Nu Schule bits?

[Draftmare]

@alibi_18

Your bit is hanging too low. You probably have a tendancy of putting her bits too low for that particular horse. Or you should, for a while, use a ‘‘spoon’’ to prevent this problem. It should have been corrected as soon as it appeared because now, it became a vice.

There is no such thing as majikal bits. It’s the way you ride and the way the bridle/bit fit in the horse’s mouth.

** Feeling heavier is a GOOD thing. Yanking the reins out of your hands could be a GOOD thing. She might be trying to go into contact and you are releasing it. What you think is yanking might just be the beginning of establishing real contact. If she’s able to yank them off, you are not strong enough in your core. So it is your riding who’s not correct right now. A horse who’s beginning to take contact will be heavier for a certain period of time, you want that… and then with time and muscling, the weight will shift… If you are expecting a really light contact, you might be riding front to back.**

I have about a wrinkle and a half right now, going to put it up tomorrow to a solid two wrinkles and see how that goes. And it wasn’t just reaching down for contact, it was forcefully yanking so she could put her nose on the ground, and then resistance to me gathering the reins back up when I was done taking a walk break on a long rein. It was also more of a heavy/dragging/getting on the forehand than what she’s been doing in the other bit.

[alibi_18]

@Draftmare

I have about a wrinkle and a half right now, going to put it up tomorrow to a solid two wrinkles and see how that goes.

Forget the “wrinkle rule”, just put the bit where it belongs, where she can’t put her tongue over.

Your mare might “fight” a tad (feeling heavier and/or less responsive), she’s been allowed to for a long time. It will take a few sessions or more.

And it wasn’t just reaching down for contact, it was forcefully yanking so she could put her nose on the ground, and then resistance to me gathering the reins back up when I was done taking a walk break on a long rein. It was also more of a heavy/dragging/getting on the forehand than what she’s been doing in the other bit.

Yes, horses do that when they first experience real contact, when they are given something to make contact to.

You’ve probably been riding her off/behind the contact for so long, it’s just normal she doesn’t know what’s going on now, and you’re letting go of the reins. If she feels heavy, add legs. If she yanks the reins, add legs.
Don’t ever yank back or shake the reins, it would only go agains’t what you are aiming for; a soft and steady contact. Just add legs.

[Draftmare]

I put the bit up quite a bit higher, and she still had her tongue over it almost instantly. https://imgur.com/a/Dct8Y

I had a jump lesson last night, so I can’t say if she was really better, worse, or indifferent as I tend to not ask anything of her other than a couple of half halts before a fence. I don’t think it really helped her lift her shoulders any more than her rubber french link. We have been struggling with the left lead a lot lately, and it seemed about the same rate of getting the right one vs getting the wrong one. Going to give it one more ride, then possibly see about exchanging it for the next size down, see if that helps at all.

Last night I took a really good look at her mouth, and it just seems like with a bit in there, there isn’t enough room for her tongue.

[Dr_Doolittle]

That bit still looks low to me - in spite of the wrinkles! Just her head/mouth conformation?

How frustrating

I hope others have some more suggestions…(the spoon bit, for example?)

[joiedevie99]

@Dr. Doolittle I had the same thought. It’s also hard for me to tell given her coloring whether the noseband could move up too. The old rule of two fingers below the end of the checkbone doesn’t always hold with the new giant nosebands. Two of my bridles fit best only one finger below the bone.

How much space does she have between where the bit is currently sitting and the first molar?

[alibi_18]

@Draftmare

I put the bit up quite a bit higher, and she still had her tongue over it almost instantly. https://imgur.com/a/Dct8Y

Because the bit is still too low in that picture! It needs to be brought up 2 holes on each side. No wonder she could put her tongue over before if it was even lower!

The noseband seems to be sitting a bit low to my taste, it should be way closer to her cheek bone. Like the way it is now, despite not being tight, it seems right on the smooth sensitive part of her nose, which you don’t want as it could obstruct her airways.

[Foxglove]

Is this Sydney? Sorry, Draftmare, you are going to have to do better than this fairy tale about a horse not linking a bit. The fact is, I’ve met Sydney and she’s about the most wonderful, perfect horse anyone could dream about --can’t imagine her putting her tongue over a bit --unless she’s just doing it to have fun with YOU because she doesn’t get enough attention at home. (FYI --tongue in cheek here --(or over the bit) --I’ve met Draftmare and the impossibly wonderful Sydney and can’t conceive of such a good horse doing anything wrong!)

[Dressagelvr]

The most important thing with this kind of a month is a thin bit. There simply isn’t room for more and she will be more comfortable with that.

I can’t believe the tack rep told you that the bit would lift the shoulders. Only correct riding along a correct systematic training pyramid can do that.

[Draftmare]

@Dressagelvr

The most important thing with this kind of a month is a thin bit. There simply isn’t room for more and she will be more comfortable with that.

I can’t believe the tack rep told you that the bit would lift the shoulders. Only correct riding along a correct systematic training pyramid can do that.

Well the website itself says that this bit can help lift the forehand, so I don’t think it is a far thought jump to think that that means it would help lift the shoulders.

[Draftmare]

@alibi_18

Because the bit is still too low in that picture! It needs to be brought up 2 holes on each side. No wonder she could put her tongue over before if it was even lower!

The noseband seems to be sitting a bit low to my taste, it should be way closer to her cheek bone. Like the way it is now, despite not being tight, it seems right on the smooth sensitive part of her nose, which you don’t want as it could obstruct her airways.

Unfortunately she needs a draft sized noseband, but I have yet to find a draft sized bridle, or anything really, that is made of quality leather. So we have to do with a warmblood sized noseband on the last hole. If I put it up any higher I wouldn’t be able to buckle it. She needs horse sized cheek pieces, warmblood crown and browband, and draft sized noseband.

[Posting_Trot]

She’s such a cute horse. What is her breeding?

[joiedevie99]

@Draftmare I had one of those! Our solution was to take the warmblood crank noseband and replace the leather strap that connects the noseband part to the chin pad with a longer one. It worked great.

[Draftmare]

@joiedevie99

@Draftmare I had one of those! Our solution was to take the warmblood crank noseband and replace the leather strap that connects the noseband part to the chin pad with a longer one. It worked great.

Where did you get yours?! I had the same thought, but I haven’t been able to find any longer crank straps.

[Draftmare]

@Posting Trot

She’s such a cute horse. What is her breeding?

Thanks! She is Belgian draft x Appaloosa.

[joiedevie99]

@Draftmare I think it came from Jerry’s Harness Shop, but I know Charlie Tota carries them, as does Dressage Extensions. You’ll probably have to take yours off to measure it since the oversize varies so much from brand to brand. If you buy some keepers to add, you can just use a flash strap as well.

[alibi_18]

@Draftmare

Unfortunately she needs a draft sized noseband, but I have yet to find a draft sized bridle, or anything really, that is made of quality leather. So we have to do with a warmblood sized noseband on the last hole. If I put it up any higher I wouldn’t be able to buckle it. She needs horse sized cheek pieces, warmblood crown and browband, and draft sized noseband.

But if it doesn’t fit, it doesn’t fit.
I truly understand your struggle, but you have a problem and this is not helping.
Removing the whole noseband would be better than having it fitted low like that.

At worst, bring your bridle to a good cobbler/saddle repair person, and have the noseband extended with added pieces of leather.

You seem to have room to up the side cheeks.

[outerbanks77]

@Tumbleweed

My horse used to put his tongue over the bit before I could even get him into the arena! I tried NS bits, mylers with low wide ports, high ports, a leather bit, a tongue depressor- nothing worked. Then I got a WTP (winning tongue plate) bit with the paddle on it. I was able to ride him and teach him the basics. Then a friend suggested I try a Boucher french link with a figure 8 noseband. VOILA! Success. He stilll would put his tongue over it every so often, but it happened less and less. I put it up a hole at shows and now I don’t even have to do that. A year later, he will only do it once or twice a year. Hope you find your magic bullet!

I was also wondering about putting her in a drop or figure 8 noseband, at least temporarily, along with a thin bit.

Have you tried a mullen mouth on her? It seems like something without a joint would be harder to get the tongue over.

My appy mare hated the verbinend, but was happy in the NS Tranz, which has less angulation to the mouth pieces.

[Draftmare]

@outerbanks77

I was also wondering about putting her in a drop or figure 8 noseband, at least temporarily, along with a thin bit.

Have you tried a mullen mouth on her? It seems like something without a joint would be harder to get the tongue over.

My appy mare hated the verbinend, but was happy in the NS Tranz, which has less angulation to the mouth pieces.

I tried a Nathe bit on her, and had zero brakes in it. She’s not a strong horse, or a runaway, her favorite gait is whoa, but in that bit she basically did what she pleased.

I have tried a Micklem on her, and use to ride in a flash, but neither really did much for us. She’s not sticking her tongue out, or crossing her jaw, just putting her tongue over.

[Posting_Trot]

Maybe you’ve already tried this, but it might be worth trying a baucher bit with a french link or lozenge. The only difficulty will be finding one that is thin enough for her mouth. But a lot of horses really prefer a baucher.

This bit looks like it might be what I was thinking of:

http://cotswoldsport.co.uk/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65_88&products_id=502

[csaper58]

@joiedevie99

@Draftmare I think it came from Jerry’s Harness Shop, but I know Charlie Tota carries them, as does Dressage Extensions. You’ll probably have to take yours off to measure it since the oversize varies so much from brand to brand. If you buy some keepers to add, you can just use a flash strap as well.

@Draftmare Measure your current crank strap length and width, then drop by the Goodwill store and look thru the belts. I found a great quality XL black belt there. Only $3.00

I had the buckle on my strap swapped for the icky one on the belt, it works and looks great.

I agree the nose band needs to be raised. Be careful raising the bit to high in her mouth, the Verbindend is a unique shape bit and you don’t want it contacting her cheek teeth. I also think the thinner bit would be better.

Some horses for what ever reason just hate a bit pressing on their tongue. Those horses sometimes go better in a Worcester nose band. Saddly I don’t believe Worcester style nose bands are dressage legal.

http://www.harnessstuff.co.uk/zilco-…er-26186-p.asp is one example.