Older horse w/arthritis+ turnout in deep snow

[HoofHeartSoul]

I have an older gelding with quite advanced carpal arthritis and quite a bit of loss of range of motion (ROM) in his campus.

We had a huge snow fall this week where we got a 1.5 +/- feet of snow. I was snowed in.

Barn owner calls to tell me my horse is down in the snow.

When she turned him out he was looking like he was walking over the snow ok but then when she looked a short while later he was down ( he does roll still and sometimes like to ‘relax’ and stays down for several minutes before trying to get up, that is normal).

I have no idea how long she waited before she called me… or how long he was down before he got up.

She said he didn’t try to get up while she was watching but earlier I thought she did say he tried…

I have no idea if he went to roll,fell,etc or even if he truly couldn’t get up as she might have been overly cautious.

But by the time I got to the barn 20 -30 minutes later he was up and in his stall ( stall was open, he could walk in/out)

Anyway. I have been leaving him in the stall for fear of him doing similar again. Everytime I go to try it I chicken out qnd leave him in.

This is a horse that LOVES his turnout and is buddy sour now and will circle qnd spin in his stall, nonstop.

He is fretting so much being in that he isn’t really eating or drinking until his friends get brought in.

My friend volunteered her tiny snowblower to clear the paddock out.

Any of you have horses that need to stay in when the snow is deep? Any idea? Tips?

[2DogsFarm]

Could you take a day (weekend?) to go hang out & observe him in turnout.

Sounds like he brought himself in from this latest episode.
Could have just gone down for a rest, as you mentioned.
I’ve seen evidence* my 3 - aged 21, 18 & 7 - have slept in the snow, right outside their stalls. Stalls are open to them 24/7.
*depressions in the snow & lack of manure in stalls < 1 pile says not much time spent in

Did BO observe him get up? If so, was he struggling?
I’m assuming he’s on meds for the arthritis, maybe dose needs adjusting?

If he were mine, I’d want to know how much trouble he has getting up.
& I’d probably leave him out if he’s that unhappy kept in.

Hope you can get the answers you need.
{Hugs}

[Amy3996]

Horses can cast themselves in deep snow. They go down to roll as usual, and then find themselves stuck when they either can’t get all the way rolled over because they’re physically blocked by the depth of snow, or can’t get traction on the surface.

If he typically gets up and down without issue, I wouldn’t necessarily attribute it to the arthritis. If he worries when left in, is there a quiet buddy who could stay with him? Otherwise, snow blowing the area where he typically likes to roll might not be a bad idea.

[HoofHeartSoul]

I usually do watch him there have been a couple times he has had trouble getting up but that is when he usually lays on his arthritic side and he has learned really not to roll on that side. According to BO he was laying on his GOOD side.

Of course nobody saw how he got up, she asked her husband to watch him while she called me but apparently he didn’t understand because he was up by the time I got there and I asked him and he didn’t see him get up.

At first she said he turned his head q couple times like he wanted to get up ( but he does that) and then lays back down a bit ( like ok, Mayne just a couple more minutes…like me in the morning )

It is not uncommon for him to lay down for several minutes once down.

That is what is making me question if I am doing this for no reason. It would be different if I actually saw it happen.

It is supposed to be single digits here today, and he has been turning so much that he has actually made himself lamer. So now I am REALLY paranoid to turn him out in it.

He is on equioxx 57mg /daily

[NaturallyHappy]

I agree horses can get cast/stuck in deep snow. I’d take your friend up on blowing the snow out of the paddock, or at least reduce the depth so he can go out.
Deep snow is exhausting for anyone.

[2DogsFarm]

Bundle up, grab a shovel & dig out his paddock. Let him come out with you.
You get some exercise (says the woman who manhandled a loaded wheelbarrow around her drylot this chilly - 17F - morning to dump contents on some large ice patches), he gets out & you can see what happens if he goes down to roll.

Not the same, but my 25yo TB scared me & my trainer one Summer when, after a lesson, standing chatting with her, we watched him go down to roll, get halfway up & then seem to get stuck
He rocked back & forth, forelegs straight out in front, back end still down…
We both watched him, looked at each other, then watched as he got up… From giving his sweaty belly a good scratch

[McGurk]

I would do whatever you need to do for him to be able to go out.

While I understand being worried about him getting stuck/cast in the snow; staying in the stall 24/7 is NOT a good thing for an older arthritic horse. In this case, the cure may be worse than the disease.

[mscapen]

What size is the horse relative to height of snow. I mean that sort of makes a difference. Unless the snow is deeper than chest high, therefore a bit like swimming and you can no longer touch bottom, then I would not think he cast himself. He might have taken a moment to say to himself : boy this is different !!
If you feel worried, you do not even need to shovel it, just walk around and make him a path. If he is used to going outside he will be much happier there and he will trample the snow and it will be fine. Maybe put a friend with him, depending on size of paddock they will trample it enough to make it safe.

[HoofHeartSoul]

I need to mention that he gets group turnout and the 2 horses he goes out with are less than understanding of his condition. 1 will rub on him and lean on him ( full body weight) because he has bad stifles and has EPM/or else some neuro condition and the other basically pushes him all over because he is younger and more limber + he can. Especially around food.

He is 15.3. I am not there to watch him and the BO isn’t there all day and no offense to the barn , I don’t think anyone would notice until too late that he is down.

I have been asking for awhile for my guy to go out alone someplace but apparently there is no way for that to happen…

I wouldn’t have a problem if he were out by himself, I am a bit afraid the other will push him into a deep drift that has now hardened with the thaw then freeze.

And to remind. He has very restricted range of motion in his carpus.

[HoofHeartSoul]

@mscapen

What size is the horse relative to height of snow. I mean that sort of makes a difference. Unless the snow is deeper than chest high, therefore a bit like swimming and you can no longer touch bottom, then I would not think he cast himself. He might have taken a moment to say to himself : boy this is different !!
If you feel worried, you do not even need to shovel it, just walk around and make him a path. If he is used to going outside he will be much happier there and he will trample the snow and it will be fine. Maybe put a friend with him, depending on size of paddock they will trample it enough to make it safe.

I feel like this is what happened. It is not abnormal for him to lay in the ground still for several minutes after rolling as if to say " ahhhh what a load off! Just a couple more minutes…"

Not I feel like I kept him in and stressed him for no reason and he is actually limping worse with his knee making a new popping/clicking noise.

The BO scared me enough that I was deathly afraid of turning him out with his buddies as I thought they would push him into the deep drifts ( that have now stiffened and are hard to walk through) and he would be down again and nobody would notice.

[HoofHeartSoul]

@McGurk

I would do whatever you need to do for him to be able to go out.

While I understand being worried about him getting stuck/cast in the snow; staying in the stall 24/7 is NOT a good thing for an older arthritic horse. In this case, the cure may be worse than the disease.

This is what I would have normally done, but every boarder and the barn owner had me so paranoid I felt bad to put him out.

Also if the others horses push him into the snow drift I would feel bad as well. His leg hardly clears the ground and slightly drags the ground normally.

[skydy]

Can you find a different situation for him? Turn out with younger horses that make his life difficult is far from ideal, as you know.

[Fiesta01]

I would definitely take your friend up on the snow-blowing and, as also mentioned, go camp out and observe. Good luck. The old guys are always such a worry.

[McGurk]

Poor guy. It does get tough as they age finding a safe turnout situation for them.

I understand pressure from other boarders can be brutal; but you’re the only one who can advocate for your senior horse.

He needs to be out moving around. Most horsepeople should understand how critical it is for an older, arthritic horse to keep moving. If the other boarders anthropomorphize, and refer to stalls as bedrooms and rugs as coats or jammies, and believe horses are happier in their cozy bedrooms…well, you’ll have to ignore them and do what’s best for your horse anyway.

[HoofHeartSoul]

@McGurk

Poor guy. It does get tough as they age finding a safe turnout situation for them.

I understand pressure from other boarders can be brutal; but you’re the only one who can advocate for your senior horse.

He needs to be out moving around. Most horsepeople should understand how critical it is for an older, arthritic horse to keep moving. If the other boarders anthropomorphize, and refer to stalls as bedrooms and rugs as coats or jammies, and believe horses are happier in their cozy bedrooms…well, you’ll have to ignore them and do what’s best for your horse anyway

You must know my barn .
I feel so horrible for keeping him in his stall . hoping I didn’t do more damage in the long run, that was a lot of stress for him. He has cow patty manure now on top of being very very stiff and lame in that knee. Even with extra NSAIDS on board and doubled Joint supp. I ordered him some adequan.

I hope there are no long lasting effects!'he was in spinning and circling for 5.5 days!!! Not eating or drinking during the day while his buds were out at all. Very concerned at this point.

[Weezer]

I completely understand your concern but it sounds like he is far better off being out with his friends rather than stressing out in a stall all day. I tend to worry too much about worse case scenarios, so I am right there with you. But since you don’t actually know if he was struggling, I’d decide that it was nothing and let him go back out. The snow must be pretty well packed down in the main traffic areas by now. If there’s another big snowfall, keep an eye on him and maybe see if you can get him turned out with horses that won’t pick on him.

[Amy3996]

@HoofHeartSoul

He has cow patty manure now on top of being very very stiff and lame in that knee. Even with extra NSAIDS on board and doubled Joint supp. I ordered him some adequan.

Have you tried joint injections in that leg or discussed them with your vet? If the arthritis is that advanced, a systemic like Adequan is unlikely to make much impact.

[HoofHeartSoul]

@Weezer

I completely understand your concern but it sounds like he is far better off being out with his friends rather than stressing out in a stall all day. I tend to worry too much about worse case scenarios, so I am right there with you. But since you don’t actually know if he was struggling, I’d decide that it was nothing and let him go back out. The snow must be pretty well packed down in the main traffic areas by now. If there’s another big snowfall, keep an eye on him and maybe see if you can get him turned out with horses that won’t pick on him.

I usually turn him out in most any conditions. My first instinct was to just turn him oit and watch him and how he went along, but other boards,BO and even boyfriend put the fear of God in me and maybe me feel like I shouldn’t.

In hindsight I should have just listened to my intuition as I know how he would act in the stall not turned out. I feel like I made him so much worse.

As he is older he recovers more slowly as well.

My saying is “when in doubt turn him out” but I somehow forgot that.

Very few pasturemate/ pasture options at this barn sadly.

[HoofHeartSoul]

@Amy3996

Have you tried joint injections in that leg or discussed them with your vet? If the arthritis is that advanced, a systemic like Adequan is unlikely to make much impact.

Adequan actually does pretty good especially to get any active inflammation down for him.

He has had joint injections in the past but I was worried it would cover up pain and he would do more than he should.

[Weezer]

I completely understand giving in to the pressure from others! We learn as we go, and it is so hard to decide what’s best for a creature that doesn’t speak our language. I have a farm full of seniors right now and it seems like there are new health challenges every week. I have learned that things tend to work out better when I follow my instinct. That way, whatever happens, I will know I tried my best.