’t always mean it needs to be a harsher bit; just a better fit.

And remember: Your seat and legs need to be doing the work too! They are what are really going to control the horse’s body.

[QUOTE=kbdb32;8275500]
2. does having a “competition bit” and a “schooling bit” really matter?[/QUOTE]

Depends on your personal preference and your horse.

I myself kind of like having different bits for different events, as I feel it is just another cue I can give my horse for them to understand what I am expecting them to do.

But with that said, you could use the same bit for both. Use whatever is going to work for your horse.

@kbdb32;8275500

3. what would be a good step up from her current snaffle but isnt as harsh or isnt similar to the jr cowhorse? [/QUOTE]

Are you having any problems with the snaffle?

If not, why do you want to change?

I’m currently training my 4-year-old for hunter classes (with low hunter hack jumps) and barrel racing. I use a O-ring snaffle bit for both, with a dogbone center. Right now, he’s doing well with both. I plan on keeping him in a snaffle for barrels, until he tells me he needs something otherwise. Unfortunately, he’s out with an injury for the rest of the season, but at his last race he finally place in the 4D. I was so happy with him.
(Just because I"m a photo freak, here’s my cute lil guy!)

If you feel like you need something different, try a Jr. Cowhorse that has a dogbone center, rather than just a single joint. For myself personally, I prefer bits that have 2 joints instead of 1.

And on that note, just because you find a bit that works for now … doesn’t mean that will be the one they stay in! I just switched my finished gelding from a Jr. Cowhorse (with dogbone center) to a Little S Hackamore. He seems happier in it, so we’ll go with that for now.

[QUOTE=paulaedwina;8275521]My trainer runs 1D in a snaffle.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2811/9032536975_56f96d659d_b.jpg

https://media.licdn.com/mpr/mpr/shrinknp_400_400/p/1/005/0a7/31c/3753d80.jpg

IMO, it’s not really a snaffle when it’s a combination bit. What your trainer is riding in is probably actually a gag bit, similar to this.

If it works, it works. But that’s not a snaffle.

THIS is a 1D barrel horse being ran in a snaffle.

[paulaedwina]

No, it’s a snaffle. Remember -I ride with her at her barn. It’s a snaffle.

Thanks,

Paula

[beau159]

[QUOTE=paulaedwina;8278592]
No, it’s a snaffle. Remember -I ride with her at her barn. It’s a snaffle.

Thanks,

Paula [/QUOTE]

No. It is not a snaffle.

She might call it a snaffle, but it is not a snaffle.

This is a snaffle.

This is what your trainer is using, or something similar to it. There’s a degree of gag and leverage with it.

They are not the same.

I’ve heard people call this a snaffle bit, and of course, that isn’t a snaffle either.

Just because you call it the wrong name, does not make it so.

[paulaedwina]

I do know what a snaffle looks like, Beau. Thanks. She runs in a snaffle. I ride my horse in a French link snaffle. Now I’m at the barn with her, you’re on the interwebs, not at the barn with us…

Paula

[beau159]

Well then I guess I’ll let everyone know that snaffle bits have nosebands on them, since apparently I’m wrong.

[paulaedwina]

You’re a real smartass, Beau. I bet you win friends and influence people alot.

Paua

[cnm161]

[QUOTE=paulaedwina;8279070]
You’re a real smartass, Beau. I bet you win friends and influence people alot.

Paua[/QUOTE]

The mouthpiece may be a snaffle, but if there are other parts of the bit (noseband, shanks, etc) that are integrated with/attached to the bit (as it looks in the picture), you’re out of snaffle territory.

ETA: apparently the quote changed. Originally said something about snaffles with nosebands, I promise.

[paulaedwina]

I have deleted all my posts about my trainer and I riding in snaffles. I am sure we are both deluded and I bow to Beau’s superior information.

Paula

[beau159]

[QUOTE=cnm161;8279077]

ETA: apparently the quote changed. Originally said something about snaffles with nosebands, I promise.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the quote though. I see she deleted that post here before I could see it, as well as deleted all her other posts on this thread (thank goodness for quotes!) She also deleted another post on another thread, but I saw it first.

No Paula I’m not a smart@ss. I’m just CORRECT when it comes to the matter in question. To be honest, if I went looking a barrel racing trainer and they told me they ran their horse in a snaffle and then showed me what they thought was a snaffle, I’d be walking the other way and not wasting my time with them.

Just because a bit has a broken mouthpiece, does not make it a snaffle. The picture you posted of your trainer using a “snaffle bit” is not a snaffle bit. It’s a combination bit. So no, you DON’T know what a snaffle bit looks like. (As you said in another post that you now deleted.)

[paulaedwina]

I deleted my posts in both threads because I had chimed in to the OP’s threads as another English rider trying out Western games purely for fun and enjoyment, and the threads have become not-fun and not-enjoyable. I’m not hiding anything, just walking away.

Paula

[Belmont]

Do you HAVE to change bits? No.

If you want, you can give a Sweet 6 a try. A ton of barrel racers use them as “step up” bits. They have a little bit of a gag action and curb pressure, but it isn’t a ton.

http://www.tackroominc.com/reinsman-sweet-iron-mouth-ring-p-9447.html?gclid=Cj0KEQjw0tCuBRDIjJ_Mlb6zzpQBEiQAyjCoBvJscOeycKXQmx-YJc93Q8MrtcL3Qu3zhqO5n3iJEiIaAn-D8P8HAQ

I’ve used it on many horses back in my “training” day, before I decided being an ammy was the good life. I’ve had great responses with it!

Honestly, if you have control and your horse works well in the snaffle… Why not just keep it?

[Bluey]

One basic way to look at bits is to remember, traditionally, a snaffle is a bit with direct contact with the rider’s hands.

A curb is a bit with leverage thru shanks.

A gag is a bit that puts pressure thru the side cheeks into the poll.

There are many combinations of those also, gags with shanks, curbs that also have direct action.

Now, any one of those can have all kinds of mouth pieces, a snaffle can be mullen mouth with a single curved bar, can be hinged in the middle, the traditional snaffles are that, can have extra bits in the middle, lozenges or links of all kinds, some with knobs, or the mouthpiece be a chain.

As long as you have direct contact, without leverage, with the mouth, then it is a snaffle, or if a combination bit, whatever it may be with snaffle action to it when the reins are set in the direct mouth to hand ring.

Now, any one bit can also have an added nosepiece, some western bits for colts do.

So, it is not so simple and many catalogs call bits whatever they want, so you can’t go by them, when they call a tom thumb, clearly a leverage bit, a snaffle, when it is not one at all.

Hope that helped.

[DJohn]

Do western people ride in elevator bits?

An elevator is essentially both a snaffle and a shank. If you use it on the first ring, it’s a snaffle. If you use it on the second (or third) it’s a shank.

[MidnightWriter]

[QUOTE=DJohn;8281687]
Do western people ride in elevator bits?

An elevator is essentially both a snaffle and a shank. If you use it on the first ring, it’s a snaffle. If you use it on the second (or third) it’s a shank.[/QUOTE]

Not necessarily. If it has a smaller ring above the main ring (where the mouthpiece and the reins go) then it has some leverage and is not a snaffle. It is more like a kimberwick. Which is a type of pelham. Which is not a snaffle.

[DJohn]

True, MW. I never thought of the part that attaches to the cheek pieces. Technically, it is still a leverage bit because of that. You’re right!